Ok but here's the thing...why?

Optimus Prime was already a decently popular character that appealed to so many because of his personality, morals, good nature and was a badass at times. We've seen many characters in fiction appeal to a wide range of audiences yet still maintain some of these qualities like Spiderman or Superman or Batman for example.

Just turning this type of well known characters dark and edgy for the sake of it is kinda lazy and honestly so overdone. It says a lot about some people behind the movies, that they don't seem to trust the audience or somehow they think making a character more dark, super violent and stoic will somehow make them appeal to more people.

 

It's no different than Tim Burton's BATMAN that seemed to enjoy killing.
(75) BATMAN Movie Kill Count Supercut - YouTube
You can enjoy Batman and Baman returns; comic Batman and Batman TAS are still just as intact. The existence of 1 doesn't hurt the other.

 

Those same people in Hollywood approved TLK to begin production, which is beyond me.
But the point is Bay and his people knew what audiences to target. And a few explosions, fancy cars and robots produced that net result.
Unfortunately they were after easy profits. Or maybe they still are.
Optimus is in some ways like Jon Wick. And look how popular that film got.

 

Yes and while I kinda enjoy Burtons Batman films that was a big problem with them, Batman is murdering people. Even though the character is well known for having a strict code on killing which is what defines the character.

The films never once explore that or try anything to justify or work it into the story. Yet they still make a big point about his parents being killed which inspired the no kill rule. Ben Afflecks Batman films have the same problem but even worse. Also just because other versions exist doesn't mean one can't be criticised.

The point I'm trying to make here is Optimus murdering his enemies with pure rage and ruthlessness is a big problem the films have but they still act like he's a hero and he spouts about freedom. Yet they don't even bother to try and take the opportunity to deconstruct the character and do something interesting with him being violent or explore that he's doing morally gray and questionable decisions. (A current Transformers cartoon is doing it way better by showing Optimus make morally gray decisions, yet still staying true to core aspects of Optimus).

Again it's just typical ruthless violence for the sake of it.

 

I mean they also approved Revenge of the Fallen and Age of Extinction.

Really? John Wick works for different reasons and is different type of character entirely, he's not even remotely comparable to Optimus.

Optimus is and should be more along the lines of characters like Superman or Spider-Man.

 

The franchise is beyond saving so its best we enjoy what there is. Maybe the new Optimus in ROTB will be more aligned with superman. Who also is known to kill villains.

 

I mean hopefully the new set of films coming out are all part of a rebooted continuity so there's something new and a clean slate. Also with Superman, he doesn't usually kill his enemies, only sometimes out of necessity especially when there's a good justification and writers behind it that still understand the character.

 

It's not a problem tho. It's just another version of a character. People, like myself, can be introduced to the character in films and then seen what the comic version is.

It's combat

And why wouldn't he? He's saving everyone from the Decepticons who desire to destroy and enslave everyone else.

Personally, I haven't seen anything morally gray... otherwise he's an expensive CG character, and as such none of these characters don't get excessive screen time like less expensive actors for any kind of Chris Nolan 2 1/2 - 3 hour development.

But what they show is fine for popcorn entertainment and toy selling.

Over multiple episodes that add up to more screen time than in any 1 film.
Not a good comparison.

It's action.

 

It is a problem because it's taking what made the character interesting and stand out at all. It misses the entire point and at this stage it's just the Punisher in an animal themed cosplay lol.

We've seen plenty of versions of Optimus in combat who are capable yet don't execute and humiliate their enemies.

Because a hero who's whole angle is about peace and freedom generally wants to end things peacefully and not in a cruel and sadistic way. Its just pure contradiction.

See that excuse right there is the problem with the movies and the thought put behind them. They never treated the Transformers as actual characters in their own movies or try to give them development/arcs. They're just set pieces, at this stage why bother. We've seen plenty of movies with expensive CGI actually try with their characters. Look at the bumblebee movie.

Yet other instalments of the franchise could be classed as this yet try way way more.

So? My point still stands, it actually tries to do something new and make optimus more morally gray yet not lose sight of who the character is. The movies could easily do this but that would require thought put into it.

If you want another example, the Bumblebee movie shows an Optimus capable in combat yet he isn't excessive and cruel. He stays behind to buy his soldiers time against a horde of Decepticons. Granted while he doesn't have much of an arc in the film, he was more like Optimus Prime for only 10 minutes in that film than all 5 Bay films combined. Hell Nemesis Prime was less cruel in the movies which is hilarious.

A lot of transformers stuff has action yet the autobots and especially Optimus aren't sadistic. Hell earthspark has probably the best action in the entire franchise, most of it involving Optimus yet he never kills and is capable of incapacitating his enemies. So....

 

This is funny because it's exactly what Larry Cullen told his brother Peter not to do: "If you're gonna be a hero, be a real hero. Don't be one of those Hollywood heroes, don't yell and act tough and all that crap. Be strong enough to be gentle."

 

Hopefully. But then again TF universe was cancelled.

Toning down Optimus fatalities a bit wouldn't bother me much.

 

Well while they have cancelled the sequel to The Last Knight (which was for the best honestly) theres potentially 4 more transformers movies after Rise of the Beasts. There's 2 sequels to Rise of the Beasts that could potentially happen. There is a prequel set on Cybertron that will use animation that is out in 2024 and a spin off film set in South America that is out in either 2025 or 2026. So we got plenty to potentially look forward to.

 

But still cash those checks when you do it anyway.

 

Another thing that doesn't really help with this discussion about 'brutality' in the Bayverse is the films never really give us an idea what actually kills a Cybe.

What I mean is while they pay lip-service it in the 2007 film, even among the Autobots / Cons themselves it mostly seems to be just dismember your opponent, even though we saw Starscream re-attach his arm after Prime lobbed it off. Blowing them up works, until it doesn't. Dismemberment works, until it doesn't.

 

Or the fact the cybertronians arrive down on Earth as meteors in the bay films, burning up on entry and hitting the ground really hard.

Yet they aren't in small ships or pods like in the Bumblebee film, they transform into and become the meteors themselves. Which is confusing

 

While all that is good, TLK ruined the chance of those projects to be based off designs from the first trilogy.
A scene of young optimus being lectured by Sentinel on cybertron using art style from tf3 for instance.

 

I mean let's be honest, that has been a thing for Transformers in general. What kills them across all the various versions and continuities is very inconsistent.

As to this discussion though it is very well known that Optimus goes for the head and that almost always works, with Megatron being the notable exception.

 

Honestly reading this thread makes me think about my own standards for brutality. Lol. Maybe it’s because they’re robots so it doesn’t really register regardless but I thought Sentinel’s death was among the more tame movie Prime has ever gone through with.

I mean shoot in this same movie Optimus rips out Shockwave’s headless dangling eye from his neck like pushing Go-gurt and rips out Megatron’s head and spinal cord by an axe. Sentinel got it easy to me. Lol

 

The real answer is that no one writing Optimus cared enough to make him peaceful and virtuous. They just slapped together some inspirational quotes, then had him act however the heck they wanted(which was usually loud and brutal), needed the movie to end quickly, and called it a day.

In-universe, you could say Prime was just despondent and “over” the war and became despondent over Sentinel’s betrayal.