What would happen to comics in general if the comic industry does die out?

Discussion in 'Comic Books and Graphic Novels' started by kaijuguy19, Mar 26, 2019.

  1. Rodimus Prime

    Rodimus Prime Sola Gratia, Sola Fide TFW2005 Supporter

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    I am well aware of the state of comic book industry these days. I have argued that it is worse than the manga industry in some ways. My entire point is that the people who were a part of the poll are not the people who are in the industry for the love of the medium. They are either failed authors, screen writers, etc. trying to get in through the back door, or are involved for ideological reasons, which is something that has been happening in other hobbies I'm involved in, such as the Cthuthlu mythos or 40k.

    Found the twitter addict. :p 

    Seriously though, yes it does. Especially when you are a creative type. Not only is it distracting, but it contributes to depression and loneliness.

    Social media use increases depression and loneliness, study finds
     
  2. Hobbes-timus Prime

    Hobbes-timus Prime Well-Known Member

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    You can't prove this assertion at all.

    I think you might also be projecting a little.
     
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  3. Rodimus Prime

    Rodimus Prime Sola Gratia, Sola Fide TFW2005 Supporter

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    Not without violating the board rules, you're right. :) 

    Actually, I think that I can. If you want to see the future of superhero comics, go check out the YA Novel situation.
     
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2019
  4. Gaastra

    Gaastra Well-Known Member

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    So we are back in the 1950s again. In the 50s everything sold better then heroes. They still had superman, batman, wonder woman and captain marvel but dell comics and ec comics (before the comic code) ruled. Disney comics, west comics, space comics, teen romance, archie type comics, scary and crime comics were kings. Also comics for a time outsold books in America! Uncle scrooge outsold superman. batman and wonder woman at the time.


    Look at the newest smile book. It came in first place on the book charts and that dogman kids trade made the top 10 also! My little niece knows the smile books and bone and i'm shocked by this the smurfs trades are hits at my library in the kids section!

    One piece may pass batman in sales and if you count the japan shonen jump it has passed batman in sales!
     
  5. Aernaroth

    Aernaroth <b><font color=blue>I voted for Super_Megatron and Veteran

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    I call bull on this. Firstly, because the point of the poll's results would be accurate regardless of whether or not it was 'real' comic people or not, and you've basically agreed with that in your above post, so the sample size/group isn't a major factor to dismiss it. Secondly, because a ton of the industry IS on social media, because they're just like everyone else AND because they use it as a professional promotional tool, which I'll discuss later.

    Lastly, your statement about the poll being made up of 'failures' is further bull, because those kinds of people getting into the back door has been basically what the comic industry has been since day one. Guys who couldn't find their place in advertising (Eisner), who couldn't fit in establishment art schools or animation (Kirby), who decided journalism wasn't for them (Gaiman), who couldn't find their breaks in screenwriting (Geoff Johns), etc. Etc. Et freaking cetera.

    Many of them, from the pulp eras to today, weren't in it for love of the medium, they were in it as a job. Some of those people excelled, some used it as an artistic outlet, but at the end of the day, it put bread on their table and that was it's primary role in their life.

    That's not even taking into account the boom in independent comics and how those are beginning to drive the industry, how diverse voices are bringing new styles and new stories that audiences are latching onto, both on and offline.

    And it's not like ideology hasn't been a part of comics from the start, either. Back in the days when they were drawing Hitler getting punched when that would get you a visit from some very angry people, or when they were defying the comics code to show that a black man could be an astronaut or that a person with an addiction was a sympathetic character even when that addiction was destructive, or when Superman was explaining to the audience why social welfare was a good thing or why immigrants were to be welcomed.

    It's also one of the best ways for artists to build up their 'personal brand', showcase their work to a mass audience and build up private commissions, which can be essential when company work is light. So, an unfortunate reality for most artists except for the few at the pinnacle of the pay scale.

    But you already knew that, I'm guessing.
     
  6. Rodimus Prime

    Rodimus Prime Sola Gratia, Sola Fide TFW2005 Supporter

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    You manage to miss the point of what I was saying in every way possible. It's kind of impressive.
     
