Studio Series 86 Wreck-Gar First Look

Discussion in 'Transformers News and Rumors' started by RickyLeeSTF, May 17, 2021.

  1. big420atx

    big420atx Member

    Joined:
    May 20, 2021
    Posts:
    11
    Trophy Points:
    2
    Likes:
    +17
    I would be interested in more junkions for a change.
     
    • Like Like x 4
  2. T-Hybrid

    T-Hybrid Zenryoku zenkai!

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2006
    Posts:
    26,131
    News Credits:
    40
    Trophy Points:
    412
    Location:
    Minnesota
    Likes:
    +39,309
    "Hasbro can't come up with their own designs..." is an odd defense of 3Ps when those groups steal existing HasTak characters to sell figures without sending a dime to any of the people who actually own the rights to them.

    But hey, I would *love* to see a 3P try to complain about something like this just to watch how quickly HasTak would be forced to drop the hammer and enforce it's IP rights. I mean, if FansToys really wants to be known as the group that killed 3P, I won't stop them.

    It's not a "circle." You maybe could claim HasTak was "stealing" ideas if they were modeling new figures after designs like TFC's Poseidon or Satan, or if they were basing stuff on Cross Dimension designs. Hell, if HasTak decided to make toys based on T-Beast it'd definately be a bad look.

    But when 3Ps are lifting designs straight out of the comics and cartoons with no original thought, what else is HasTak supposed to do? "Oh shoot we can't make a cartoon accurate Menasor now because a bunch of guys in China cobbled one together without any legal standing to do so."

    LAWL.
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2021
    • Like Like x 13
  3. Robogeek28

    Robogeek28 Proud grandpa

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2002
    Posts:
    52,436
    News Credits:
    20
    Trophy Points:
    437
    Location:
    Rotterdam NY
    Likes:
    +41,841
    Ebay:
    I hope they make at least one more Junkion after Junkheap....
     
    • Like Like x 7
  4. Blitz.

    Blitz. Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2009
    Posts:
    7,825
    News Credits:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    287
    Likes:
    +3,395
    Even if Hasbro "stole" the design (and I dont think they did) like... If people seem to be ok with the 3P/KO makers stealing Hasbro designs and improving on them I don't see why Hasbro cant take a 3P design and make it scalable for mass production, get it past all sorts of legal health and safety tests to then get it to a store suitable for kids to buy. I'm not saying that's exactly what happened but if it did I'd see no problem with it when they are the rights holders anyway. Basically it'd be 3p's getting played at their own game.
     
    • Like Like x 12
  5. Bob Schoonover

    Bob Schoonover Poorly-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2010
    Posts:
    6,505
    News Credits:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    287
    Likes:
    +12,555
    I would not be shocked at a Pulse exclusive troop builder. I think it was Marvel Legends Hydra troops that came with multiple heads? Anyway, Hasbro put together an awesome pack for whoever it was and I could see a two-pack with some extra parts to encourage multiple purchases
     
    • Like Like x 5
  6. Robogeek28

    Robogeek28 Proud grandpa

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2002
    Posts:
    52,436
    News Credits:
    20
    Trophy Points:
    437
    Location:
    Rotterdam NY
    Likes:
    +41,841
    Ebay:
    Oh god no....

    That would sell out long before it would be available to non Premium members....
     
    • Like Like x 3
  7. SPLIT LIP

    SPLIT LIP Be strong enough to be gentle

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2005
    Posts:
    90,535
    News Credits:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    462
    Location:
    agile house
    Likes:
    +66,743
    Instagram:
    Yeah, even though Wreck-gar is clearly not stealing from KFC, KFC already stole from Hasbro. If you're okay with one, you should be okay with both. :/
     
    • Like Like x 17
  8. Bob Schoonover

    Bob Schoonover Poorly-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2010
    Posts:
    6,505
    News Credits:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    287
    Likes:
    +12,555
    • Like Like x 4
  9. Robogeek28

    Robogeek28 Proud grandpa

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2002
    Posts:
    52,436
    News Credits:
    20
    Trophy Points:
    437
    Location:
    Rotterdam NY
    Likes:
    +41,841
    Ebay:
    • Like Like x 3
  10. bellpeppers

    bellpeppers A Meat Popsicle

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2008
    Posts:
    23,345
    News Credits:
    13
    Trophy Points:
    362
    Location:
    Somewhere over Macho Grande
    Likes:
    +17,406
    This.
    UL3P steals character likeness all the time. I wouldn’t care- In fact I would love- if HasTak “stole” them back.

