Why so many people want transformers 6 from michael bay?

Discussion in 'Transformers Movie Discussion' started by decepticon seeker, Feb 15, 2020.

  1. JohnStartop

    JohnStartop There can only be one.

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    People want it for all the abandoned concepts from TLK. That film was meant to kick off a whole cinematic universe that, while ambitious, was delusional. If they had any self-awareness about how bad their script was, or how little the public trusted them at that point, they'd have known that TLK would be their last and put all those abandoned concepts in for one big finale. I think Michael Bay's reluctant continuation of this franchise basically hardcoded the potential to turn each film since DotM into a finale. If slightly rewritten, DotM, AOE, and TLK could easily have been finales. They could've cut the multimillions of water, dirt, grass, and buildings exploding from the third act of TLK and spent the budget on those abandoned concepts instead. Who cares if the WWII, Headmasters, Beast Wars, or giant snake concepts weren't earned? You really think anyone would've pointed fingers at what didn't make sense in a Transformers film at that point? I would've paid to see robot gorilla out of context any day, or an Optimus/Megatron retcon for a gladiator origin story. Those concepts would've been awesome. There was no point saving it for later because they should've known their time was over. Now, it kinda leaves me wanting Transformers 6 just for those ideas, even if storywise they're bad. Maybe they should make a low-budget, animated, direct-to-video sequel to wrap it up.
     
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2020
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  2. SPLIT LIP

    SPLIT LIP Formerly SPLIT LIP

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    Ironically, the actual 90's series were the best written Transformers fiction we've ever had, and featured none of that. The actual 90's were less 90's than Bay's films. :lol 

    I really don't know why, besides laziness on Bay's part, they deliberately rolled back the whole "only high high explosives stand a chance of even annoying the Transformers" from TF1. It took three Autobots and a squad of soldiers to take out Brawl and it took like ten minutes of just nonstop abuse. The dude was a tank, literally and figuratively. Blackout was struck by an entire squad of F-22s (and a sabot round to his nuts lol) before going down, and Megatron took all that and didn't even die until the Allspark melted his insides. And people still complained they were too easily killed.

    Decepticons used to be almost unstoppable, and over time through contrivance and straight-up laziness their armour became tissue and they were dropping like flies.
     
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  3. rapid_fire

    rapid_fire TFW2005 Supporter

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    This really bothered me about ROTf how easily transformers were ripped apart and destroyed (Mudflap taking out Devastators face)
     
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  4. AutobotStrider

    AutobotStrider Well-Known Member

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    Most schools teach art and teach about artists so a lot of children would or should actually know who the artist is. I see you skipped over the Quill bedding different women to suit your response. No matter, I'll state some other things that make the MCU not suitable for children. Tony is shown as an alcoholic in Iron Man 2 irresponsibly taking the suit out in a party and talking about pissing himself. Steve Rogers kisses his niece. In Avengers Natasha is posing as a prostitute and Whedon then has the guys cup her mouth and make other comments. In Age of Ultron Tony says to Natasha " I hope you and Banner aren't playing hide the zucchini". A clear sexual joke that kids would pick up on given the oddity of the word or if they, most likely, know what a zucchini is. In Homecoming and Civil War it's constantly stated how hot aunt May is with Happy asking "what's she wearing." I can give more examples no problem.

    Macho has not become that at all. That's wrong.

    If anything, from Transformers 1 - 2 certainly showed Megan Fox as hot but she still absolutely functioned as an independent woman dumping the jock and then being a mechanic, playing a big part in helping Bee to take down Brawl and helped save Sam twice in ROTF. From DOTM onward the female characters were actually given high ranking important jobs/ college courses that helped to move the plot, the female in TLK was a college lecturer for example, you must have missed that.

    Bumblebee under performed, let's be realistic.

    Your opinion of TLK is probably hampered by that experience tbh and while it's unfortunate, to say the MCU is better and more suitable than Transformers is just incorrect and hypocritical.
     
