Power Rangers - Toys, Television, and More!

Discussion in 'The Toyark' started by Kickback, Sep 17, 2006.

  1. Dr Kain

    Dr Kain Well-Known Member

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    As I've mentioned before, I'm not a model kit person.

    I don't like hollow feeling toys.
    I don't have the patience to put a model kit together.
    I always miss a piece when I have tried to put one together that left a joint loose or always falling off.
    I suck at painting skills and stickers look like crap.

    Plus, some of the ones I might have been interested in looked weird like the really small head on Kakure Daishogun.
     
  2. SPLIT LIP

    SPLIT LIP Be strong enough to be gentle

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    Well for starters, Super Minipla don't feel hollow. Certainly not like they used to. They're quite dense these days and it's mainly the lack of any metal elements that contribute to the low weight. They're usually about as "thick" as the DX's, just at a much smaller scale. (it helps that Bandai's constantly improving on construction and engineering. My Victory Robot feels categorically superior to my Diazyujin)

    The patience thing is certainly a component. I personally love building models, it's relaxing and fascinating watching it all assemble. They're generally quick builds as well and Bandai models are quite straightforward.

    Missing pieces isn't really the model's fault. Bandai instructions are quite easy to read and everything's labelled clearly. Super Minipla also don't rely on things like polycaps so the joints are quite straightforward.

    As for paint and stickers, that's something SMP has really improved upon. Colour separation is much better, and most details are pre-painted. Check out that Gaoking video from a few pages back as an example of how far they've come. Essential stickers are kept to a minimum (except for Gao Tiger unfortunately) and some are almost redundant. The head for example has stickers that go over painted parts, just to add the incredibly thin pinstripes.

    I dunno man, SMP's pretty damn good. It's not a replacement for DX of course, and DX Mecha/Megazords with articulation would still be preferable, but they're far and away the ultimate "second place." IMO they compliment the DXs, being the articulated, smaller scale desk toy while the DXs focus one size and heft.
     
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  3. prfctcellrulz

    prfctcellrulz Pokémon Trainer/WWE Champion

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  4. Robert Snoke

    Robert Snoke Gundam Gusion

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  5. WishfulThinking

    WishfulThinking The world has moved on...we've always said.

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    I can categorically say that's incorrect. My Astro/Delta and Biorobo feels as fragile as they've ever been. I get what Kain is saying. They're flimsy pieces of crap once you put them together with pieces that usually pop off during transformation. If Hasbro sold you Generations Transformers like that for $40-80, fans would be losing their collective minds.

    I don't. I think it's frustrating. I usually have to put on soothing music to keep me from getting impatient and screwing things up royally.

    Mostly. Errors can still be made. Pretty sure I made a couple on Liverobo.

    This has been improved...but I'd rather have a solid pinned/screwed together toy at that size than be forced to build one without the pins and screws.

    There needs to be an affordable middle ground.
     
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  6. Jarrod

    Jarrod Semi-retired Builder

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    And I can categorically say that is incorrect. No, they're not near as robust as a preassembled figure. But a "flimsy piece of crap"? Not even close! They're actually quite a bit more solid, dense, and have a more "toylike" feel than pretty much every similar scaled model kits. And even some similar scaled and similarly complex figures I own.

    Ah, so there's the actual truth. The thing is, these are still kits, still targeted to someone who enjoys the build, the painting, etc. Not someone who is expexting DX toy. If you don't enjoy, or have the skills, to be building and finishing these kits, then why even bother with them? These were clearly not going to satisfy you in the first place.

    This, I think, we can all agree on.
     
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  7. theestampede

    theestampede Wandering Artist

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    They definitely feel more sturdy than any gunpla I’ve handled in recent memory, but they aren’t as solid as a deluxe transformer or something of equatable size.

    I love the things, but the model kit assembly in and of itself, results in a feeling of fragility. The plastic is thicker than one might expect from a model kit, but the joints are often ball sockets or pegs inserted into holes which are used as hinges, and they aren’t always the sturdiest of joints.

    as I said, I like them a lot, but I definitely understand why people might not get the same enjoyment out of them. Especially if you want something you can absent-mindedly fidget with.
     
  8. WishfulThinking

    WishfulThinking The world has moved on...we've always said.

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    I must not being buying the right SMP. Because when I attempt to transform them, joints are popping off and pieces don't stay put. The Shogun Megazord is wobbly and a shitshow in gestalt mode (the individual zords aren't TOO bad). Liverobo is okay once you get him into either modes but there's waaaay too much part swapping. Later kits tried to get away from part swapping but, as a result, they have internal mechanics that don't really hold up well in plastic model kits. Every time I buy one, I just hunger all the more for the DX.

