Paramount suffers the same issue like what pre-DCEU Snyder had.

Discussion in 'Transformers Movie Discussion' started by Dmhead, Dec 29, 2018.

  1. Dmhead

    Dmhead Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2011
    Posts:
    435
    News Credits:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    177
    Likes:
    +368
    No long-term planning, not sure if BB is a prequel or reboot judging from various statements lately that makes people confused. These symptoms are similar to what the DCEU had when Snyder was still on board.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  2. NemesisPrime12

    NemesisPrime12 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2017
    Posts:
    1,213
    News Credits:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    187
    Likes:
    +1,206
    It's just they've had enough of Bay but at the same time, the Transformers' brand is now very related to Michael Bay after 5 movies in 10 years
     
    • Like Like x 1
  3. Dinobot Snarl

    Dinobot Snarl Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2008
    Posts:
    12,301
    News Credits:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    312
    Likes:
    +27,179
    No, Everytime a writer, director or actor drops a no comment about why Megatron wasn't there or if it's a reboot it makes me angry because it means there's still someone fighting for the Bayverse. They're going to kill the whole franchise trying to protect the Bayverse, but they still don't give two fucks about their most loyal fans, who were there movie or not.
     
    • Like Like x 6
  4. Godzilla Ranger

    Godzilla Ranger AgentGodzillaRangerPrime

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2010
    Posts:
    1,216
    Trophy Points:
    232
    Likes:
    +1,770
    Uhhh, pretty sure it’s quite the opposite lol

    The DCEU had a plan from July 2013 - Early 2017 when Snyder was on board.
    A 5 film narrative (MoS, DoJ, JL1, JL2, and etc) with other solo films (WW, AM, and etc) to coincide with these.

    Then WB shat the bed with their reactionary handling of DoJ, SS, and JL, so now they’re throwing shit at the wall to see what sticks with a dozen Harley Quinn spin offs, no Batman or Superman films green lighted, a Wonder Woman sequel pushed to 2020, films dedicated to random side characters, films that aren’t even set in the shared universe, and etc.
    No ongoing narrative like the MCU phases or anything.

    With the Transformers, there was never a plan after 2007, until they attempted it with that writer’s room before TLK, which was completely wasted by filmmakers who could careless.
    Now they’re at a crossroad with Bumblebee.

    As for the MCU, they are THE masters of long term planning
     
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2018
    • Like Like x 3
  5. bellpeppers

    bellpeppers A Meat Popsicle

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2008
    Posts:
    23,056
    News Credits:
    13
    Trophy Points:
    362
    Location:
    Somewhere over Macho Grande
    Likes:
    +16,762
    There's also a philosophy in Hollywood that says 'continuity should never interfere with storytelling'.

    It's how we get into messes like this.

    Love the MCU or hate it, they mostly have been doing it right.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  6. AshleyCuadra

    AshleyCuadra Tieria Prime

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2011
    Posts:
    2,610
    News Credits:
    9
    Trophy Points:
    262
    Likes:
    +877
    Who cares about a dumb reboot
     
    • Like Like x 1
  7. Dinobot Snarl

    Dinobot Snarl Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2008
    Posts:
    12,301
    News Credits:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    312
    Likes:
    +27,179
    everyone who wants a good movie and has been around since before Michael Bay
     
    • Like Like x 7
  8. YanderePrime

    YanderePrime Autobot

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2011
    Posts:
    598
    News Credits:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    147
    Likes:
    +150
    If they want a full reboot, they should wait 10-15 years. To explain, a lotta people got turned off with the Amazing Spider-man franchise due to how quickly it was rebooted after Spider-man 3. Only reason MCU Spidey worked is because the MCU connection.

    The Transformers franchise could very well work like the X-Men, where First Class was a prequel to it all but its sequel wound up rebooting the franchise as a whole, while still fitting in. Someone could take the ideas brought up in Bumblebee and the Bayverse and go in a brand new, fresh direction.

    Though that's just me, I sorta get tired of the reboot. It's like, oh we couldn't make it work, let's just start over. Someone with enough talent could very easily rescue the franchise from its current state. Heck, James Wan and Patty Jenkins have pretty much single-handily saved the DCEU, which was in an almost worst state. I actually kinda like the haziness of where Bumblebee stands in the franchise.

    *this might have been a bit rambly*
     
  9. AshleyCuadra

    AshleyCuadra Tieria Prime

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2011
    Posts:
    2,610
    News Credits:
    9
    Trophy Points:
    262
    Likes:
    +877
    I watched all of Michael Bay’s films
     
  10. Dinobot Snarl

    Dinobot Snarl Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2008
    Posts:
    12,301
    News Credits:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    312
    Likes:
    +27,179
    So....
     
