What should Optimus and Megatron's history be?

Discussion in 'Transformers General Discussion' started by Proud Nintendo, Jul 18, 2021.

  1. sikkusushotto

    sikkusushotto Well-Known Member

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    There has been a very noticeable increase in this trope in the past few years though. Star Trek, I feel, is a good example. Discovery vs. everything that came before.

    Call it bad writing or call it execs scared that anything outside the core universe would be too complicated for audiences, in any case I'm glad that's not the route G1 took.

    Somewhat off-topic, but another trope that we see far too often these days is the "good guys must be the underdog/rebels/freedom fighters" trope. See Star Wars 7/8/9. I always got the feeling that the Decepticons were, at least in the beginning, the underdog. They were the smaller faction, the revolutionaries, the ones who wanted change. I think Animated had a good twist on this with the Autobots being the main ruling faction and the Decepticons being some old war legend. In that sense I find Transformers very refreshing.
     
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  2. harrisongibb

    harrisongibb Well-Known Member

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    I do like this aspect of the IDW comics, and it’s probably more necessary to sustain the narrative of a modern ongoing comic book with added depth of characterization vs. the broader strokes of G1. The G1 cartoon was a different era and also a different intended audience, ie: children.

    What I do think works about War Dawn is that Alpha Trion sees a special spark in Orion Pax following his sacrifice. Orion wasn’t a combat robot but his instinct determined that he was willing to die defending what was right. This was a desperate hour for Cyberton and perhaps the last chance to stem the tide against the Decepticons.

    In Orion Pax, Alpha Trion found a spark who could handle comparable capabilities to Megatron without fear he’d be corrupted by power.

    :2c: 
     
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  3. Chaos Studios

    Chaos Studios Well-Known Member

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    Well its easier to root for the good guys when they seen smaller compared to the antagonist, like its much harder to get people engaged in the story of the good guys if they have so much power and resources at their disposal, unless youre doing a story with corruption within the "good guys" or the "good guys" arent as good as they seem, most of the time the good guys will be the underdogs which is 90% of action adventure storytelling

    even in the beginning the cons pretty much had control of cybertron. Animated was set after the war where the autobots won so it makes sense why the con faction is relatively small.

    G1 does almost every predictable trope in the book, like G1's concepts arent exactly original in the sense of concepts like the optimus origin or the cybertronians rising up against the quints.
     
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  4. Chaos Studios

    Chaos Studios Well-Known Member

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    this is why i like the aligned take because although optimus was a reincarnated version of one of the 13 original primes, alpha trion still saw a good bot in his spark and is the reason why he commissioned haleogen to make him a prime. While the whole reincarnation thing is divisive, the one common and conistent thing between orion/optimus/thirteen, is that his voice was his most powerful ability, while hes the matrix, his wiseness and ability to seek right from wrong is something that is always inside him from the moment of his creation, and thats what makes his feud with megatron so interesting, because of how megs has such a drastically different worldview makes them believe neither of them can exist in the same world not matter how vast (me shamelessly stealing a quote from fall of cybertron XD). Like I aint bullshitting any of this because of how aligned has explored this with prime and the games.
     
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  5. Smokeyoreo18

    Smokeyoreo18 Has to wait 268 days till he can watch RotB

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    Anything that isn’t the war dawn version. Because that story is pretty stupid. It’d be cool to see megatron as a cult leader and Orion the supercop try to stop him, and somehow it leads to a war.
     
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  6. Novaburnhilde

    Novaburnhilde シン・ブリュンヒルド

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    I don't think I have a strong preference either way but IDW and Exodus had decent ideas even if I think someone could take the ideas in these stories and do them better.

    In Exodus Orion was basically Martin Luthor King Jr. while Megatron was Malcolm X, which I enjoyed even if it's a bit too similar to Professor X and Magneto's whole deal.
     
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  7. Chaos Studios

    Chaos Studios Well-Known Member

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    Im not a big fan of making megatron and the cons this magneto/malcom x type faction because if so youd have to tone down ALOT of the evil scummy shit that the cons have done through out the war, this is why (while i like the concept) I cant get behind autobot megatron in IDW because the amount of HORRID shit he willingly let happen like grindcore and the MANY genocides that would make magneto and malcom x vomit from disgust that they would be compared to him.
     
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  8. Novaburnhilde

    Novaburnhilde シン・ブリュンヒルド

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    I hear you, man. I tend to believe that Autobot Megs was a huge mistake and probably did more damage to Megatron as a character than it added anything, the more you break it down and analyze it the less and less it makes sense in-universe, and the more things have to just be ignored or brushed aside for it to work. :/
     
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  9. Megastar

    Megastar Well-Known Member

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    I like the idea of Megatron becoming an Autobot just not how it happened, like if the Decepticons splintered into separate factions and those factions went around committing the genocides and he became disgusted at what they became and defected to the Autobots as a form of atonement and to hunt down rogue cons, maybe could've worked better.
     
