Poll: Which system would you prefer for Combiners?

Discussion in 'Transformers Toy Discussion' started by drmick, Oct 30, 2021.

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What is your preference for Combiners combination system?

  1. Bespoke system for each team

    80 vote(s)
    64.0%
  2. Limb cross-compatibility across all teams

    45 vote(s)
    36.0%
  1. Roger Semerad

    Roger Semerad Well-Known Member

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    I voted for the bespoke technique. My primary reason for collecting transforming toys is the engineering itself. Having a combining toy is a very complicated project, the more you can tailor each part of it specifically to the team as a whole, the better the final outcome will be. I also hate parts-forming, and the scramble city style almost requires it. The MMC combiners are my jam, that's how I want to see combiners tackled in the future.

    This does get complicated when you talk about a main line toy though. Since specific toys only stay on the shelves for so long, a average kid won't have the luxury of getting a specific set. So having them being compatible over an entire line, or multiple lines, greatly increases the chances of a average kid getting a complete combiner. It also increases the play value of the toys. The more compatible things a toy has with other toys, the more ways you can interact with them. So I can see the upside of the Combiner Wars style of toys, but selfishly I'll always want the bespoke system.
     
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  2. VictoryBot93

    VictoryBot93 Well-Known Member

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    I adore that CW made it so you can put literally any characters together into any Combiner you want. The point of having them be so interchangeable is playability & CW had that in spades. Literally every figure gave you so many options. Should I put Blades in Vehicle Mode or Robot Mode? He's usually an arm, but how would he look as a leg? There were no limits.

    It was especially great with characters who weren't traditionally used in Combiner teams, like the '84 & '85 Ark Crew members. That made it so easy to have your own personal teams & headcanons for your collection. What 5 Autobots would best suit each other to be a literal unit? Who would best get along with who? Who would be what part? Why? It was all great.

    So yeah, Scramble all the way!
     
    Last edited: Oct 31, 2021
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  3. Kazimir

    Kazimir Well-Known Member

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    In theory I enjoy the scramble city style of transformer combiner teams. In reality I rarely (never) use the system outside of a specific team. I mean, I may scramble Defensor’s limbs, using Groove as an arm or Blades as a leg, but I don’t mix teams to create an original combiner, though maybe that could be fun I guess.

    Option 1.
     
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  4. Houndini

    Houndini Hound. That's all. Thank you for your time.

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    Option 1 tbh. Scramble City seems fun on paper, but who actually goes out of their way to combine Ironhide with the Stunticons, or Dead End with the Aerialbots? It never looks right, and it compromises the individual figures; see almost every CW deluxe.
     
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2021
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  5. ToasterPrime

    ToasterPrime Toast maker

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    Compromise the figure's aesthetic to conform to a line-wide combining system... it's been done. See COMBINER WARS toyline.

    Adapt the combining method to conform to each figure's onscreen profile... let's see what HASBRO/TAKARA can do with that.
     
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  6. Racer_J

    Racer_J Permanently logged out . . .

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    I prefer whatever isn't going to drastically compromise the individual modes nor the gestalt. I've never seen that happen on a mass release general retail item since G1 (if you ignore that they were smaller to be afordable) and that's only because there was nothing to compromise since engineering wasn't at the point that it is now.

    Legacy Dragstrip looks incredible, hopefully Legacy Menasor does as well. I can't vote in the poll until something meets my expectations though.
     
    Last edited: Oct 31, 2021
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  7. orangeitis

    orangeitis All orange, all the time. Looks infectious.

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    Yes.
     
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  8. Cool Hand Lube

    Cool Hand Lube Well-Known Member

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    Scramble City combination can eat a bag of dicks. Bespoke all the way.
     
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  9. Terrorpin

    Terrorpin Well-Known Member

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    I never swapped my Scramble City bots. That being said, I wouldn't mind seeing more guys likeRook, Offroad, and Alpha Bravo who can replace a given limb and still keep the theme intact. It would be really cool if they all had their own weapons for combiner form, and a new limb means a new weapon (Think Megazords)
     
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  10. Aleydarogue

    Aleydarogue Well-Known Member

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    What the hell is up with this community and hating fun!? Are we gonna get to the point where we can't even decide which arm a certian bot goes? Dragstrip HAS to be right arm cause excuse. What about bruticus? We just gonna go with vortex and blastoff as arms no land or air assault modes for this guy? There really is no pleasing you people? Theres no everyone wins options it has to be this way or it blows? Can't have screen accurate AND scamble.
     
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  11. Aleydarogue

    Aleydarogue Well-Known Member

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    I second this idea I like it.
     
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  12. EvoJenius

    EvoJenius Well-Known Member

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    I voted for Option 1 but full disclosure - don't have a single CW figure so I can only guess that I wouldn't actually spend that much time mixing and matching between combiners and definitely wouldn't buy above and beyond to create customs or anything.
    Pretty sure that having a fairly accurate look and decent durability and posability would far offset the interchangability.
     
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  13. Racer_J

    Racer_J Permanently logged out . . .

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    Different people find different things fun. Someone else's version of fun not aligning to your version of fun doesn't equate to hating fun nor does it mean that anyone is incapable of being pleased. "Dragstrip HAS to be right arm cause excuse" is no different than "Everything has to scramble because excuse".

    Scrambling was never anything other than a marketing gimmick for a subline in 1986. The US didn't have access to the mail-order only DTV/OVA "Scramble City: Mobilization" episode (clip show & commercial) from Japan and, it was extremely rare that the gestalts did anything other than the exact same form in the G1 series. The entire CW line was built around that gimmick so, it's probably not coming back anytime soon.