    As I said in another thread, Wei Jaing’s factory was shut down. I’d wish HasTak would use their BB Movie Optimus parts and molds as opposed to what HasTak is actually selling in the MPM line.
     
    • Like Like x 4
  11. Ramberk Magnus

    Ramberk Magnus Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2003
    Posts:
    5,255
    Trophy Points:
    367
    Likes:
    +9,746
    I would argue that you’re talking about budget here and not actual size of the figure.

    You can have a very large figure with a meager budget and in turn crappy engineering and design. You can have a small figure with a larger budget and great engineering and design.

    I would argue, having a scale does force the designers to be more focused. When you plan a figure, you have an idea that it should be “voyager sized” and from there you can decide:

    (A) Tall Deluxe like Siege Ironhide?
    (B) Regular Voyager like Siege Megatron
    (C) Short Leader with extras like Siege Astrotrain

    The budget for the figure shrinks and grows depending on the size. That’s just how I see it. I won’t argue that people who prefer non-scale are “wrong”, it’s just not my preference.
     
    • Like Like x 4
  12. TFXProtector

    TFXProtector Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2011
    Posts:
    20,019
    News Credits:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    362
    Likes:
    +22,431
    &

    Wow. Well, I must give you credit for having the balls to come back here and defend this, even if it's wrong. You're brave, I commend that.
    And now, I must destroy your argument. (Sorry that the commending didn't last long...)

    Hasbro stole NO design.

    Fans Toys and KFC stole Hasbro's IP. If Hasbro wanted to pursue it and get the financials lined up for padding a Chinese lawyer's pocket, they'd have a case and FT would go running. So would KFC, since this was all started by talking about them and their design.

    Hasbro looks the other way all the time and even said "if you love a 3rd party item, don't make us aware of it, then we have to take action against it" (I'm paraphrasing, but that was the basic gist.)

    Hasbro and Takara-Tomy created ALL of the designs we've come to know and love, including Wreck-Gar. He looks like he stepped right out of the cartoon, which, in case you didn't know... Hasbro owns.
    KFC made a figure based on Hasbro's cartoon. Hasbro might have used some design cues (possibly, we don't even have proof of that) of KFC's work to make SS86 Wreck-Gar (in case you forgot, already, SS/SS86 is a Hasbro product based on a Hasbro cartoon/property and no one else's.) and that's their right. KFC has no legal standing if Hasbro decided to use the same design from top to bottom because then they'd have to go to court and admit they stole Hasbro's IP, which would lead to the judge saying this to KFC (and FT):

    [​IMG]

    Now, onto Galvatron and FT's design...

    Again, based on a design/entity that Hasbro owns lock, stock, and barrel. Takara-Tomy owns it as well, but aside from those two companies, no one else owns a single claim on that design, that character, that being. No one. (Same goes for Wreck-Gar.) Fans Toys stole their IP to make that figure happen. Again, IF Has/Tak "stole" any design cues from Sovereign, it was just and it was right and it's what FT deserves. (I say that as a 3rd party fan. When the officials start beating you at your own game, so be it. Such is life.) I'd argue that Has/Tak's design is better than Sovereign's for a few reasons and I'll list them below:

    1.) Cost. You get the same experience of having a Galvatron in your collection, a "proper" one, without it costing a car or rent payment. (IT DOESN'T NEED TO COST $200 [email protected]#IN' DOLLARS!)
    2.) Yes, they somewhat look the same BECAUSE FANS TOYS STOLE HAS/TAK'S CHARACTER DESIGN! (So, it's expected that Has/Tak's version would indeed look like the cartoon character the plastic is trying to emulate.)
    3.) The transformation and overall look of Kingdom Galvatron are MUCH BETTER than Fans Toys Sovereign. Why? Because the limitations of a $50.00 figure budget can easily be explained away on the current figure. At $200+ no one can really explain why Sovereign's cannon mode looks so silly with his exposed arms and otherwise ridiculously complex transformation that makes people want to smash their heads in with a hammer. Heck, even the DX9 Tyrant did a better job of being a transforming action figure AND looked the part in both modes. Even changed colors in the two modes due to how he transformed. (Really neat trick.)

