Except you are wrong. Spider-Man Homecoming is on pace to do equal, at worst, internationally as ASM2 but likely surpass it. It's $130 million behind ASM2 and hasn't opened yet in China and Japan which accounted for $125 million of ASM2's foreign box office. If South Korea is a benchmark for its Asia performance, Homecoming outperformed ASM2 $52 to $33 million. If that holds true for China and Japan Homecoming will easily surpass ASM2 in foreign box office.

You can't claim that you like numbers and then not look at the actual numbers. Homecoming is going to outgross ASM2 by over $100 million when it's all said and done.

 

In foreign BO SMH sits at $377M and even with your $125M it would land around $500M, which is also around ASM2 $500M gross. I also noted "so far" into the sentence. I don't see where I made a mistake, but it looks like you misread my post. I highlighted that I was bringing up foreign BO, not international (which is a sum of the foreign and domestic gross). Besides, the subject of the discussion was whether there was a downward trend in BO gross for SM and TF movies and whether it could indicate franchise fatigue. If you consolidate the domestic or foreign gross data into a vector and calculate a trend line it will be going downward regardless of recent gross. I think you too quickly jumped the gun and you missed my previous posts, I explained it across them  

 

Yep, foreign release dates make a lot of comparisons harder...at least until a movie has full saturation (like TF does now)

I'd also say the box office is suffering because of how easy things like hacked Amazon Fire Sticks and other devices / websites have made it to watch pirated movies. In the old days having a 'black box' meant you could steal PPV and pay channels, but that didn't hurt the box office, other than that hitting up a flea market for what was likely a shaky cam bootleg was the main way to see new releases if you REALLY wanted to go that route. Now, the sites tell you how good / bad the rip is and will update you when a better one hits. Movies sometimes have perfect digital copies online as soon, or even before, their cinematic release.

Personally, I LIKE seeing movies on the big screen, but when movies are almost as much to see once in a theater as they are to OWN in a couple months when they hit BR / DVD or viewabe on demand it's not too hard to see why the box office is down no matter the quality of the movie. Though trends do seem to show that a lot of the questionable quality offerings seem to suffer a whole lot more.

 

Now you are engaging in a semantic argument attempting to dispute my definition of international vs foreign, rather than the actual argument, when it's clear that I am not talking about the total but just foreign.

And it's only a downward trend if you lump in the Sam Raimi films which aren't part of the discussion. Nobody has attempted at argue that those films arent more popular than Homecoming and are the benchmark for Spidey films, but we have a more recent Spidey film series between them. The decline was with the Amazing films but Homecoming is showing an upward trend. The Homecoming series doesn't have to exceed Raimi's films for it to show an increased interest from the Amazing films and an upward trend. Nobody could reasonably interpret that upward trend as franchise fatigue simply because the Raimi films performed so exceptionally high.

 

Nope. In my first post I brought up into the discussion all Spider-Man movies (including Raimi series) and separated their international gross into foreign and domestic numbers to estimate how the interest in SM movies looks stateside and outside of states. You simply jumped into the middle of discussion, missed the point (throwing in an insult just for the merit) and now you're shifting the goalpost. It's fine if you want to start a discussion on another subject, but please, refrain from claiming to know what I meant when I made my post better than me, especially, when I took my time to explain the difference between your point of view and mine. It's not sporty.

Here's the whole discussion. Everything you claim I missed or mispronounced is in there.

 

Now that the home date is confirmed I'd say it'd get worse...but it'll already likely to be out of the top 20 tomorrow at the rate it's going, passed by Captain Underpants and Jab Harry Met Sejal (Which I totally wrongly assumed was an Indian remake of When Harry Met Sally) yesterday. TF5 only pulled $90 per screen it was shown on yesterday, so about 7 people per theater for the entire day.

 

Tickets don't cost $13/person everywhere.

 

So maybe it was 10 people per theatre. Does that difference change anything?

 

Only one theater in my area remains (the $3.99 per ticket one). Only two showings a day.

 

Mathematically, yeah. It does.

 

No. The average movie theatre has a capacity of 200-300 people. Splitting the difference, there is no meaningful difference whether there are 7 out of 250 potential viewers or 10 out of 250 potential viewers.

 

But still, one should not assume a standard ticket price exists across the entire country when making a point about theatre attendance

 

No, you're wrong again. The assumption is certainly fine for the sake of discussion. How else do you discuss the idea of how many people likely saw it per theatre, based solely on gross sales in dollars, without picking one number for the ticket price and calculating number of tickets. Especially when the variance of whether the tickets were $8 or $13 doesn't lead to significantly different answers.

It's inherent in his statement that ticket prices vary. He made no assertion that all ticket prices were $13, he simply calculated an approximate amount of tickets sold based on a $13 ticket.

Your continued nitpick of an irrelevant point doesn't negate the actual point of his argument.

 

Part of the reason it's so bad that Hollywood only reports on the box office and not the number of tickets actually sold. The price variation can be insane so where I'm at I can get a ticket for $4.80 if it's before 6 pm. Other places in the US people might pay up to $20 for a movie ticket.

 

They do report attendance as a separate category in Japan. (In fact when I brought up the Japanese numbers I made sure to include the attendance) Though attendance does nothing for the bottom line for the studio...if 20 people pay $4 at a discount theater as opposed to 6-7 people paying $12 is all the same to the studios.

Not that it'll be relevant much longer since TF5 came in 27th this weekend and Box Office Mojo only tracks the top 32.

 

Yes it does.

 

They should have named it Transformers: The Law of Diminishing Returns.

 

Check out Hungary's numbers: Transformers: The Last Knight (2017) - International Box Office Results - Box Office Mojo
That's got to be a mistake. If it weren't a typo, TLK would not be as far behind.

 

Just shy of 600 million. Sounds about right.

 

Hungary's numbers seem to be off all over the site. I looked at many of the top movies and it's gotta be wrong across the board, there's no way Hungary is almost as big as China for box office turnout, especially when there's no logic to it...Spider-Man shows it made $167,000 for the opening weekend, but over 260,000,000 overall...Dunkirk shows it making $235,000 for it's opening weekend with a current total of $221,000,000 (75 mil more than the US and 11mil more than it says the movie has made overseas combined!)...and Girls Trip somehow scored 74mil...I have a tough time believing the demographics of Hungary are that rabid for Queen Latifah and Jada Smith