  11. Dinobot Snarl

    Dinobot Snarl Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2008
    Posts:
    12,301
    News Credits:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    312
    Likes:
    +27,179
    Funny most of the Spiderman reboots were successful. They also we're all 100% based on source material. Bayverse is what happens when people make a movie based on the premise alone.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  12. Autobot Burnout

    Autobot Burnout Dukeup Nukhead

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2008
    Posts:
    39,972
    News Credits:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    392
    Location:
    [REDACTED]
    Likes:
    +26,615
    The problem is you just can't work with the Bayverse at this point. All the major characters not Prime, BB, or Megatron are dead and there's little point in trying to get invested in them in prequels when you know they just up and die later on without meaning. On top of that, there's the whole problem with TLK being a bucket full of shit trying to spin itself off in a million directions in setting up a cinematic universe that can't ever happen, via the whole Ancient Aliens shitshow of simply going "oh yeah it was Transformers" in periods of history where the appeal of giant shapeshifting robots doesn't really apply. Anything pre-dating the Industrial Revolution (read: Hearts of Steel) that isn't exclusively beast modes or cybertronian modes is missing the entire point of giant shapeshifting robots that turn into human machine disguises.

    A reboot is absolutely necessary simply to clean the slate and start fresh. But this time with an actual plan instead of a string of retcons one after another.

    I'm so sorry.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  13. electronic456

    electronic456 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2011
    Posts:
    4,704
    News Credits:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    217
    Likes:
    +4,617
    That's way too high for some of them.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  14. YanderePrime

    YanderePrime Autobot

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2011
    Posts:
    598
    News Credits:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    147
    Likes:
    +150
    The Amazing Spider-man series screwed itself with the second film so bad they rebooted it immediately.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  15. electronic456

    electronic456 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2011
    Posts:
    4,704
    News Credits:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    217
    Likes:
    +4,617
    Unfortunately retcons are going to happen no matter what. The only perfect cinematic universe/reboot verse is your own imagination.
     
  16. Autobot Burnout

    Autobot Burnout Dukeup Nukhead

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2008
    Posts:
    39,972
    News Credits:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    392
    Location:
    [REDACTED]
    Likes:
    +26,615
    While true, we're talking on a level of retcon where all they could come up with was more and more bullshit having to happen in the past in order for the Decepticons to even be a relevant threat. Megatron, somehow, masterminded three concurent plots that would get him the AllSpark, or kill all humanity, or enslave all humanity to rebuild Cyberton...and if any one of those plans succeeded, at least one or both of the other plans would result in his undoing because The Fallen and Sentinel provably made Megatron their bitch and pissing them off probably was not a good idea.

    Something more competent like, say, them simply building a nuclear bomb and holding a city hostage in the present, instead of ancient conspiracy bullcrap, would at least establish the Decepticons as being able to pose a threat without confusing machinations.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  17. electronic456

    electronic456 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2011
    Posts:
    4,704
    News Credits:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    217
    Likes:
    +4,617
    I'm also talking about other so-called 'perfect' franchises.

    If you follow the MCU closely, you'll notice things they'll just undo things despite being 'perfect'
    • At the end of Iron Man 3, Tony gives up the suit but of course...That's not going to happen for long.
    • Tony Stark gives Peter the Iron Spider suit but Peter is like "Nah, I'd rather be on the neighbourhood" until he then needs it for Infinity War.
    • What happened to Betty Ross over the years? Does Bruce Banner not care about her anymore? Betty Who? Nah, she's dust.
    • When did Thor become more funny?
    • What about the events of Ragnarok as prophercised?

    Aquaman as of late also retcons stuff from Justice League. Not just the looks but the relations characters have with each other.

    You see what I mean?

    As Jetfire puts in, "It's a choice, it's an intensely personal decision."
     
  18. primal789

    primal789 Prime

    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2014
    Posts:
    4,601
    News Credits:
    29
    Trophy Points:
    222
    Likes:
    +1,773
    Prime:"We arrived on Earth because I got a ******ed brother named Megatron that likes to act like a terrorist and he has no reason to be here except he thinks you're pathetic and wants to kill you all and also has fun with hostages.It's not because our ancestors were here before or anything..it's random..everything is random..we could have chosen a more advanced civilization to offer us shelter after the war doomed our planet but nope..it was an accident and here we are..also why are we still here?We're good to go..Autobots,transform and roll out!"
     
    • Like Like x 2
  19. Autobot Burnout

    Autobot Burnout Dukeup Nukhead

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2008
    Posts:
    39,972
    News Credits:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    392
    Location:
    [REDACTED]
    Likes:
    +26,615
    I'm not saying the MCU is perfect, and your points are valid, but they have more going for them than the bad guys having to rely on the exact same plot for every single film (discounting Bumblebee since finally a film that doesn't rely on some stupid Cybertronian mcguffin for once).
     
  20. VikingiGamer

    VikingiGamer Directly beneath the enemy scrotum

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2015
    Posts:
    45
    News Credits:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    77
    Location:
    Hong Kong
    Likes:
    +229
    Here's the thing, they're not even doing a good job protecting it, considering Bumblebee takes a massive shit on established Bayverse continuity, leaving Bayverse fans such as myself confused as to what the damn movie even is! No one goes to a movie not knowing what they're watching!
     
    • Like Like x 1