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  5. Rodimal Rodimus

    Rodimal Rodimus Agent of Unit:E

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    It had a lower budget. Let's be realistic.
     
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  6. AutobotStrider

    AutobotStrider Well-Known Member

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    And still under performed realistically.
     
  7. cybeast

    cybeast Well-Known Member

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    To be fair, I don't know what "hide the zucchini" means :( 
     
  8. AutobotStrider

    AutobotStrider Well-Known Member

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  9. cybeast

    cybeast Well-Known Member

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  10. Rodimal Rodimus

    Rodimal Rodimus Agent of Unit:E

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    So how come they're already announcing a sequel?

    The Last Knight:
    Had a budget of about $217 million
    Grossed about $605 million
    About 2.7 times

    Bumblebee:
    Had a budget of about $102 million
    Grossed about $468 million
    About 4.5 times

    So you were saying, kid?

    Plus, it got better critical reception than any of the previous films. That should count for something, right?
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2020
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  11. AutobotStrider

    AutobotStrider Well-Known Member

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    Bumblebee Movie Was (Barely) A Box Office Success

    There's a good article detailing why.

    Bumblebee budget was actually 135 million, that they'll admit to, because companies like to undervalue. This factors in at least the same amount going into marketing but does not factor in the extremely late Cybertron scenes they did to rescue the movie.

    Bad movies get sequels all the time. Terminator got a sequel after a similar minor earning and the next absolutely bombed.

    BOP is being banded about getting a sequel even though that has failed outright.

    So kid, though you like to cling onto this minor profit, it shows the audience for this isn't really there and they missed the mark.

    Aladdin hit a billion with many controversies surrounding it as did Captain Marvel with the controversies that preceded and followed it. If this movie was as beloved by everyone you say, critics don't mean much in the grand scheme of things to anyone who can form their own opinion, then wouldn't it have succeeded way more than scraping to a minor profit if all these people were on board?
     
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  12. Rodimal Rodimus

    Rodimal Rodimus Agent of Unit:E

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    Then how come there's no TF6? Hmm?
     
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  13. Dotmshockwave

    Dotmshockwave Decepticon Assassin

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    To be completely honest, this is what I have been saying, most people besides tf super fans dont really give a crap about designs or if its more g1. But, you know, thats the end all be all on these forms. And i get it, michael bay wasn't good, but damn.
     
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  14. TheSoundwave

    TheSoundwave The Fox

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    That's a clickbait title. Bumblebee wasn't "barely" a box office success. It was said by Hasbro to be "solidly profitable". I'm inclined to believe them over some Joe who wrote an article on the Internet. I'm not saying to always blindly believe companies...but they wouldn't be leaning into Bumblebee as a direction for future movies if it were "barely a success".

    Bumblebee was always intended to be a smaller-scale movie. TLK was supposed to be a big Avengers-style movie, and Bumblebee was like Ant-Man. It was never supposed to make a billion dollars. It was just a nice refresher between two big movies (back when another was coming in 2019). And since they now seem to be leaning into the Bumblebee approach, I say Bumblebee went above and beyond what it was intended to do. I don't think that's "barely a success".

    And it's not fair to compare Bumblebee against stuff like Aladdin and Captain Marvel. Not making a billion isn't a sign of failure. By that logic the majority of movies that came out last year were "barely successes". Shazam made less than Bumblebee. Disney is something of an outlier in terms of making a billion dollars for almost everything they've put out recently. That's not going to happen with Transformers, and no one expects it to. No one's saying Bumblebee was some kind of smash hit. But Bumblebee more than doubled it's production cost. It made its money back and plenty to spare. That's solidly profitable. Anything else is clickbait or incorrect information. Don't believe it.
     
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  15. ChaosDonkey

    ChaosDonkey Lord Brain

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    It's like saying Tesla is not successful because they dont sell as many cars as GM.
     
