Discussion in 'Transformers Movie Discussion' started by TheWarPathGuy, Oct 10, 2018.
Wouldn’t say it was bad
Either way it was worth pointing out
Anyway, I was actually kind of miffed they didn't lean more towards some of the previous movies' designs for Bumblebee. For example, the ROTF Ravage design is actually pretty cool-looking; all I'd change on that would be the head.
I enjoyed some of Bayformers design such as Optimus, Shockwave, the Constructicons, Soundwave, Barricade, Blackout and the best of all of them Sentinel Prime. I used to think the blocky design won’t work, but the WFC/FOC cinematic trailer, the Gundam from Ready Player One, and BumbleBee proved me wrong, they can and do look good. But personally if they can find the middle ground such as the design of Blitzwing that’ll be the best for me.
If they do decide to go G1, so be it, but please please don’t use liquid metal for their face, god do I hate liquid metal, they look terrible...
I think middle ground is pretty much what they are going for; Bumblebee, Optimus, Shatter and Dropkick (as well as the unused Megatron design) all are pretty much hybrids between the G1 and Movie aesthetics. In fact, Knightsverse Shockwave bears quite a resemblance to the depiction of Shockwave in the IDW movie comics, who was also heavily G1 inspired.
Which is a good thing because, as you have said, a lot of the movie designs are actually pretty good. For example, I really like the movie Starscream design; the only thing I'd change on that would be the head. Same with Ravage; I think the spiky ROTF design is scarier; with a G1-inspired head (again with the heads, what is it with me?), he'd fit perfectly.
I think with some of the Bayformers designs, the reasons Geewunners hated them was pretty much "It doesn't look exactly like G1.. SO IT SUX!" That's pretty much the entirety of the reasoning the people who freaked out about Prime having flames or being a long-nosed truck used when they complained about it.
You can't please some people.
In my rock solid opinion, your trippin. Classic Soundwave always looks good and is highly photogenic. He and Shockwave have the best movie designs. Pity we didn't see and hear more of him.
Half the fun of looking at a robot-mode Transformer, for me, is to try and figure out from its appearance in robot mode what it turns into.
I saw Bumblebee four times and couldn't figure out for the life of me what either Soundwave or Shockwave turned into.
Then go watch the old cartoon and you'll see what they turn into.
I also enjoy recognizing what I'm looking at. Don't just mean characters. I mean Bay's designs were a whole lot of "What the hell am I looking at?" And a bunch of walking scrapheaps that look like someone threw haphazard piles of metal together and called it a TF.
You know, just because Soundwave turned into a tape deck in G1 does not mean he has to turn into a tape deck here. I've never liked the idea of mass-shifting; it just doesn't make sense for me.
It's OK for Soundwave to be blue, it's OK for Soundwave to have that head design, and it's OK for him to turn into a bloody car.
My theory is that every seeker there except Starscream is generic. The real Skywarp and Thundercracker won’t have the gas mask.
To be honest, I liked the gas mask.
Also, I was reading the DOTM IDW comics and I realised the way Shockwave looked in those comics is pretty much identical to Knightsverse Shockwave.
Yes he was. The grey was mostly due to limitations in ink colors at the time. They actual grey Hulk came later.
By that logic saying Hulk was originally grey isn't true either since that was only in the comics. And again in most modern comics cartoons and movies green Hulk came first and grey Hulk came later.
Grey Hulk is typically much more intelligent as that form retains Bruce Banner's education. Because of the greater intelligence he also tends to be a waist of muscle as he often tries to find nonviolent ways of solving problems despite being just as strong as Green Hulk.
They original Hulk who was always intended to be green but looked grey due to limitations at the time didn't have the higher intelligence of modern Grey Hulks but was a flipping idiot like most Green Hulks have been portrayed.
No he wasn’t,
Even if we accept the idea of limited inking as an issue it doesn’t change the fact that he was grey first
And by the way you got it backwards
At a comic convention I heard Stan say in his own words that he originally wanted the Hulk to be grey but due to ink problems, in smaller panels it was harder to make out muscle definitions that were done in black ink from the grey skin, so Hulk's color was changed to green
It might help to look things up
Stan Lee himself on hulks original intended color
Your logic is confusing.
