Discussion in 'Transformers News and Rumors' started by chchchch, Oct 18, 2019.
The never ending cycle but I'll repeat it again, if 3p can why TT can't?
Yeah but those are BIGGER combiners.
My point exactly.
Raiden is nifty, and I hope those who like the combiner are happy with how all 6 of these come out, but it's not for me. I LIKE the look of the combiner / individuals, but I just got VS for less than the price of ONE of the SIX trains. At $20-$30 per character I'd be highly tempted. At $200+ each I'm going to hard pass...
Got to consider the licensing for the realistic train likenesses. That is why BB2.0 costs so much for a tiny bot.
Not that much bigger though. Size isn't everything, but if they're really about the size of Ironhide then they're big enough.
Did we ever learnwhat the "g" is in "mpg"? I'm US-based so I'm biased toward English, but the best i could come up with is "masterpiece group."
Gattai, meaning Combiner
These are Ironhide-sized licensed triple changers. ~$180 is perfectly in line with current MP prices. I don't know why people expect these to be CHUG-priced.
The first post has been updated now so it has all the news up to now. Also has links to where you can get Shouki from.
Still it's bigger and the individual members will be bigger too. Basically you are not comparing apples vs apples. If you take size into account then yeah this is a more than 1000+ dollars combiner.
It’s a mystery. I feel like most of the pricing complaints come from folks that don’t buy (modern) Masterpieces in the first place. So what they’re doing in this thread I have no idea..
Ok so I feel like I needed to at least come back and give a more genuine response. Sorry if this came off as rather dickish, I originally meant this as a bit of a light-hearted hyperbolic version of my actual take as to grant a wish of a friend of mine after my leave of absence, but at the same time be honest with my opinion. But I wanted to at least make up for if my earlier message didn't come as clear as it did and was more harshly received, hopefully this serves as sort of an apology for those who took it as such.
I'm not getting this set. Nope. I'm absolutely not a fan. I'm ecstatic for the ones who're going in for this and I wish you all the best of luck, but Moon Studio has me in for 2 sets at this point. Here's why.
And fair warning, this is going to be very harsh, because i'm not happy. Frankly i'm pissed at the final product. So I apologize in behalf for how some of this might come across. I wanted to like this, I want this to be great, but I don't see either happening any one bit.
I love Takara, but I feel that they dropped the ball HARD with Raiden.
I bought MP-44 for $450, I bought MP-52 for $280, I bought MP-45 for $120, and i'm buying the other 2 Seekers for $240. I think they were all worth their prices, which to some seemed inflated. But Shouki going for $210 (before anyone says "OH BUT YOU CAN JUST GET IT FOR CHEAPER ON AJP", I don't shop with Amazon Japan, let alone any overseas seller for Takara Masterpiece, I go domestic or bust for these), honestly makes me feel robbed blind. While the train mode looks awesome, I think Shouki falls flat on his face otherwise. A horrid backpack, one i'd argue ended up worse than Bee and Arcee, followed up with the most jarring part for me, an absolute lack of accessories. I expected the usual Takara fare, at least 2 extra faceplates and blast effects, but Takara didn't even give us that. Yes, this thing is technically a triple-changer so the parts count is gonna be higher and there's more engineering at play, frankly I think they could've put a lot more of their engineering black magic into this to end up looking way cleaner.
The other kicker for me is that they still have QC problems lingering with Starscream even after the catastrophic and pathetic failure of Hound. There was certainly an improvement between Hound and Starscream, but if Takara doesn't get their shit together on a gigantic scale, who knows if Shouki, and in the end Raiden as a whole, could become the new Hound?
And speaking of Raiden, UW size was already a turn-off, but the kibbly foot wings (thanks to @TCJJ for his brightened photo pointing this out) and the proportions just looking off are the icing on the cake.
But now I have to address the competition. And I feel like I have to start probably the most apparent fact when looking at both.
Half the price, cleaner bots, a drop-dead gorgeous Raiden and a squeaky clean track record to go off of.
Especially after having Superitron arrive recently and be a fantastic first foray into Zeta's combiners, i'm sorry, but I think Takara has officially had it's ass beat and handed back to them by Zeta without mercy, by way of a single metaphorical fuck you gut punch.
Again, I absolutely love Takara, and i'm VERY happy for anyone who is excited for this thing, if you like it you win of course. I still firmly believe that at the end of the day, while they've created the best MP aesthetic out there and they have the capability of producing the best product in the MP game, it's their denial to make worthwhile sacrifices, and i'd also argue, their limitations put onto themselves by the dependency of licensing that holds them back from being able to create something amazing. They did it with MP-44, and I think they can do it again. But they need to get their shit together, and this is certainly not an example of such.
And with that, i'm already getting tired of things, sorry to sound like a dick if I did, wishing everyone who's going in on this the absolute best, i'm done.
There's really no need to apologise for pointing out what are some pretty blatant issues this set has. It ultimately depends on where your priorities lie. If you're a train fan, require the combiner to be mostly self contained and/or you're morally against 3p, Takara's attempt is probably the more appealing purchase. The realistic train mode really does seem to be the biggest draw though so it's probably a bit of a hard sell for anyone that doesn't care for that sort of thing, myself included.
