WFC (Siege, ER & possibly Kingdom)figures YELLOWING quickly

Discussion in 'Transformers Toy Discussion' started by deathzero23, Aug 23, 2021.

  1. SovereignKnight

    SovereignKnight Well-Known Member

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    Yes. I have a few that have not yellowed. 86 Jazz, WFC Siege Jetfire, one of two of the Top Gun Maverick reissues, so far 86 Ratchet looks fine, Siege Optimus Prime is fine. I'm sure there others but I can't think of them ATM.
     
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  2. SovereignKnight

    SovereignKnight Well-Known Member

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    Speaking of Top Gun Maverick reissues, here is the before and after of the one single part that yellowed, before the Retrobtight process.

    Top: Comparison to the opposite part.
    Mid: The yellowed part.
    Bottom: 16 hours of Retrobrighting. 1000012805.jpg 1000012809.jpg 1000012843.jpg
     
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  3. Cool Hand Lube

    Cool Hand Lube Well-Known Member

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    I'm still skeptical about the Jazz examples we've seen as most of them look more like mismatched plastic as opposed to outright yellowing.

    OG Siege Jetfire is not known to yellow as the issue did not become prevalent until midway through Earthrise. The later reissues are fair game for yellowing though as they would have been manufactured during or after Earthrise.

    The SS86 Ratchets yellowing were on the painted parts, which I thought super weird, until you posted that article about the LEDs burning the drives inside gamers' CPUs. Then that started to make more sense as it looked similarly yellowed or scorched to those examples from your article.

    And yeah, unfortunately all versions of Maverick are known to yellow. Not surprising considering that weird, almost soapy plastic they used on him. It looked cheap and compromised straight out of the box IMO.

    So he's going to need the super long soak like the Quintesson Judge did? Or is it penetrated too deeply into the plastic?


    BTW, thanks for taking the leap on this. These results are fascinating!
     
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  4. SovereignKnight

    SovereignKnight Well-Known Member

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    16 hours is what it took to remove the yellowing, with my setup. I tried only 6 hours initially and it made nearly zero impact. Notice how the Retrobrighting didn't destroy the tampographed dirt..
     
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  5. Cool Hand Lube

    Cool Hand Lube Well-Known Member

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    Oh! I thought those smudges in your last pic was patches of yellowing, but it's actually the tampographed "dirt". So it did come through OK after the longer soak, similarly to Quint Judge.

    Are you noticing any differences (texture, weight/density, etc.) between the items that "unyellow" more quickly than those that require longer dunks?
     
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  6. Denzimus

    Denzimus Well-Known Member

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    Are ER Grapple and Kingdom Inferno safe? Been thinking about getting those two
     
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  7. Cool Hand Lube

    Cool Hand Lube Well-Known Member

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    Grapple is not safe, he turns a gross poopy brownish-orange. I don't know that we've seen Inferno yellowing, but he would have been manufactured in the window (mid-Earthrise to now) so it wouldn't surprise me if he yellowed, as well
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2024
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  8. Astrotanker

    Astrotanker Well-Known Member

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    Hey guys , I'm just wondering if anyone in this thread had any success in painting the yellowed ABS plastic on yellowing figures with a modelling primer and modelling paint without issues?
     
  9. Astrotanker

    Astrotanker Well-Known Member

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    My Grapple's abs parts has turned abit dark I believe my Inferno is completely fine.
     
  10. Cool Hand Lube

    Cool Hand Lube Well-Known Member

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    You can absolutely paint over the yellowing. The big unknown in doing so is that we have no clue about what kind of structural integrity issues this yellowed plastic has in the same way typical photodegraded plastic does. Typical photodegraded plastics can become brittle and shatter more easily.

    I believe @SovereignKnight encountered some brittle, rapidly-yellowed plastic when attempting to disassemble a figure (Blaster I believe?) for a dunk into the RetroBright goo.

    Like anything else around this issue we have more questions than answers unfortunately.
     
  11. Nekoman

    Nekoman Well-Known Member

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    Not safe per se, but not commonly discoloring either. One thing I don't see get brought up so often, is how the yellowing is super frequent and common for some figures, but much rarer on others. Take for example, Kingdom Tigatron is one that seems to turn on people who often don't have issues with any other figure. In my own collection, I've had ER Grapple stored in the exact same conditions as Netflix Soundwave, SG Starscream and the aforementioned Tigatron: the later three have all discolored a tiny bit, but Grapple (along with NF Nemesis Prime, Dinobot, Origins BB and some others) remain pristine.

    Also, think about how we know Legacy Bulkhead yellows, but not so many people report it.

    A year or two ago I was operating under the assumption it was just a matter of time before all of my figures turn, but now it doesn't seem to be the case.

    Oddly, another thing I wanted to note was that the figures seem to produce a slight smell. I got afraid once my Soundwave started turning he might damage the other figures near him so I chucked him in a plastic bag. Years later it hasn't seemed to hasten the yellowing (it's still there, but just at dark grey), but when I open the bag and smell, it smells funny. Like certain kinds of Rubbermaid tubs or cheap pine-scented cleaner... So they're gassing off something.
     
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  12. Cool Hand Lube

    Cool Hand Lube Well-Known Member

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    *big shrug* We've seen quite a few examples and reports of both Grapple and Bulkhead. I'd say theyre just as likely as any of the other commonly rapid yellowing figure in a given collector's collection who has the issue. But I do absolutely find the whole "this figure yellowed next to another known victim who isn't yellowing at all," thing just freaking mind boggling and you're not alone in describing that. Like, that makes zero sense from any standpoint from my admittedly limited knowledge of chemistry and plastics sciences.