Either way the only point I was trying to make out with that one is that the topic seems to be about the cartoon and how it’s characters looked
not the comic, I seriously doubt anybody was suggesting that we should get a G1 comic book looking iron hide or ratchet from their original appearances
Btw, sorry since we didn’t see the creation of Hulk in the Marvel Movie universe, there’s room to say he could have been grey at first
But I doubt they will do that
You’re getting your Hulks confused
Grey was smarter, But I would not say to the extent of banner, And he was certainly not nonviolent
In fact he was pretty much a mob enforcer In Las Vegas and he was also a bit weaker than the green savage hulk
The hulk that was a bit nonviolent is called Professor hulk, He was green and a combination of 3 personalities , Bruce Banner, The Green Savage Hulk, And the Grey Hulk
They original Hulk was intended to be Grey by Stan Lee
but changed to green due to limitations of the time
How a Faulty Printer Changed the Incredible Hulk
I hate to say this after he just passed away recently but Stan also said the story I gave you... and he also once admitted that he doesn't even know what stories are actually true anymore because for him this was years in his past and no one has a perfect memory. He has told several conflicting stories about the real life origins of some of his characters in his old age so we'd need to go back to a younger Stan when the memory was more fresh in his mind to really confirm which story was actually true.
It's your logic... You said Megatron didn't originally have a black helmet because "that's only in the comics" but in the same post said Hulk was originally Grey which was also "only in the comics" so if you apply the same logic to both characters then Hulk was not originally grey either.
Ironhide and Ratchet's original comic book looks... put me down for a firm Hell No!
We actually do see the creation of the Hulk in the MCU, were you not paying attention during the opening credits of that movie? The director was a fan of the Bill Bixby/Lou Farigno TV series so he actually used the same origin from that series for his Hulk. The original Hulk movie was more accurate to the comics origin but he was still green in that movie too.
We've still never even had a Grey Hulk in any movie. He might already exist in the MCU for all we know because there is a large number of years he was on the run from General Ross that we don't see and Grey Hulk could of happened at any point during that time but we know he didn't start out Grey because we did see his origins.
I'm not getting my Hulks confused, I said he's USEUALLY depicted that way not that he's ALLWAYS depicted that way. Mobster Hulk as far as I know was a one time thing and isn't the usual depiction of Grey Hulk. He's an exception.
And I've never even heard of Professor Hulk before... at least not being Green and a combination of normal Green and Grey Hulk... that doesn't even make sense to me because Grey Hulk normally is already a professor type Hulk.
Have you ever seen Super Hero Squad, Avenger's Earth's Mightiest Heroes, or Agents of SMASH?
Super Hero Squad, Grey Hulk is a highly intelligent pacifist with Bruce Banner's intelligence and Hulk's strength but he doesn't really use it... he's also a coward but only this version of grey Hulk.
Avengers, grey Hulk again was a super intelligent pacifist... so much of a pacifist that he completely lost interest in sparing with Thor or even playing video games which the two often did in this series. He did fight but he would attempt to find other solutions whenever possible before resorting to smashing things.
Agents of SMASH... well honestly normal Hulk already seems unusually intelligent in this series to begin with so Grey Hulk kinda turned into a peace loving hippy to more heavily contrast with Green Hulk. So again pacifist.
Mobster Hulk by the way is Grey because everything is black and white in that universe. He comes from the same universe as Noir Spider-man. The idea was for everything to look like a 1940's noir film but with Marvel characters.
I know you can’t but would love to see you try
Keep in mind that Stan did not create the Hulk by himself
And the other guy, the King , also backed up the idea that he was intended to be gray
Yeah with inthe last decade or so for him
The story about the original color being grey , Is a story we was telling as far back as the 70s
Sorry but you are just dead wrong
......because he didn’t in the cartoon and people on this topic were talking about appearances as they were depicted in the G1 cartoon
Remember, most people seem to, when referring to g1, only speak of appearances from the cartoon
It’s been a while since I seen that film and your right....but it wasn’t exactly the same origin as the Bixby show
And the 03 films origin I wouldn’t call “more accurate” either
Comics, He just was smart about how he used Violence
And yes Mobster Hulk was a one time, why would you expect them to tell the same story over and over again
The grey Hulk may have been smart, But he wasn’t the professor type and really wasn’t shown to have all of the banners intellect
Well I guess it’s still possible it just wasn’t depicted
The 3 different personalities are best described as this.....
Bruce, The Intellectual that survived childhood abuse, That’s depressed all his anger and passions most of his life
The Green Savage Hulk, The rage driven abused child now given the strength
The Grey Hulk aka Joe Fix-it, The brute, the male ego given unlimited strength, driven by his passions greed, desires, cunning, arrogant, tricky, a loner and rather horny
Professor Hulk aka Merged Hulk, demonstrated aspects of the the 3, Banners ,Savage And Greys personalities: possessing Banner's intelligence, Joe Fixit's cunning, and the Savage Hulk's size and strength
Kind of all 3 different personalities rolled into one
Super Hero Squad really using a good example, they took a lot of liberties
Avengers, I don’t recall them showing grey Hulk, but it’s been a while, gonna need you to give me an episode name or at least some story info
So I can see for myself
Agents of SMASH... , seemed to just be having fun with things
Oh, no no no
Guess I wasn’t clear
I was talking about a comic book arc
Wasn’t different universe,
I can't right now. I'm on my tablet but maybe when I'm home I can try to find that video on YouTube again. Though if you're right about him telling the same story when he was younger that you posted and you can prove that the the video I saw would be nothing more than elderly Stan's poor memory.