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  16. G1Prowl

    G1Prowl Prick, apparently

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    You can't reason with the indoctrinated. To him, Bay 1-5 was the super special bestest and no amount of facts or data will change that.
     
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  17. TheSoundwave

    TheSoundwave The Fox

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    Bingo. Both are entirely different beasts and should be viewed in their own contexts.

    A billion dollars shouldn't be the gold standard for movies. I mean, I'd have loved it if Bumblebee had made a billion, but it wasn't needed for it to be considered a success. I don't think any of my top favorite movies have hit a billion dollars, and they were all considered profitable and were beloved by audiences. That includes stuff like Star Wars and Raiders of the Lost Ark.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    And a lot of these billion dollar Disney movies make that much money because they 'weaponize' nostalgia. I can't comment on Aladdin because I haven't seen the remake. But I'd argue something like Lion King 2019 has little artistic merit. It's just playing to an audience that kind of vaguely remembers Lion King, and is rewarding them for remembering it with an HD reskin. And Captain Marvel was pretty standard and non-offensive superhero fare, even with it's controversies. It was fine, but nothing too spectacular or memorable.

    (Obviously these are subjective opinions, but I don't think I've ever heard anyone list these among their favorite movies).

    I personally don't want Transformers movies like those. I'd much rather have something that doesn't crack a billion and comes from a place of love and passion and thinks a bit outside the box, even if it ultimately reaches a smaller audience. Appealing to the widest audience possible shouldn't be the end all be all of storytelling. There's nothing wrong with smaller movies, as long as they keep the budget in check.
     
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  18. Sablebot

    Sablebot #iposttomakeyouthinknotdebate

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    Exactly-and releasing it when Paramount released it, and pitting it up against Aquaman, Mary Poppins, and whatever else at that time, had a significant effect as well. . .As well as the still-present stench the bayverse left, as there were and still are folks today who mistake BB for being a bay movie. . .
     
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  19. Nathanoraptor

    Nathanoraptor Well-Known Member

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    Most of these are mild innuendos that the average child wouldn't understand. The kids just think Iron Man is being funny or that Black Widow's just been captured and is being interrogated, whilst the adults will get the implication. That's how you put adult content in a film.


    ROTF has two male dogs humping, a blenderbot with a cannon that looks like a penis, Sam's mother getting high on pot brownies and another robot humping Megan Fox's leg.


    Indeed, many people have pointed out that the MCU's desire to stay (mostly) family friendly is part of the reason why it's so successful. It's not hypocritical to say that. If Rocket humped Black Widow's leg at any point and I said that was OK... that would be being hypocritical.


    The poor critical reception of The Last Knight is widely considered to be one of the reasons why Bumblebee didn't do as well as expected - people were uneasy because a big-budget flop with the Transformers name on it was still fresh in people's minds.

    However, Bumblebee was considered "solidly profitable", especially after the disaster that was TLK, which allegedly lost Paramount over $100 million dollars.

    Independently of that experience (which was awful), TLK was an exhausting film to sit through; it was the first film I ever saw where I was checking my watch to see how long it had left to go. It's the only TF film I haven't watched again since I saw it in the cinema; that's how tiring I found it. It was more of the same; loud, bloated blockbuster schlock. There were enjoyable moments, but it was in a cluttered film.

    You really liked Transformers 1-5; fair play to you. Some people did and they shouldn't be judged for it. However, even people who enjoyed some of them (as I did) must admit that there are many faults with them. The inconsistent tone (juvenile humour mixed in with dark, serious action stuff), oftentimes cheesy performances and generally thin plots are worth noting.

    In a franchise that has had some very sophisticated stories and character arcs, dealing with some very mature themes, it's not snobby to ask for higher standards from a Transformers film - and the Bayverse for the most part failed to reach those standards. That is a fact.
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2020
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  20. AutobotStrider

    AutobotStrider Well-Known Member

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    I stopped reading after your first sentence. Hilarious.