    Again, mind boggling. Super weird, and I'm genuinely curious as to how this whole thing works. Keep us posted if there are any changes!

    Super weird! I think this is the first example I can remember that had their yellowed figures in a sealed bag. Is it that kind of general "new plastic-y smell"? So it makes sense that it is off-gassing, but being in a sealed bag means it would have been exposed to less of any/whatever environmental factor if there is one that is acting as a catalyst, while simultaneously keeping that off-gassed chemical in the bag. Did you also notice any fluid/goo leaching from those slightly yellowed parts, especially around pins?
     
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  13. Nekoman

    Nekoman Well-Known Member

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    Only thing that could make sense is just that some of the plastics are more compromised than others. Brainstorming a bit: if they're using some kind of recycled plastic pellets that cause the issue, there might be more bad pellets in some figures than others. It seems lighter colored plastics are easier to recycle than colored and especially black ones. So perhaps the severity of the issue is exacerbated in figures like Tigatron, SG Starscream and Cyclonus's joints.

    Also, that wouldn't be to say there's "good batches", but that the figures are compromised on different levels based on color/pigment... Dunno, just seems like "All of my figures were fine, but yesterday I checked Tigatron-" has been a recurring theme here.

    How many black or very dark colored figures have been effected? Dinobot's the darkest I can think of at the moment.

    The smell isn't like new plastic, it's much nastier... I hesitate to say it, but it's much more like recycled plastic smell. No fluid or goo coming out, but I couldn't tell if he felt somewhat oily. It's also the second time I've smelt this too, as I pulled him out 6-months ago and smelt it then.
     
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  14. Cool Hand Lube

    Cool Hand Lube Well-Known Member

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    I think you're 100% right in that there's definitely something compromised in the base plastic formulation itself, whatever that may be. Recycled/reclaimed plastic? Some chemical UV stabilizer added incorrectly or outright omitted/missing? Some kind of cleaner or mold release agent or something else used on the molds at the wrong levels or used incorrectly? Who the hell knows?

    (HINT: currently it's the last one :lol )

    And come to think of it, I don't think I can recall an actual black figure yellowing either. We have seen multiple figures of various colors beyond white like G2 Ramjet, Origins BB, Cyberverse Hammerstrike, Cyberverse Arcee, Selects G2 Sandstorm, Selects Cyclonus' purple wing hinges, the aforementioned Grapple and others.

    Seriously weird. The reason I asked about the brown goo is we've gotten a few reports of that happening in conjunction with the yellowing on several figures. Do you recall if the nasty chemical smell intensified since six months ago?

    And @SovereignKnight, would you have a bag handy to toss one of your recently "de-yellowfied" figures into? May be interesting to see if that slows or hinders the re-yellowing, or has any effect at all.
     
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  15. SovereignKnight

    SovereignKnight Well-Known Member

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    So far, No. And the Quintesson chin/face mask latches are just as flexible as they was before the treatment. The plastic did not feel like it became brittle at all, or change in density.
     
  16. SovereignKnight

    SovereignKnight Well-Known Member

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    Here's what my Grapple, Inferno and Road Hauler look like. Road Hauler got the worst end of it, as he has some brown tinging on his crane box base and on the front rim, along with some kind of orange stuff on a sprue mark, while Grapple and Inferno changed to slightly darker colors and no longer match the rest of the plastic. Road Hauler is the only one with brown tinge marks and a dirty green. 1000012865.jpg 1000012866.jpg 1000012867.jpg 1000012868.jpg 1000012869.jpg 1000012870.jpg
     
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  17. SovereignKnight

    SovereignKnight Well-Known Member

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    Also, my Siege Optimus's gray plastic is fine, while I saw another person's post of the same figure, turn brown.
    1000012871.jpg
     
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  18. SovereignKnight

    SovereignKnight Well-Known Member

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    Here's an update to MavericK's (second release) de yellowed part after 20 hours total. I'll show before and after.

    Pictures in order from beginning (Top) to end (Bottom). 1000012777.jpg 1000012805.jpg 1000012809.jpg 1000012858.jpg 1000012862.jpg 1000012863.jpg
     
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  19. SovereignKnight

    SovereignKnight Well-Known Member

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    I had a sealed Netflix Soundwave that was fine initially, but it started to show signs of discoloring just a few months later. I chucked it back on eBay for someone else who doesn't really care about the change. It sold. I was holding out for the Nemesis Bridge Soundwave, but after seeing reviews, the plastic just happens to look like the plastic I had on all 4 of the Netflix versions. They started out nice and clean, whitish gray, and then turned a dirty caramel brown. I had to cancel both pre-orders as I didn't want to take the chance. Now I'm left in the air as to figure out what to do with a proper Soundwave replacement. Third party doesn't exactly make a WFC/Earthrise to scale alternative. So the closest I have to stand in is a 40th Anniversary Soundwave for the time being. Not exactly a modern look, and to scale, but it's only slightly bigger. I hear there's a Leader class Soundwave coming, but it is not clear if it is a G1 version. At least according to Gotbot.
     
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  20. Dinowave

    Dinowave Well-Known Member

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    I guess there are some mythical copies of certain toys that are safe from yellowing, if it's from the Siege line. Maybe the initial batches before Earthrise or something.

    Mine is yellowing so much and it's uneven on some parts. Yet, my Kingdom Blaster, Velocitron Road Hauler, Kingdom Dinobot are all fine. My Grapple looks bad though.

    I can see why you were against the theory that it was bad plastic + environmental that cause accelerated yellowing, cause if I have a Siege Optimus looking like your copy, I would think that too.
     
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