Yeah, I think the size and price are fine and in-line with the current MP line, but the design is closer to Skids or Prowl Hasui era characters (and that’s who they display him with).
The toon style looks simpler but has more parts and complicated transformations (ie:more expensive). Shouki has the paint of modern MP but otherwise looks more Skids than Sunstreaker, so the price feels off.
I’m sure it’s because of the complication of the combination but if it’s designed to be an all-in-one transformation, I feel like they’ve unnecessarily complicated and shrunk the combined mode to keep large robot head/hands and feet built into the individuals.
For me, the most appealing aspect is how Shouki’s robot sculpt turned out. Looks close enough to the anime and chunky without being as blocky as the G1 toy.
What would really sell me is how stable Raiden is when posed in dynamic action stances. Takara had good ideas behind the CW/UW combiners but they couldn’t pose the way I’d like without falling over. Maybe I’ll change my mind later but I’ve yet to preorder Shouki, as good as I think it looks(I like that it’s made to scale with some model trains too). Yea the late tax will be high but 2 years out from now I think I’d be more willing to wait and see how stable Raiden turns out before committing. Plus this is Takara’s 1st official attempt at an MP combiner in the MP line(I don’t count CW/UW Devastator even though Hasui designed it as a placeholder of sorts). If Takara doesn’t get it right with Raiden maybe they will with the combiner afterwards.
No need to explain yourself and apologise - you are entitled to your opinion! TT Raiden seems pretty dividing for sure. I guess not intending to meet (or being unable to meet) all MP expectations (some of those set by 3P, so why would they anyway?) is partly why this is a new sub-line and not 'regular' MP.
For me I love the individual TT bots (well, the one we seen so far) and it seems like that is their priority. Shouki is supposed to have stocky proportions and that cape-o-kibble - he's very toon accurate in that regard - whereas MS Shouki is super idealised and heroic proportioned which is really inaccurate. Their other bots look a bit more accurate as those guys do have more 'normal' proportions.
You might know I'm a bit of a real world alt mode fan. Not a train guy really, definitely a car guy, but enough of a fan of accurate alt modes I just can't get past MS' chibi trains. Not. At. All. While TT's trains are obviously gonna be perfection as that was clearly priority no. 1!
Combined mode MS seems to have TT beat for sure in the size and looks department, from what we see so far. Seems that was their priority no.1, and it shows. Gonna look great on a shelf with other 3P 20+" combiners. I'm kinda disappointed with TT's combined mode, if what we see so far is representative, especially if my size estimation of only 13" ends up correct. On the flip size TT Raiden will probably be a load more fun to handle and mess with being a smaller size. My XTB Menasor looks great, but sure ain't any fun!
On that basis, I don't hold much hope for other TT combiners being giants either. Seems like maybe they had a bunch of discussion, maybe even experimentation, and decided smaller combiners are gonna be their sweet spot, and screw following a path carved out by 3P, if they even considered 3P at all. Not good news for those invested in 3P 20+" combiners, but might work out for TT. I hope so.
Where I'm not right with you is people complaining about the price when they don't use the cheaper options available. Don't get it. Especially when one of the cheaper options is Amazon with impeccable customer service and returns. I mean I do get preferring domestic sellers, but if you do you can't really complain about their high markups - that's your choice. Shouki is 127 USD on AE plus shipping. Folk are at 150-something shipped with tax on AMJ and it may drop even further. It is no where near 'twice the cost' of the 3P!
They unfortunately closed that possibility here earlier this year AND removed the lower limit. So basically every single package gets taxed. Thanks EU.
MPG = MasterPiece G, where G can stand for Gattai, Giant and/or Great.
Different goals. I think both solutions can coexist and I am strongly considering getting both.
This is an important point. Will all future MPG figures cost this much or is this price mainly due to the licensing?
Not a surprise, this is the first official modern Raiden since G1. Similar to how MP-24 was the only proper Star Saber update since G1 with no CHUG alternative until Haslab. I understand where they're coming from, taking import duties into account, MP-24 is still my most expensive single figure purchase to date.
Not super happy about the price but I am really happy about the design direction.
This is where different individual value assessments come into play. I very specifically didn't buy MP-44/45/52 because I thought that $400+ for panel origami and $250+ for a fake jet canopy to be absolutely ridiculous. Not willing to shop elsewhere is 100% your decision/failing though. If I stuck to EU shops I wouldn't have half of my current collection. Probably saved several hundred to $1000+ by shopping elsewhere.
It's very toy and animation accurate though.
The more I examine the reveals the more I appreciate the little details. The designers really went the extra mile here.
We don't know what size he will be. Otherwise fully agreed on the foot wings, looks crap.
If the Zeta bots end up being good I'll probably get those as well, so I'm really neutral here. I agree with you on their track record regarding solidity, joints, stability etc., however, this is the company best known for pantsforming that we're talking about. Pantsforming is, I feel, the absolute worst concept in all of transforming robots in history. A fecal whirlwind of fake parts and partsforming.
Agreed on the licensing potentially holding them back.
MP-44 is a matter of taste though. I think it has a subpar vehicle mode, underwhelming robot mode and ridiculous transformation that was easly beaten by e.g. Magic Square. So on my side at least, I really hope they don't "do it again".
I don't think that logic tracks as all the carbots were licensed too. Including the first MP Bumblebee.
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