    Some people liked CW, others didn't like CW, and some skipped CW because they didn't like what they saw. Those roles are getting ready to be reversed and, there's absolutely nothing new about that cycle. There is never an everyone wins scenario because, that's not how life works. They could scramble, be accurate, be on par with Siege/Earthrise/Kingdom in all modes, have the entire team of 4 deluxes & 1 commander given away for free, and there would still be issues because not everyone likes the same things. That having been said, no, Hasbro/TakaraTomy aren't currently capable of doing scrambling gestalts without massive compromises (especially not at mass release general retail) and the history of the IP shows that. Even Predaking and Devastator had massive compromises. This time, the compromise is no scrambling instead of compromising everything else about the gestalt team in order to scramble. People have been begging for that compromise for decades and Hasbro/TakaraTomy have finally decided to try it.

    Toy engineering and sales are very much a big picture issue so, it's really easy to get hyper focused on what's going on right now and loose sight of the advantages that a current cycle (well current at retail anyway) can/will have on a later cycle (the one not currently in development). Risks have to be taken and changes have to be made in order to see meaningful design growth and, it's difficult to get that when you keep making the same decisions and compromises about the same gimmick over and over again. Gestalts that don't compromise the individual modes will have already influenced what's currently in development due to the lessons the team learned on Menasor and that will keep building if another gestalt has been or is being done. 10+ years from now (assuming everything hasn't completely collapsed), everyone will probably be looking back and saying "damn I sure am glad they did Legacy gestalts like they did because without those, Hasbro/TakaraTomy wouldn't have figured out how to do what we currently have". e.g. I didn't like anything after Cybertron (other than some odds and ends) at all (especially not CW) but, I saw the importance that all of it would have on the engineering and design and the brand in the future (which unexpectedly came to fruition in Siege/Earthrise/Kingdom).
     
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  14. marvel b

    marvel b Bearer of the Matrix of Smash

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    I'm more into the unified combination for the scamblecity guys. Not opposed to dedicated combiners tho.

    ....plez gib new leokaiser...
     
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  15. imfallenangel

    imfallenangel Well-Known Member

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    I'm good either way if it's done right.

    I do prefer assigned/dedicated limbs, but not closed to being able to swap as per one could be damaged/destroyed and they assign a new character to take it's place, or no reason to not end up with a mixed team due to circumstances.

    But I would prefer integrated hands and feet instead of the partforming aspect... so if one figure is meant to be the left arm, he had the built-in Gestalt hand built into it, and while he could be connected to other teams, he's always be the left arm. So it's a in-between being dedicated but still can be swapped with other Gestalt.
     
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  16. MWG

    MWG Well-Known Member

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    I go more for Scramble style. Heck, I'd even like to see Devastator and Predaking with swap-able limbs. The problems with CW (IMO) wasn't the combining system, it was the cheap budgeting and stupid obsession with mold sharing. This really hurt the Stunticons, where we didn't even get a real Motormaster.

    +-MWG-+
     
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  17. drmick

    drmick Well-Known Member

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    Arguably this new one isn't a real Motormaster either- since he's just the cab again. The trailer isn't part of his robot mode.
     
  18. Robogeek28

    Robogeek28 Proud grandpa

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    Wow....this poll is not going the way I thought it would. :lol 
     
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  19. Blam320

    Blam320 Assembly Inventor

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    I definitely prefer Scramble-City-Style combiners. I enjoy mixing and matching different limbs to create new combinations. I'm not a huge fan of having a bespoke system for each individual team, since it usually results in compromises of a different kind. For example, all the evidence points towards the new Menasor coming in Legacy basically just being a frame that each piece attaches to; it's not really "combining" in any meaningful capacity, it's just a skeleton wearing cars and a truck as armor.
     
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  20. Isaac Hill

    Isaac Hill Systems Analyst

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    I'm not sure how I should vote in the poll. In general, I prefer Scramble City. It enables people who can't get complete teams to form Gestalts. And, I actually have more non-canon gestalts than canon.
    Bruticus (G1), Abominus, Computron, and Menasor (G1) use their toon lineups.
    Slingshot is Superion's (G1) right arm, Firefly the left, which I think is the opposite of the toon.
    Defensor has Streetwise and Rook as arms, Groove and First Aid as legs, since my Blades is in Betatron.
    I've got 7 original combiners, including an all red Betatron, all white Nova Prime, and Galvatonus with Brutics (G2) limbs because the purple matches. That last one has Swindle and Brawl as arms, Vortex and Blastoff as legs.
    I've got Superion (G2) and Menasor (G2), but don't know (or care) what their canon forms are.

    I'm not overly swayed by 4-changer vs 3-changer argument. How hard is it to be a lower leg? Maybe Swindle and Brawl were compromised to add an arm mode. But, I don't think it took too much engineering to make Blastoff and Vortex turn into blocks with their shoulder joints up. The only real advantage I can see to omitting arm modes for half the limb bots is that maybe they could then afford to give the remaining half stronger elbow joints so the big guys can aim their weapons.

    Overall, I definitely prefer Scramble. But, I don't think Scramble types are going to be done any better than they already have. So, I'd like to see bespoke in the upcoming line. Given that Menasor is the weakest of the CW/PotP gestalts in both appearance and balance, I'd consider getting the Legacy version of him. Hopefully, we'll see the full Legacy Stunticon lineup before having to decide on buying Dragstrip.

    Now, if they can make a truly toon accurate Superion with limb bots that change color when you attach them, I'm all in.
     
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