    Don't come here and try and defend a 3rd party and their design and claim Has/Tak stole anything from them. That sounds like a lawyer suing a home invasion victim because the robber broke his leg and got hurt on the property. That's asinine and disgusting. "Oh wow, Hasblow and Suckara-Blowme stole designs from KFC and FT, guys! They did, they really did!" To which people would respond with:

    "LOL No. Just no. Oh, wait. You're serious?"

    [​IMG]

    So, did they really? No. You can put all of the aforementioned figures next to one another and none of them are alike. Too many design differences (not to mention size discrepancies) and too many changes between molds for such an argument to stand up, anywhere. Anyone with honesty and common sense, and that includes 3rd party fans, can look at this and say "No. Hasbro did nothing wrong. Case dismissed."
     
    • Like Like x 15
  13. bellpeppers

    bellpeppers A Meat Popsicle

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2008
    Posts:
    23,345
    News Credits:
    13
    Trophy Points:
    362
    Location:
    Somewhere over Macho Grande
    Likes:
    +17,406
    Take a look at MP BB v2. It catches a lot of flack for its back pack and feet. A larger figure would allow better engineering to resolve some of those issues.

    Skorponok is so heavy due to size his scorpion legs can’t even hold him up.

    Or Studio Series Scorponok. He’s so small he is now an accessory to Blackout. No articulation at all. No paint either.
    You aren’t gonna get a nice, detailed Deluxe figure for Scorponok any more because scale now comes before engineering.
     
  14. Optimus1138

    Optimus1138 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2011
    Posts:
    5,189
    News Credits:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    287
    Location:
    Michigan, US
    Likes:
    +4,224
    Ebay:
    If you're arguing that Hasbro making a toy that happens to be similar to a 3rd party toy because they were based on the same design is 'stealing', you're also calling those same 3rd party designs stealing and setting a precedent for them to get shut down. (And I mean yeah, it is from a legal standpoint, but your comment suggests that you don't want to be a bootlicker who sides with a big corporation in screwing over the little guy, so I'm guessing that's not the position you're taking.)
     
    • Like Like x 1
  15. Ramberk Magnus

    Ramberk Magnus Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2003
    Posts:
    5,255
    Trophy Points:
    367
    Likes:
    +9,746
    I’m not familiar with the engineering problems with your first two examples but are those problems caused by the size of the figure or because the figure was poorly budgeted/engineered?

    Take CW Devastator, it has a design flaw in its foot and it wouldn’t matter if it was a smaller figure, the flaw doesn’t get fixed if you shrink or enlarge the figure. It’s simply poorly designed, maybe those examples you gave are examples of poor design or a weak budget for engineering?

    With movie Scorponok you’re simply talking about your preference. You prefer a larger figure and that’s fine but bigger doesn’t always mean “better.”

    What I mean is, Hasbro could release a G1 Buzzsaw that was super detailed and hyper articulated at a voyager size and lots of fans would hear “womp womp” music. At this point we’d skip it because some us don’t want a Buzzsaw that’s as big as a tetrajet even if it’s the coolest thing ever. Are we wrong? It’s just a matter of preference and choice.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  16. Alph

    Alph Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2004
    Posts:
    2,699
    Trophy Points:
    312
    Likes:
    +6,017
    This logic doesn't make sense unless you think literally every surface detail needs to be shared by both modes. You probably wouldn't bat an eye at most faux parts TFs if they were new designs with random robo tech detail in place of the faux parts. If Wreck Gar's head was just a normal TF head that tucked away somewhere in alt mode, it'd be no big deal, but just beause it has some motorcycle details on it he suddenly isn't legitimately transforming? I don't get it.

