I've noticed what feels like a gradually increasing trend the last couple of years - but even mores recently of Hasbro not "sealing the deal" on alt modes: Some examples include SS86 Hot Rod and Scourges back ends, WFC Ultra Magnus' arms just hanging off the back, the entire robot mode of the Siege seeker hanging under the fuselage with nary a part integrated into the alt mode, Spinister's bizarre extra cockpit hanging off the bottom, Earthrise Sunstreakers lack of spoiler and generally unfinished looking car mode, SS86 Jazz's toes, SS86 Grimlock's gappyness and the one that got my really considering it, Kingdom Huffers hands just existing there flipped 90° inward, but not really hidden in any way shaper or form. (not to mention the Arcce molds insane level of partsforming)
I mean, most of this isn't Energon Ironhide bad (but what is  )

Just starting to feel like in some cases, with their obviously reduced budgets and materials usage and increased desire for fidelity to the animation models, they're skimping out on the alt modes, which were always just as important to me* (the whole idea of "a model car that has a robot hidden inside it" was a big part of the OG appeal of TFs to me and continues to this day). And while I totally get in a mainline toy, there's always going to be some compromises (visible seems and joints and such, Boxes underneath sleek jet fighters, Prime's habit of having his toes sticking out the back end), but some of these seem over the top, and kind of like things just got put out 75% finished. I find Hot Rod particularly egregious when they're charging 150% the normal price for a deluxe figure. And Huffer REALLY seems like they could have come up with a more elegant solution**, especially given the size and simplicity of that mold.

What do you think? are the over-prioritizing robot at the cost of the alt modes? are you ok with it? Where does the alt mode rank in importance for you?

I'd certainly always take a bit more vehicle kibble on the 'bot mode for a more cohesive alt mode.

*still hate that they pack them in robot mode now

**Remembering the absolute wizardry of the ROTF/DOTM era Terradive/Space Case mold

 

you left off the 2 worse offenders of this as of recent... earthrise ironhide and earthrise ratchet with there giant robot mode feet just hanging off the back of the van mode

 

Personally I can more than deal with a couple points on an alt mode (especially areas like underneath or at the back) looking a bit off to get the best looking bot we can at these retail prices.

 

I think that's the tradeoff of greater articulation with a limited parts count. If you add one articulation joint, you lose one transformation joint (unless you get clever and make them the same thing).

 

to be honest this is something that makes me weigh up if a new toy is better than an old one, most the time latly the old toys are coming up in top, lets take henkie ironhide vs siege, only place siege has betterd henkie one is the head placement and the design of the arms not being what ever they where going for with the henkie, the chest the legs the sholders the alt mode all go the henkie, i like the head of the old toy more as well design wise just not where it gets placed, i also like the old weapon more

 

Hot Rod, Jazz, Arcee and Scourge are the result of prioritising accuracy over the alt mode

Siege Seeker is a stylized take of the tetrajets. IDK why does anyone want a toon accurate one, because dear lord Impossible toys' version is just a yikes

Magnus and ER van bros are the result of trying to prioritise bot modes and the fact that the original nature of their mold really restricts them from doing so. Besides, most of these issues are already inherent in the Siege mold, and he's still regarded as the best Magnus.

ER Sunstreaker is to avoid copyright infringement. It is literally 2 plastic pieces away from a lawsuit.

Spinister's cockpit is because of the nature of his design. the original concept art does show it splitting in two, but I think they changed it to make the bot mode look better and to improve the weight when weaponized.

Huffers hands aren't too big of an issue since the cab hides it well.

Besides, we've seen a lot worse. CW Onslaught, CW voyager jet torso are a LOT more offensive.

This

 

Here in Studio Series we have a lot of similar problems. I noticed that since SS and WFC began Hasbro has been sacrificing alt-modes for better robot modes. Hasbro couldn't have possibly made a bot as amazing as this in the CHUG/ROTF days:

But they also would've never made an alt-mode that looked like this:

It's a tradeoff, and IMO they're doing the best they can at their limitations.

This problem is even in MPMs. Borrowing a pic from a neighbouring thread, I don't think you need Google to see how fucked up those MPM Hummer proportions are, supposedly, in the name of robot-mode accuracy. While MPM Ratchet's definitely more accurate than the Voyager, did it really need to come at the cost of ruining the alt-mode when so many past figures could do both modes just fine?

 

This is a bit of a frustrating trend. I would also point out the lack of teeth on Dinobot and Grimlock, which is just a baffling decision.

 

good point - I meant to mention them, although I would place the blame on the Siege molds, of which the poor feet are vestigial remains – I'm willing to cut the Earthrise Vans a fair amount of slack given the amount of remolding they did
(although it's almost to the point you'd wonder if they should have just been new molds)
(they REALLY should have done SOMETHING with those feet though)

the current retail prices continue to be a big part of my issue: we've never paid more and gotten less.

agreed - it's why I'd never replace the Uni Lambos with the WFC ones (but I have gotten the Dicalone repaints since those characters didn't have representation)

but I can't quite agree here. I really didn't like the Universe Ironhide/Ratchet mold.. just a mess. love the concept, but the jigsaw puzzle transformation and weird proportions of the bot mode bummed me out so much I never got Ironhide after getting Ratchet.

