Unless i'm mistaken, but they do mass shift in the first movie don't they? And i can't see why they can't.... since they can morph into any object/size.

If they can morph to any object and size, why couldn't they grow bigger or small when transforming?

 

Michael Bay didn't want mass-shifting in the live-action movies because it would be unrealistic, which I agree. And no, there wasn't any mass-shifting in the first movie from what I can remember. It just wouldn't work obviously. An example...

Jazz being a small vehicle, then converting into a robot as big as Starscream.

 

But couldn't they scan any car and become that car size's? Like if Jazz scanned a Tank, he would've became really big. Imagine that when Optimus landed on Earth, and instead of a truck passing by, it was a bike, i guess he would've scanned the bike and be skinny?

(i know, he'll probly wait for something bigger, but that's not the point)

 

That would've been pretty hilarious. But still, I'm pretty sure they scan vehicles that would be proportionate to their size so they can duck down and fit in the vehicle.

 

No, not at all. To everything you said. Transformers just coincidentally find vehicles exactly as large as they are. They don't change their size.

 

They can only scan things that are their size, thats how in Animated and G1 they got their alt modes with the vehicle that resembled what they originally Transformed into in the 1st place

 

Theres already been a thread talking about this some where

 

Ok, so they can only scan what's similar to their size. Makes more sense now. Poor Fenzy..

But what about Scorpio.. did he scan i gigantic scopion?  

 

Isn't Scorponok just a part of Blackout's alt mode? o.o I'm pretty sure you can see parts of the helicopter on him too.

 

My guess is there used to be giant scorpions on Cybertron and Cybertron also used to have one eyed jaguars and dinosaurs and giant insects.

 

Yes he scanned it because it also matched his proportions.

 

Those ARE their robot modes, and Scorponok turns into one of Blackout's helicopter engines.

 

Yep, that's why Blackout's toy has the ejecting Scorponok.

Waitaminute. Blackout dies in the first film, while Scorponok obviously survives. If Scorponok is part of Blackout, therefore he has part of Blackout's spark...

I think I just figured out how the hell Grindor/resurected Blackout could be in the movie.

 

Whoever said he has part of Blackout's spark? He's just a little drone unit; there's nothing to suggest they have a bond like that.

 

Never noticed that in the first movie.. maybe i need to rewatch the HD version..

 

There's also nothing that I know of to argue that Scorponok doesn't outside of ROTF itself, which I haven't seen.

Although I've been thinking about it, and maybe Scorponok just goes to what's left of Blackout and uses his spark to re-power the Decepticon, and so he bonds with Blackout that way to become the being known as Grindor, the Blackout repaint!

Of course, that would mean the desert scene with Jetfire and Scorponok would have to occur before Megatron gets revived and the epic forest battle scene of Prime-gets-his-ass-kicked-again happens some time later.

 

Well if I remember correctly, they first scanned and looked if they would fit in the vehicle they turned into before they tranformed into it. So maybe they can mass shift, but not by much. I'm pretty sure about that...

 

As I understand it, mass shifting is physically improbable because of the theory of relativity, E=MC^2. In other words, mass and energy are interchangeable, but at crazy proportions. That's why fission or fusion of a relatively small amount of matter can release an enormous amount of energy - i.e. a nuclear weapon or a nuclear power plant.

So it would take a LOT of energy for something small to become something big or vice-versa. IDW addresses this in their G1-based series - Megatron can't transform down into a (realistically-sized) Walther P-38 unless he's got a great deal of energy that he can afford to expend.

 

There's plenty of mass-shifting in the movies. Starscream and (especially) Jetfire just wouldn't fit in the the rest of the cast otherwise.

Starscream stands shoulder-to-shoulder with Megatron in one scene and then Megatron stands shoulder-to-shoulder with Prime in another. Megatron must have been growing and shrinking all over the place (since it's off-camera it didn't happen!  ) to make that work. An F-22 dwarfs a truck way more than "compacting by folding" could ever make up for.

The concept art of the Prime/Jetfire combination shows Jetfire at least 3 times smaller than he should be judging from the cockpit windows.

Frenzy mass-shifts right in front of our eyes when his head becomes a phone.

Rampage had to do some serious shrinking to fight Bumblebee eye-to-eye.

etc etc

 

In G1 the autobots found some dinosour bones. Wheeljack and Ratchet decided to make the Dinobots to help the autobots fight against the Decepticons. Learn your TF history dude.