Why I don't hate the movies overall.

Discussion in 'Transformers Movie Discussion' started by electronic456, Sep 10, 2019.

  1. electronic456

    electronic456 Well-Known Member

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    This is just my opinion overall so given the title of this thread I know it's gonna be easy for some people to lump in and act authoritative on what they think; I mean it's fine if you think otherwise... But alright let's just do this.

    2007 was a year where I was too young even understand what fan outrage is. So yeah, none of the stuff about Optimus having flames or Megatron, you know... Looking like a xenomorph at the time had really got to me. Yet.
    [​IMG]
    No, I didn't know about online forums at the time but I guess that's a good thing because if there's one thing I shouldn't be up against, it's death threats from fans.

    Anyway, so my knowledge on Transformers also tethers on Beast Wars and the last bits of the Unicron Trilogy (i.e. Cybertron) at the time. I had no proper introduction to Optimus Prime beforehand because I was kind of indifferent to what the franchise was at the time.

    By the time, I finally got around to seeing the 2007 movie my thoughts on the franchise got a big 180 and I was just hooked onto what I had witnessed on screen and was mesmerised with it. See? If those designs are so far removed from the source material and there's so many of those weird human scenes; why was I still entertained by what I saw on screen?

    90s kids who enjoyed movies like Independence Day; Mortal Kombat or TMNT 1990 when you were young, do you remember what's it like watching those movies and still holding those movies to a level of regard as an adult? Or better yet... 80s kids, when you saw the 1986 animated film and by the time you grew up... And still hold that movie with high regard?

    One of my answers would be Michael Bay; as a director. Okay, time to shut down this thread because that's a bad thing to say.... Just kidding. I believe he understands as moviegoers our minds want to be entertained more than anything and that's a simple principle to live by. Why else do people like movies like Bad Boys (and it's getting its third movie) or Armageddon? This answer also reminds me of when I watched Patrick H Willem's videos about him and it makes sense as to why his movies can have such an appeal to the eye. Thus the first movie earned its money to build on.


    So when I was anticipating ROTF, of course it was whatever the first movie sold me on that had me anticipating. First time watching it? It felt like exactly what I wanted. Then I tried talking to other people about it and it was strange to find people scoffing at it and me going, "Wait, what?"

    So I came across the 20% on Rotten Tomatoes one day and read up on complaints on stuff like crude humor or in other words, toilet humor. And that's how I became aware that these movies aren't what I think they are. No, it's not about being faithful to the source material or anything like that; it's really how they do as movies.

    I was still entertained by DOTM but by then, I had a set of complaints like lack of robot screen time and personality. Of course, who knew getting stuff like that would bring us to complaints like 'kibble-less' robots at that time. I guess we should all figure out time travel and put those things in for Paramount to read on. That's AOE for you I guess. Personally, I'm glad they tried implementing those things in but sad that a new set of problems had to come.

    TLK, the final TF film directed by Bay was a testament to pretty much all of us even those who had fun with the movies previously were feeling the pressure of so many things. Now that I'm old during the time, I've become much more self-aware into what I am expecting. And you know what was appealing to me four movies in? It's the lore. (*insert obnoxious Nicholas Cage laugh*) Yes, Transformers from all different corners of the franchise had so much interesting stuff to pull from. Like the Knights of Cybertron from IDW or what the concept of a Prime is in general.

    Also the appeal that things from the past were getting tied together. Including a potential meta way that could excuse why there were Transformer McGuffins on Earth in Unicron; whether you think he's forced or not. Not a good idea in general; but a good idea for what the movies established. By the time, we notice nothing came to fruition and that pretty much everyone in both the audience and production was fatigued, I was left disappointed by the execution.

    See... I don't hate the movies. I really do not. On a technical level, they can keep me invested as well as whatever idea they have on the table; be it the lore or having robot characters that extend beyond. As Roy Batty said in Blade Runner, 'All those moments will be lost like tear drops in the rain.'