Seige version is pretty yikes too. in both modes.

LOL, oh, I know but I still think they could have made it look more cohesive. The Lambo mode of the Uni 2.0 version is spectacular.

oh, I know that, but it was a bizarre trade off to me. a full fake second cockpit just hanging there. Super weird looking and nearly ruins the figure for me (despite the epic 'bot mode)

Accuracy in alt mode though IS part of Accuracy in my opinion... Hot Rod and Scourge seem like they could have figured SOMETHING more elegant out, Jazz I'm sure they could have defined a better transformation for those feet (they've done it before)
Arcee's just inexcusable. like, literally no excuse after what they did with the T30 version. I can't even consider her a Transformer, but she's kind of an aside to this topic. (but – when her alt mode is a giant shell you discard, why is it so bad and inaccurate???)

agreed - I almost have to believe - with it on both of them that - it must be for some kind of safety regulation? otherwise it's truly bizarre...

 

Kibble is a fact of life for a lot of TF alt modes, just pretend it's not there as you re-create battle scenes.

 

I absolutely hate this trend. I'm not a fan of show accuracy anyway, and that Hasbro is prioritizing it over a decent altmode makes me dislike it even more. Hot Rod is an especially egregious case for me, given we have two earlier versions which cost 1/3 of the SS86 version, yet have much better altmodes, better articulation, and are sturdier. At 3x the price of TR and Classics, SS86 Hot Rod should have been better across the board, without having to sacrifice the altmode and shoulder joints on the altar of the sacred animation models.

A altmode is just as important as a good robot mode. And given I don't give a damn about perfectly matching the cartoon, I'd much rather have visible kibble and other "inaccuracies" if it means a complete-looking altmode.

As it is, the altmodes aren't much better than standard Cyberverse.

Totally.

 

yeah compromised alt modes are nothing new but there have been some pretty ugly examples lately. And even non-cosmetic things like the lack of landing gear on the Earthrise seekers.

I’d like to see a new line that places a lot of importance on good-looking alt modes, like Alternators or early MP, even if it means some compromises for robot mode.

 

what the hell is this? the horrible wide hips and barely disguised humanoid legs are bad enough, but then there's the tail which is just... a gappy assortment of other bits. the ko's at least fix the tail, but even in hand the legs and the permanently open dino mouth kill the dino mode.

 

I don't think anyone is saying the problem didn't crop up before, but it's a lot more prevalent now.

 

i mean grimlock's from 2018, i'd consider that recent enough to be part of the trend. especially since his line's still going on.

 

AH, ok. I thought it was the AOE Grimlock, rather than SS. But it's still more common in WFC than in prior lines.

 

I think it really depends on the figure in question, like yeah it’s a shame that SS86 Hot Rod doesn’t really have a bumper but I’m pretty happy with most of the rest of the figure so it ends up being a minor quibble for me. Something like Earthrise Ironhide and Kingdom Mangus definitely pushes it a bit too far for me were it’s clear that all the retooling was mostly for the robot modes, leaving the vehicle modes looking not as polished in comparison and they do suffer for it.

All that being said if I’m being entirely honest with myself, these things are primarily gonna live their lives on a shelf in robot mode, with only the occasional transformation, anyways so I’m willing to deal with some iffyness with the alternative modes to a degree. At the very least nothing from WFC comes close to being as bad as POTP Optimus, Grimlock, and Starscream in terms of poor alt modes IMO.

 

I was expecting this to be about unused tabs and holes on alt modes
Looking at TR Chromedome as an example he has clear holes for a spoiler at the back and tabs for a lightbar i guess on the roof

 

Yeah. Stuff like Sunstreaker not having a spoiler, or SS Hot Rod or Scourge having stuff sticking out the back of their alt mode isn't going to bother me. It's an angle I'm pretty much never going to display it from or spend much time looking at. Even stuff like Hoist's visible fists under his truck aren't a big deal to me. These are all at least trying to minimize the impact of the parts they can't hide of fold away.

That being said, there are definitely examples out there where this is more egregious than others. Power of the Primes Rodimus Prime, for example, with the fists just sticking out above the cab.

 

I'm someone who does play with my toys, for my comic, rather than just leaving them on the shelf in robot mode. So I like the altmodes to be passable at least.

I'm kind of of opposite opinion about the POTP Optimus, Grimlock and Starscream. I'm more willing to give the altmode a little more leeway because of everything those toys do. Each of them have multiple modes. The cab on Optimus forms Orion and the core of the Optimus Prime mode (though it should have taken some cues from G1 PMOP about how to do it more cleanly.) Grimlock and Starscream are combiner cores, and have to accommodate that third mode. Heck, the compromises for Grim and Scream are pretty much essential for that third mode - the extra bulk comes from incorporating the combiner connections, gestalt head, etc.

Meanwhile, Hot Rod, Cyclonus, Sunstreaker, Ironhide/Ratchet and the like only have to transform from vehicle to robot. Even Ultra Magnus really only has two modes - the armor mostly just clips onto the robot. But Hasbro/Takara can't make both of the modes solid? Yet they used to be able to make both modes decent, so what happened? Why have they recently been half-assing the vehicle?