    KFC's is still the more toon accurate of the two. SS Wreck-Gar comes amazingly close for a CHUG, but it still looks like a CHUG.

    [​IMG]

    I'm sure if Takara ever makes an MP Wreck-Gar it'll be the most toon accurate of all, but who knows when that would ever happen.
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2021
    • Like Like x 2
  17. bellpeppers

    bellpeppers A Meat Popsicle

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2008
    Posts:
    23,345
    News Credits:
    13
    Trophy Points:
    362
    Location:
    Somewhere over Macho Grande
    Likes:
    +17,406
    Budgeted and engineered based on the intended size of the final product.

    Trypticon too.
    The budgeting and engineering is based on the intended size. We don’t see these problems- or nowhere as many- in smaller figures.

    If anything these budgeting and engineering problems are starting to look like they exist because they can’t seem to overcome the weight of the plastic due to the figure’s size.

    Preference in that you want detail and articulation.
    So no- smaller lumps of plastic to scale aren’t better.

    And whT about ROTF Wheelie. He’d be too small to even be an accessory.

    But to say that a small lump of plastic whose limbs or tail cannot be moved due to size is preferable to one that you can pose is pretty much an admission that scale is more important than engineering in a transforming figure.
    And to me that is antithetical to TF collecting.

    IRL example is the $700 Robot self transforming Optimus.
    Aside from its cost, strict adherence to scale would prevent people from buying this.

    Again, scale is more important than engineering and transforming.
    Adherence to scale will prevent the existence of figures, which is why I consider it detrimental.

    I’ve seen 3P figures that were engineering black magic in getting from1 mode to the other almost flawlessly... and I’ve seem comments like “I would love to get this but it’s a cm off. How frustrating they couldn’t get it right. PASS!”
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2021
  18. Zentropy

    Zentropy Toys > Fiction

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2019
    Posts:
    3,225
    Trophy Points:
    212
    Location:
    Midwest USA
    Likes:
    +6,048
    Not to be blunt, but it doesn't really need to make sense to you in order to make a difference to me. I completely respect your opinion above, but I don't share it. Likewise, I'm fairly certain you have no idea what I might "bat an eye at". I never said "people who like faux parts are idiots". I simply said I don't like the practice of designing TF figures that way.

    In my opinion, faux parts-- like spoken lies-- aren't really about how they are perceived, but their intention. Wreck Gar's helmet isn't simply "decorated with motorcycle details". It's designed to mimic an actual part of the alt mode that isn't actually being used to form the robot part. Wreck Gar's helmet has to be faked because the original toy actually DID use the motorcycle fairing and headlight/handlebar assembly. However, Sunbow artists shrunk all of that down for better proportions in robot mode, and subsequent versions of the toy are loyal to that cartoon appearance. The choice is either fake it or else change the (apparent) design, and for consistency, they fake it. Many people would rather have a figure that looks like the character from the cartoon rather than have legitimate transformation engineering. Me, I prefer the latter, even at the expense of animation accuracy (because in truth, I could care less about how much it resembles the cartoon).

    TL;DR: I'm not saying the use of faux parts is wrong. I'm simply saying I don't like it.
     
  19. mx-01 archon

    mx-01 archon Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2003
    Posts:
    29,200
    News Credits:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    412
    Likes:
    +26,433
    Not really seeing anything that makes the KFC more or less accurate than the SS rendition. Pretty lateral changes, all-around.

    I'm rather pleasantly surprised that HasTak managed the long spikes on the wrists and knees that function properly in conjunction with the tire shields, as opposed to KFC's short spikes that need to be removed (and fall out all the damned time).
     
    • Like Like x 7
  20. Zentropy

    Zentropy Toys > Fiction

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2019
    Posts:
    3,225
    Trophy Points:
    212
    Location:
    Midwest USA
    Likes:
    +6,048
    I agree-- for those that like the cartoon character, this looks like a home run. Besides fit/finish, I don't see KFC's figure holding much of an advantage, unless the issue is size to fit a particular collection. I don't know how the SS86 figure will be priced, but bang-for-the-buck may actually tip things in favor of the SS.
     
    • Like Like x 1