    We are fortunate that Bumblebee just happened to be right around the corner after TLK as a leftover product and deliver us stuff that perhaps are a little too late to see. It's cool to see the G1 characters from nostalgia point of view but for me, it's that their status as characters that would appeal more. Also while the character building was strong; the story for me felt pretty dilute in that you can't help but feel that it's been there and done that.

    Here's an excerpt from the Variety review that I actually agree with in terms of why it worked:

    “Bumblebee” benefits enormously from creative decisions that have come before: the robot designs, the basic sound effects, the warm, vaguely gold-burnished look of DP Enrique Chediak’s live-action footage — all of these things trace back to the template Bay set in the previous five films. And, of course, Bay risked his reputation making a movie based on a popular ’80s toy franchise, where the pitch to audiences at the time was basically the notion that if any director could make those ridiculous robots look cool in live action, it was the man whose every movie looks like a super-polished car commercial. “Bumblebee” shows that there’s room for a bit more nuance within the formula, but if you break it down, this relatively enjoyable film is made entirely from recycled parts.

    Overall as a fan, the films help impress me that Transformers as franchise can have a lot of creativity to it and it's something that helps with the investment. I'm hoping the next film after Bumblebee is able to feel a little more creative in terms of what it can offer exclusively. So yeah, that's why I'm not that invested in complaining about the faults but rather what worked and what can be built upon. Anyway, I feel like I'm rambling but I'll be glad to talk further about my feelings.
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2019
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  2. bellpeppers

    bellpeppers A Meat Popsicle

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    They’re entertaining.
     
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  3. Gzstg

    Gzstg Well-Known Member

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    I liked the first three well enough even though I was a bit of a g1 only guy when the third one came out. I grew out of it about three years later and appreciated the movies for reintroducing the franchise to a far larger audience then the tv shows could which is why when I see grown ass people being hyperbolic towards the movies I think congratulations your acting like a 15 year old child. now I like all the movies for what they are with my favorites being 1 and 5. there entertaining and that's enough for me now not every movie has to be some Shakespearian masterpiece to be good.
     
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  4. ObakaChanTachi

    ObakaChanTachi Thnks fr th mmrs

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    I don’t hate them either. Do I dislike them? Yes. But hate? Hate is a strong word, and $200 million toy commercials don’t deserve it.
     
  5. Insurgent

    Insurgent Big Red Fire Snorting Dragon

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    I will happily sit with mates and rip the movies apart, or make fun of them. But also, I enjoy them. I will happily watch them again and again, and the scores are constantly being played by me, especially when at work. I like seeing the robot designs. I like seeing the action. I like *most* of the comedy (rotf did go too far). And they gave me Sentinel Prime. DOTM Sentinel is one of my favourite characters in the entire franchise.
     
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  6. AutobotAvalanche

    AutobotAvalanche Number One in Boogieland Moderator

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    I don't think it's too much to ask you guys to be civil and stay on topic. You don't have to agree with each other. You don't even have to like each other. But the constant, targeted attacks or callouts of specific users, debates/arguments/drama that somehow transcends individual threads, and the petty disputes need to stop.

    If it doesn't have anything to do with the OP, or if it's aggressive or mean, don't post it. That goes for all threads in the movie forum, which seems to need much more frequent reminders than everywhere else on the site.
     
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  7. Prime Noble

    Prime Noble Well-Known Member

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    Personally my main problems with the Bay movies were the over the top silly humour and certain robot designs like the Twins, Ironhide, Brains, Que and Drift and I could forgive the robot designs if the silly humour had been cut out.

    It's a shame because the 07 movie was genuinely funny. It was funnier than most modern comedies which often tend to not be funny at all.

    I do feel that for the most part the villains get better portrayals. I was going to say Decepticons but most of the main villains aren't actually Decepticons. Sentinel Prime, Nemesis Prime, Quintessa, Unicron, Galvatron and Lockdown. In fact throw in the Fallen and half the main villains of the Baymovies are Primes.