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2021
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  10. Chaos Studios

    Chaos Studios Well-Known Member

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    Its not even that its impossible because when you look at it, they couldve had megatron be this malcom x type character at the start but after time and as the war continued he pretty much evolved into the very thing he was fighting against while optimus/orion would be fighting for the imaginary peace that he believed existed on cybertron, but after time he slowly adopts the ideals of what megatron's original beliefs were, ironic but poetic. But again I aint a writer so what do I know lol.
    :bay 
     
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  11. Nova Maximus

    Nova Maximus Well-Known Member

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    I don't see how Autobot Megs has done any more damage to the character as anything else that's involved Megatron. It was one interpretation in comic form that hasn't been replicated before or since.

    What I can find people don't like about Megatron (and I'll admit I'm starting to get annoyed by with WFC doing it again) is ever new incarnation of Megatron and the Decepticons has been largely the same since aligned copied then-Dreamwave-into-IDW's take on them with the "Optimus and Megatron as friends" thrown in since 2010-ish cause they can't seem to be creative enough to think of their own origin.
    It's why I'm thankful IDW2 actually tried something new with Megatron pleading the innocent Senator card while funding his own terrorist organization to seize power.
     
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  12. Furnace

    Furnace Ant-droid at a picnic

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    Generally speaking, I prefer it when mortal enemies start off on opposite ends of a conflict and through battle, come to a begrudging respect for one another (while still remaining enemies). Because of this, I would like for Optimus Prime and Megatron not to have a history prior to the war. Optimus would learn to understand Megatron, even have compassion for him, while Megatron would be forced to admit that Optimus is not the weakling he first thought him to be.

    That being said, I do think the brothers-turned-foes backstory can be quite compelling. But after a decade or so of this story being at the forefront of TF media, I think it might be time to switch things up a bit (even if, ironically, this means returning to an older model).
     
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  13. Rojixus

    Rojixus I AM NOT YOUR ENEMY!

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    If anyone should get the friends-to-enemies backstory, it should be Starscream and Jetfire.
     
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  14. Megastar

    Megastar Well-Known Member

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    I think that would make a much better lovers-to-enemies story; like they both joined the Decepticons, but Starscream became corrupted by Megatron's evil and Jetfire couldn't stand by him anymore and defected to the Autobots.
     
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  15. Pravus Prime

    Pravus Prime Wields Mjolnir!

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    Megatron and Orion Pax were the Hawk and Dove of Cybertrons leadership. Megatron, pragmatic and ruthless combined with Orion's optimism and patience made for a solid and popular foundation that allowed Cybertron to flourish unlike any era that had come before it, their marriage was the stuff of legends. Until Orion was caught having an affair with her sibling, Elita-1. Soured, they filed for divorce. The foundation cracked, everyone took sides in the divorce. The military arm siding with Megatron over the betrayal while the artisons guild siding with the freedom of affection with Orion, as everyone started to weigh in, it was only a matter of time until an intoxicated argument led to bloodshed, the issue polarizing further, until everyone was factionalized. Undergoing a combat upgrade, Optimus Prime and his no-longer sisterhood, but battle ready Autobots, fighting for the matters of the heart are ready to properly fight the tired military.

    What a messy breakup, the entire planet went to war over it.

    :D :rolleyes: 
     
    Last edited: Jul 21, 2021
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  16. CyberstormSM

    CyberstormSM Turbo-Revvin' Young Punk

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    One idea I had was that Optimus was a public defender before the war, and there would be one particularly important case where the defendant was none other than a young Megatron.
     
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  17. AStreetcarNamedWheeljack

    AStreetcarNamedWheeljack Well-Known Member

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    There was a ton of homo erotic tension prior to the war, but they never acted on it due to Cybertron's high council being extremely conservative at the time.
     
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  18. Rewind Eject

    Rewind Eject Still no war in Ba Sing Se

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    In my universe, they were politically opposed but it took some time into the war for them to meet in battle and make it personal.
     
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  19. SuperSunnyDee

    SuperSunnyDee Sense is like cheesecake.

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    I personally never cared for the idea of Optimus and Megatron being friends before the war or Megatron being responsible for creating his worst enemy or anything like that.

    I’d just have it where the two never met until the war occurred. Optimus would probably be aware of Megatron considering his rising status, and maybe they have one or two interactions. But I just prefer the idea of Megatron being a rising threat, Optimus lived his own life and made waves in his own way, but stepped up once Megatron makes his big move.
     
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  20. SuperSunnyDee

    SuperSunnyDee Sense is like cheesecake.

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    I think the underdog trope is somewhat needed, since it’s very hard to create a sense of danger if the protagonist has too strong of an upper hand.
    I think Animated pulled it off well because the Decepticons were portrayed as being very powerful, having only lost because of some tactical advantages the Autobots did eventually lose. They were underdogs but were really only a few calculated steps away from winning back Cybertron.
     
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