    It's part of the truth. But what I'm really wanting is transformable toys, not these. Why am I bothering with them?

    1. I can't afford the originals in the aftermarket.
    2. I keep hoping by supporting the line (even if I'm being super choosey) that Bandai will realize there's a market for SoC Sentai figures

    Basically, if they can take the SMP engineering and translate that to a slightly larger all-plastic figure with pins and screws to hold it together - I'd buy the crap out of those. It's more or less what Action Toys has been doing lately and how I was able to finally afford a Voltes V and Daimos that actually transformed, even if they're only about 6-7 inches tall.
     
  9. fujishig

    fujishig Well-Known Member

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    But the model-kit part is what keeps them cheaper than they would be if they were pre-assembled toys. That's the other part of the draw of them.
     
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  10. WishfulThinking

    WishfulThinking The world has moved on...we've always said.

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    That's not necessarily true. Action Toys sells their figures for around $45 MSRP.

    Bandai sells Gundam 1/144 toy figures for $20.

    There's no reason a 6-7 inch transforming toy figure adaptation shouldn't retail for around $50-60.

    Japan just likes to sell minipla model kits because they can get them into places at retail that aren't on the toy shelves, being considered "candy". And no, there's really no justification in my mind why the SMP kits retail at around $80-100 in the U.S. these days. That's really insane.
     
  11. Jarrod

    Jarrod Semi-retired Builder

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    I think that's more to do with the complexity of the figure, at the size that it is. Plus, Bandai has been adding even more articulation into them. So, by necessity, there's far more, sometimes tiny, joints in the figures.

    Ah...I think I figured it out. I think my definition of "fragile" is different than some on here. I'm thinking "easily breakable, must be handled delicately for fear of breakage, etc", none of which I feel with SMP. Some are definitely what I'd call fiddly.


    Haha, ironically, this is why I like them. I find them very condusive to just picking up and playing around with.

    I dunno, my experience sounds completely opposite of yours. Some are definitely better than others, but I can't really think of any that routinely fall apart, or I find frustrating. I've got every Sentai and Brave release so far, so perhaps from seeing the line as a whole is giving me a different perspective, as opposed to only seeing a select few.

    I prefer as little parts forming as possible too, but I also haven't experienced any of these internal mechanics that don't work, that you're referring too.

    I actually really love seeing the clever ways Bandai comes up with in order to get around the limitations of the DXs. None of these designs were created with articulation in mind. I'm impressed that Bandai is finding ways to do, and at such a small scale.


    Haha, I can understand that. But I think you're telling Bandai that you're more interested in SMP, at this point.

    I'd love to have this same line as competed figures. But it sounds to me, that unless they were closer to the 10-12" scale, you might still be disappointed. I think a lot of the added articulation and complexities, even as a prebuilt figure, would still be as "fragile" feeling at anything around this scale.

    You'd still be trying to cram 3 to 5 individual gimmicky/articulated figures, some of which are barely 2" , which then need to combine into a fully articulated 5" figures. That's a lot of moving parts in a figure that size.

    Ironically, I was also going to use the example of Action Toys' Mini Action line, of how this would turn out. In my experience, I find the Mini Action figure to feel cheaper, more fiddly, and more "fragile" than any of my SMPs. I still enjoy them, but I defitnely find SMP more "fun" to handle and pose, etc.
     
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  12. SPLIT LIP

    SPLIT LIP Be strong enough to be gentle

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    Transformers aren't model kits, though, and you can't play with a model kit the way you can a TF toy. As long as you don't handle them with ape hands SMPs shouldn't fall apart or be flimsy at all. They're more detailed and better engineered at the expense of that hamfisted play you can get away with in Transformers.

    I mean, that sounds like a personal problem. Plenty of people build model kits. It takes skill, effort, and patience yes, but if it aggravates you I don't think that's the kit's fault.

    Errors can be made handling any toy. They're not the fault of the kit. Don't take this the wrong way, but if you can't follow simple directions how is that a fault with the model?

    And you can have that, it's called the DX, but it's not articulated and takes up a lot more space.

    Sure, but there isn't, Even if there were I don't know I'd replace any of my few SMP's except maybe Daizyujin because it cheats during transformation, same way I wouldn't replace my DXs with SMP. They're different toys doing different things, giving options we otherwise wouldn't have.

    I've never bought any $20 HG that's even remotely as intricate or engineered as a SMP. Or have pre-painted parts. Or use ABS plastic.

