You are missing a very important factor, perhaps the most important one to me, is not knowing if what you get is an original, reissue or KO. I've been wanting a G1 prime for some time now, but due to the china KOs I have been afraid to buy one that appears to be in good condition since online sellers arent always honest.
And now that KOs are coming with Hasbro/Takara stampings, how can anyone be sure? So yeah, I'm in camp 3, the camp you failed to take in consideration.

 

You're right. And unlike Camp 1, I do feel sympathy, but that shouldn't mean *I* should be denied affordable knockoffs. Most knockoffs are obvious, but apparently these aren't... In any case, if you buy a Ravage or Rumble on ebay and you're only paying 20 bucks for it, it's unlikely going to be authentic. And if someone does scam you, and tells you it's original, then complain to ebay. Just glancing at ebay, I can definitely see a lack of mentioning on the sellers parts, but those of us that are willing to buy KO shouldn't be denied.


Chris

 

There is a third camp that you're missing, although I'm sure at this point a minority camp. When I say "devalue" I don't just mean money. The original G1's are classics and have (or rather had) great historical value. The mystique of seeing a toy years later in some out of the way hobby shop or going for obscene amounts on ebay seems "right" to me because they were done when the Japanese culture had a real mystique about it. It was new and fresh and exciting. A real shot in the arm to toy makers. It was like the British Invasion for kids. While I don't dislike reissues, I do dislike what it seems to be doing to that mystique and to the treatment of those original toys. You want to talk about misfortune? When a 20 year old masterpiece of technical engineering, the perfect mix of East meets West, becomes a dime a dozen and everyone can own one. That it isn't respected for the art that it is, well that's a real crime. People say they love the Transformers, but when they're willing to devalue the very awe that started that love just so they can own a toy, I have to wonder. And sad but true, that seems to be the trend it's taken. When seeing an original Transformer in original box becomes just "a toy I got for $20 and some box trash I don't need". Don't get me wrong, I am happy that people are happy that they can own something that they have fond memories of, but not happy of what that will do to the originals because of that. Money is a measure of worth, therefore when prices fall, things become perceived as worth less. Plus similar to how the prequels are viewed by Old Trilogy supporters as hurting the special qualities of Star Wars, I would hate to see some reissue dissolve the product of a time and a culture that changed the way the industry looks at robots. Not just so Joe Happy can have a toy. That to me is true selfishness.

 

So, you're saying I should have to shell out an insane amount of cash for Rumble and Frenzy?

ESPECIALLY when I'm already able to get a reissue of Soundwave?

Hey - if Hasbro had had the foresight to try and move more Soundwaves by rereleasing his cassettes as well, I'd have snatched those up.

Transformers G1 was before my time. I got in with Beast Wars and only started getting interested in G1 5 years ago or so. I don't have the head start many of you have in collecting.

I just want a decent quality Rumble and Frenzy at a reasonable price to go with Soundwave.

 

If there's more than one on eBay at the same time of a very old item you wouldn't expect to be in MIMSB or MOMSC condition (esp. from the same seller), it's a safe bet it's a KO. Talking to people will help, just as you'd research probable prices, condition and marking for vintage items in any other situation.

If there's sufficient market for anything, someone will step in to supply it.

Mmm. Similar position to those who don't want people painting copies of famous works, or even framing prints.

My feeling's always been that if it makes people happy, leave 'em to it. TFs aren't unique items, they were mass-manufactured. And marked for ages infant and up -- quite misleadingly, given the fragility of the plastics, but intended to be opened, handled, and quite often snapped into several pieces.

More-so than most other similar items aimed at kids, the purpose of TFs is to be handled and changed from one form to another, rather than locked away behind glass. That's what they were created for. If anything, the reissues were designed for people to leave in packaging.

On a related note, I love stately homes that are actually still homes to some degree, and the china that's been in the family for generations gets used for dinners and sometimes things get broken. Or (to pick an example closer to home) steam engines and blacksmith tools are kept in use so that people can come along and see that. Living history's far richer than exhibits.

Only by idiots, and who cares about them? It's purely perception. Literary classics aren't devalued by everyone having the opportunity to read them thanks to cheap imprints. Original-era Minibots aren't devalued in any sense that matters by keychain reissues; they get the characters back into public perception -- which is culture in progress, rather than those characters and toys being remembered and held in regard only by a group that's gradually growing smaller.

Why stop at limiting reissues? Say no to DVD box sets and trade paperback reprints. Let the past be viewed from a distance and fade.

 

Perhaps you should then consider NOT buying items from eBay and then buy them from people who have a reputation. That would eliminate this problem entirely. BBTS sells Vintage. Why not just wait until they have one in store. People like myself sell the KOs but State up front and in bold that they are not originals. Smart shopping is key when buying on line and not from a store where you can touch and test product.

Spencer.

 

Thank you!