  7. Aernaroth

    Aernaroth <b><font color=blue>I voted for Super_Megatron and Veteran

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    Please then, illuminate my dark and ignorant world.
     
  8. Rodimus Prime

    Rodimus Prime Sola Gratia, Sola Fide TFW2005 Supporter

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    You're sarcastic, but I am working on it. :D 
     
  9. Aernaroth

    Aernaroth <b><font color=blue>I voted for Super_Megatron and Veteran

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    Not as hard as if you'd backed up your previous post, I'm afraid.
     
  10. Rodimus Prime

    Rodimus Prime Sola Gratia, Sola Fide TFW2005 Supporter

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    I was listening to a lecture then. I am now at home. I am sorry for upsetting you with my insufficient post, m'lord.
     
  11. Aernaroth

    Aernaroth <b><font color=blue>I voted for Super_Megatron and Veteran

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    Well so long as you weren't lazing about talking comics on twitter, I suppose.
     
  12. Rodimus Prime

    Rodimus Prime Sola Gratia, Sola Fide TFW2005 Supporter

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    I was directing it at the people who either half ass their work or are egotistical assholes who refuse to accept ANY criticism, even constructive criticism.

    Go back and re-read what I said regarding social media. I am not talking about being on it, or even engagement, I said spent the vast majority of the time on social media, and I didn't say anything about discussing comics. The ones who I am discussing are NOT talking about comics or promoting their work. They are on there complaining about stupid crap like your least favorite aunt after her fourth box of wine.

    When they are not talking about stupid crap they're literally searching for their name on twitter, etc. If anyone mentions them or their latest book in anythingbesides the most glowing of reviews, the poor sod is getting yelled at... and the Lord have mercy on the idiot who actually @'s them with a comment that is anything less than a full on butt kiss.

    The rest of their time is made up of stabbing others in the back.

    Except that I didn't mean getting into the back door of comics. I meant people who are using comics to get that desired movie or tv deal. And before you start another smug lecture, if any of the people I'm talking about gave a damn about what they were putting out, then comics would be booming as a result of the MCU wave.

    If you want to make the circle big enough, then yeah, comics are doing great. Just ignore the huge swath of us who jumped ship to manga because of the stupidity at marvel and DC .

    That is not what I was talking about, but let me go ahead and address that. The difference between the messages pumped out back then versus now is that the old ones were positive. The political and social messages put out today can be summed up as "Fuck everyone who doesn't agree with me 100%, and let's beat the hell out of them." These people have aren't just using vinegar instead of honey, they're pissing on people's heads and getting mad when asked to stop.

    As for what I was actually talking about, I mean that there are people who are in comics not to put food on the table, or for the love of the medium, but rather because they find them dumb and offensive and want them to be something else entirely. It is not like "well, I like comics, but I think that it can be better" but like "why can't it be more like a movie" or "why can't it be like YA novels?"

    If you've been paying attention, you'll have noticed that I keep mentioning YA novels. Do you know why? Because comic companies keep bringing them in since they are doing it as a side gig and don't ask for as much. Which further depresses wages for people who are trying to put dinner on the table, as you put it.

    And just to tie up loose ends, do you want to know what these people have done to the YAN scene? They have turned it into a place where anything you say or do will get you "cancelled." It's the Salem Witch Trials on crack and redbull. I have seen people driven out of the industry for writing a story about a character of a different ethnicity or sexuality. I have watched as people are cast out of the clique for having something like slavery or villains who are transphobic. I have witness crazy authors literally track down someone who left a bad review on good reads and show up at their front door. I have looked on as a new grift called sensitive readers shake other aspiring authors down to make sure that their work isn't too offensive.

    Those are the assholes marvel is currently bringing in, and they will do the exact same thing here as they did over there.

    Is that precise enough for you? Itis a bit of a balancing act to be clear, not violate the rules, and not be too forth coming with anything that can be tracked back to me.