    That we can agree on, but the domestic inflation is really its own issue. On actual Japanese sites they run closer to 30-40$ USD, far more reasonable especially compared to Gunpla.
     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2021
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  13. fujishig

    fujishig Well-Known Member

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    My impression was that these aren't candy toys per se anymore. They still have the line of cheaper candy toys for the current series but I thought the SMP were mainly exclusive/collectors shop type stuff, especially at those prices.

    I just assume the reason they're so expensive here is because Bandai isn't allowed to sell them directly because of the Hasbro license, and so importers know these are in demand because of PR and price accordingly. Any future Super Sentai SOC or toy or whatever will probably have a similar markup.

    You should see the complaints about the $25 line of Gundam Universe figures (which I assume is what you are talking about). Otherwise you have the Robot Spirits line which is a LOT more per figure, and going ever higher.
     
  14. WishfulThinking

    WishfulThinking The world has moved on...we've always said.

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    They still come with candy, though. If they weren't intended for candy shelves or to be offered in dagashi shops (do they still have those?), why put those in there?

    Nah, they're high priced even trying to go through Amazon Japan directly (of whom won't ship but you can still see their prices). Bio Robo is 7000y. After shipping, I'd be plunking down around $80. Bandai just knows there's a demand and has raised its prices on SMP for some stupid reason. I remember paying $45 shipped for Liverobo...so Bandai has nearly doubled the price on these. Leopardon is only 4000y right now...so what the hell?
    Amazon.co.jp: Super Mini-Pla Electronic Combination Biorobo (2 Pack), Candy Toy, Refreshing Candy (Super Electronic Bioman) : Hobbies

    Even then, like I said, Action Toys proves that affordable, quality transforming small-scale mecha can be done. It can DEFINITELY be done sub-9999y, which seems to be where the SMP is heading for no particular reason other than Bandai sees a profit margin they like.
     
  15. WishfulThinking

    WishfulThinking The world has moved on...we've always said.

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  16. fujishig

    fujishig Well-Known Member

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    Looking at places like HLJ, seems like retail for Biorobo was around 5500 Yen and that's pure non-Bandai markup. Not sure why you blame Bandai for that, other than maybe they made it more limited? Amazon Japan like Amazon, does not always sell for retail price. (I could be wrong on this but I checked several Japanese sites like HLJ and 1999.co.jp)


    Leopordon seems like it was 4950 yen at retail.
     
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  17. WishfulThinking

    WishfulThinking The world has moved on...we've always said.

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    It could be that I didn't do full due diligence on Biorobo. I usually use Amazon Japan or BBTS (which surprisingly can be competitive when you factor in shipping).

    Still, prices have risen at least 1000y and seem to be driving farther up as we go. Granted, EVERYTHING is going up. But I pointed out Biorobo because his pricing came pre-COVID inflation.
     
  18. Vector Oracle

    Vector Oracle Constructicon fanatic

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    *Optimus Primal has left the chat*
     
  19. WishfulThinking

    WishfulThinking The world has moved on...we've always said.

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    I don't really want to be ginger with my playthings. I'm not buying these to photograph - I'd like to transform them mindlessly while watching Super Sentai. That said, I do try to be ginger with these since they are model kits. Shogun is a mess. Biorobo has issues when I try to combine the units due to a badly engineered plug-in-joint, from what I can tell. GaoGaiGar was just plain awful and feels like it will fall apart at a moments notice. I know most won't but they FEEL like they will when I handle them. I hate that.

    The kit is a model kit. Yeah, that part IS personal - models really aren't for me but I buy them anyway since I can't afford the real thing.

    Again, I simply don't have the patience for these things.

    When Biorobo costs a mortgage payment in the aftermarket, that's a no-go. Seriously, you know that.
     
  20. Jarrod

    Jarrod Semi-retired Builder

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    I think we've beating this horse pretty well. However, it's worth pointing out that every standard, multi-mecha (non P-Bandai, non carrier size) Sentai SMP has been nearly exactly 5500 yen, with the exception of Daizyujin at 5000, and Live Robo at 4500. If you're paying more, then you're buying from the wrong place. Occasionally, but not often, they do get discounted on AJ through a 3rd party seller. So, nope, no continuous rising prices, and certainly not doubling on anything.

    But meanwhile, in that time, they've been getting more complex, better articulated, better build quality, better parts separation, and more and more prepainted parts. So, you're actually getting more value for the money in the newer releases. GaoKing easily has 3 times as many prepainted parts as Daizyujin or Shogun, not to mention better articulation and no parts swapping or remove and replace parts.


    This is the first I'm hearing about issues with BioRobo. Never had issues with mine, nor saw anything in any of the reviews I've watched for read.

    Gaigaigar does, indeed, have issues, mostly the weak leg connection. It was also one of the very first releases. SMP has made such huge improvements in everything since then.
     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2021
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