    I have to say I liked the portrayals of all those aforementioned villains though I didn't like Lockdown's voice. It felt corny to me. On a side note, in recent years I've felt voice acting in the franchise has gone down in quality.

    Movie Lockdown, Crosshairs, Brains, Shockwave, Mohawk and Drift.
    Machinima Menasor, Overlord and Starscream.
    Devestation Starscream and Thundercracker.
    Most Starscreams and Soundwaves actually.

    But I digress. Flaws aside, the Baymovies are still guilty pleasures of mine. And to be honest though I love the Bumblebee movie, the humour was pretty poor.
     
  8. Insurgent

    Insurgent Big Red Fire Snorting Dragon

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    Speaking of villains, i have to give big props to Kelsey Grammer. In a movie with giant alien robots fighting, he manages to be the most intimidating character, and all he does is stand around in a suit and talk. That's acting chops.

    I do like it when these positive bayverse threads pop up.
     
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  9. hthrun

    hthrun Show accuracy's overrated

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    I base my favorite movies on which ones I would rewatch given the time, and for me it's all transformers. The action and special effects far outweigh the bad for the most part. Most other movies are now boring to me.
     
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  10. electronic456

    electronic456 Well-Known Member

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    One other thing I like to touch on is the movies is I also enjoy freeze-framing a lot of the VFX shots in them and searching for hidden details like Cybertronian symbols and stuff.

    The movies do help me to find ways to appreciate VFX on a minuscule level.
     
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  11. JonzyYT

    JonzyYT Well-Known Member

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    I love the first three films. I don't find enjoyment in watching AOE most of the time, its still a decent film though. I rate TLK as well, something different which could've set up a great sequel.
     
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  12. GuardianPrime19

    GuardianPrime19 Prime

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    Even though I’m a former fan of them I don’t hate the films. Now that I’m studying screenwriting and film in college it’s just become easier for me to nitpick the issues that the movies have storywise. But I still go on YouTube occasionally to watch some of the fight scenes as a guilty pleasure
     
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  13. Terrellatron

    Terrellatron REPAIR REPAIR REPAIR

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    Am I the only one who wants to see what they would've done with the whole Cybertron and Earth now being conjoined together.
     
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  14. Jetstorm

    Jetstorm Wielder of the Keyblade

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  15. hthrun

    hthrun Show accuracy's overrated

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    I would have loved seeing that explored more...
     
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  16. BelnadesPistol

    BelnadesPistol They actually went into 51 lmao

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    I like the films because they deviate the best from the original concept, just like Beast Wars. Even for the little stuff, like if characters are killed off easily, they are given their chance. unlike the original movie from 1986. Even Bumblebee. If people want to punch holes into their walls because Optimus has flames or Dino is not an F1, that's alright, but it's childish nevertheless. I do have some parts I don't like(like the final battle of DOTM) but I'll always rewatch even them.
     
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  17. SPLIT LIP

    SPLIT LIP AKA Beve Stuscemi

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    I like ideas the Bay movies have, but they're marred by terrible execution. I tend to only really get enjoyment out of them in a vacuum or only after they're introduced into a different continuity and given time and talent to flesh them out.

    I still hate that the Dreads and DOTM Sentinel have never been properly adapted anywhere else. DOTM Sentinel was perfect.
     
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  18. primal789

    primal789 Prime

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    Just out of curiosity: Do you think the final battles of AOE or TLK are better?
     
  19. BelnadesPistol

    BelnadesPistol They actually went into 51 lmao

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    AOE is on the same level of controversy. The sword lodged inside Optimus's chest should've killed him. TLK is alright, not really a battle but still, wish Megatron put up more of a fight against Prime.
    1. '07
    2. AOE
    3. DOTM
    4. TLK
    5. ROTF
     
  20. primal789

    primal789 Prime

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    Yeah I can kinda agree.I feel like for the last 2 they needed bigger action after what we got in the first 3 even though I'm a big fan you know...but I like the last 2 for different reasons and the battles are not one of those reasons.