    If it is still not clear I will see what I can do in mspaint if you need anything drawn out for you. :D 
     
  13. Hobbes-timus Prime

    Hobbes-timus Prime Well-Known Member

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    The YA Novel situation is not the data on who participated in the poll, which is what you asserting. You dont' have the data. Even if you had their names, you couldn't prove their motivations for making comics.

    And delete your political sig if you're so worried about board rules, because they're hypocritical words coming from a theologian and it irritates me.
     
  14. Rodimus Prime

    Rodimus Prime Sola Gratia, Sola Fide TFW2005 Supporter

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    Oh, hey, I forgot about advertising I needed a head in my sig, thanks for that.

    Also, no. It isn't inherently political, and I think that it would be a great way to portray the Decepticons.

    BTW, do I need to point out the irony of you COMMANDING me to change my signature, and the quote itself?

    :lolol 
     
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  15. Gaastra

    Gaastra Well-Known Member

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    My books a million had two long rolls of graphic novels with marvel getting on side of the bookcases and dc getting the other side and a small area for non heroes and manga stuff. Over the years marvel and dc are now sharing a roll that was for dc only and non hero stuff has spread out into one side taking more room from marvel and dc. The other side that used to be just marvel is now all manga. The whole long roll of bookcases are manga only! There are tons of them! The kids comics have their own area in the kids section now with smile, bone, pokemon manga, my little pony, baby mouse, big nate, splatoon, and dogman front in center and the marvel and dc books other then marvels oz books pushed to the side! They still have them but they are not the main draw!

    Also the "on sale for $4 area" it's always marvel and dc heroes. You get the strange oddball manga no one heard of also at times but most of them are marvel and dc heroes! Even ms marvel is not safe and was there half off! They had a roll of dc hardcovers for $3 last time I was there! (grabbed a bunch of dc hardcovers like justice league and even batman!) Even books that just came out a few months ago was in the half off area! You don't see many non hero trades in the area much. (Blast it I want some transformers classics trades on sale books a million!)
     
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  16. Deathcatg

    Deathcatg Well-Known Member

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    It boggles the imagination to think about how EC could have grown and how the modern industry would be different if Wertham didn't happen (or if people were at least smart enough to not take him seriously)
     
  17. Rodimus Prime

    Rodimus Prime Sola Gratia, Sola Fide TFW2005 Supporter

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    Surprising New Data Shows Comic Readers Are Leaving Superheroes Behind

    It isn't just about taste, but quality as well, imo.

    Honestly, I think that things would be a great deal better if many of the authors didn't act like assclowns on Twitter and make it painfully obvious that they hate the guys signing their paychecks.
     
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  18. Gaastra

    Gaastra Well-Known Member

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    It would be like japan and Europe where comics grew. Go into any thrift store in the cities of japan and you most likely will run into used manga. They have two 5 story manga stores in japan and a library for only manga there!







     
  19. Gaastra

    Gaastra Well-Known Member

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    It's from a few months ago but here is a story on mangas growth in America and france. (50% of graphic novel sales in france are manga!)


    Edit. First link isn't working but the second link has another take on the same story. Not sure why the first link won't work.




    https://www.oneangrygamer.net/2019/0...decline/88299/


    I told this story before but one neat thing I saw at our replays (they sells dvds and games but added a manga section not to long ago if your wondering) was a full family walked in and headed right to the manga. Every member of the family was getting manga and talking about them. Even the little kids! They were talking about stories from the manga with each other and even the mom was grabbing manga! The kids talking about manga reminded me of us talking about comics at school when I was younger! Never saw a full family so into manga and the kids were really excited! It was neat to see.
     
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  20. Haywired

    Haywired Hakunamatatacon

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    Manga's not going to take over EU comic books. France and Belgium got a very long and very strong tradition going there. There's also an amount of overlap, people read both EU and Japanese books.

    However, the graphic novel format and sometimes comic book magazines is the usual way comic books are distributed in EU. There's no artificial divide between the book market and the comic book market even if you have publishers like Dargaud who specialise in comics. Comic books here are just books. If readership goes up or down it's on all fronts.

    It's much healthier situation in the long term.
     
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