And I get Megatron never had a black helmet in the cartoon except for a couple very old commercials... but then how do you go from cartoon only to comic book only Hulk in the same post. Hulk was always Green first in every cartoon he's ever appeared in. Grey Hulk came later.
Who said anything about telling the same story over and over again? All I said was that Mr. Fixit only appeared in one story. Just because a character appears more than once doesn't mean it's the same story.
And it seems Mr. Fixit wasn't a one time thing because you're clearly talking about a totally different story than I am.
Ultimate Spider-man Into the Spider-verse, cartoon series not the movie of the same name... There's an episode set in the Noir universe where everything is black and white. Spider-man is a 1940's noir detective. The Hulk in this universe is a mob boss called Mr. Fixit. This is the only thing I know him from so that's what I thought you were talking about. This technically is not even a true Grey Hulk. Grey Hulk is literally the name of that character in universe not just his color. Mr. Fixit could be called a grey hulk in the same way that G1 is animated but it's not Transformers Animated. Mr. Fixit in story isn't even really called a Hulk except by MU Spider-man who recognizes him as an alternate universe version of his Hulk.
Maybe the guy you're talking about is different but in the cartoon Grey Hulk and Mr. Fixit are actually two entirely different characters. Grey Hulk being like I said before a pacifist highly intelligent version of normal Hulk while Mr. Fixit is from a totally different universe where color doesn't even exist. He's not a green Hulk who turned grey and got smarter, he's always been grey.
The comics count more than the cartoon but not as much as the tech specs. This is not debatable just because the cartoon was the most popular, it was still based on the series bible (which was extended versions of toy bios) and that was written by the same guy who wrote the comics.
So I don't know how valid that makes the coloring discrepancies, in which he had no part, but Megatron having a black helmet, Soundwave being purple and having a mouth, grey Galvatron, these are all valid choices and having them is just as G1 if not more so.
I can wait
My guess is that you are miss remembering what was said in the interview you are talking about
also please try to find me the proof you said that you researched that said the Delta flyer was a heavy modification of a regular shuttle
I know i already disproved that idea but I would still love to see the site you said you researched it on
Again, many tf fans refer to the G1 cartoon appearances when saying the bay films should have looked more like g1
In fact I have seen many fans argue and believe the cartoon came out first
When many fans talk about the “source material” of g1 they again default to the cartoon
My comment had that in mind
Again, I was referring to a run of the comics in which he was a mob enforcer
, calling himself Joe Fixit
It ran a few months
You know what now that you spell it out I kind of do you remember that episode
But I only saw those episodes once and really wasn’t that big of a fan of the show
Not to say it was bad it just wasn’t always my cup of tea
The hell its not debatable
Coming first is not the equal of “counting more”
The cartoon had its own bible that differed in a few ways from the lay out of the toy bios and comics
Many of the characterizations we got in the cartoon didn’t mesh with those of either the toy bios or comics
This is actually not true the cartoon bible were extended versions of the Tech Specs, they were just often interpreted different. Like Shockwave is "The Deception Spock" in two very different directions. The Marvel Comics versions are ultimately more definitive however because they're written by the same guy who came up with the characters in the first place.
Shockwave cartoon bible:Caretaker of Cybertron...no greater ambitions. No emotions--undeviating in following Megatron's orders. Self-programmed to destroy any unidentified creature who attempts to penetrate boundaries for which he is responsible.
Shovkwave tech spec:Cold, brutal, scientific approach to war. Seeks to overthrow Megatron as leader of Decepticons because he believes logic says he would be better. As laser gun, can emit lethal beams of energy from anywhere on the electomagnetic spectrum: gamma rays, X-rays, visible light, infrared rays, radio waves, etc.. Flies in laser gun or robot Mode. High fuel use, but can be powered by nuclear sources. Often confounded by initiave, emotional thinking.
Not a different interpretation, It’s completely different
There are other examples but I won’t waste my time posting them
As I said before ”The cartoon had its own bible that differed in a few ways from the lay out of the toy bios and comics
Many of the characterizations we got in the cartoon didn’t mesh with those of either the toy bios or comics”
Separate names with a comma.