Is the G1 Marvel stuff worth reading?

Discussion in 'Transformers Comics Discussion' started by Nelomaxwell, Oct 10, 2018.

  1. Lovecraft

    Lovecraft Blue=Sarcasm; Purple=Snarkcasm

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2013
    Posts:
    3,141
    Trophy Points:
    232
    Location:
    Skiddy Town, N.Y.
    Likes:
    +4,161
    What do you guys think about the color corrections in the IDW reprints (most recent)?

    The things that stand out to me are Soundwave in blue instead of purple and the general absence of that "vintage" sort of texture.

    I owned those first two Classics volumes but now I'm reading those issues plus the ones I don't own on a website with HD scans which appear to me to be mostly from original issues.

    I don't recall if IDW corrected any outright errors (probably) and I'll admit Soundwave does look really nice in the G1 toy deco on the page. But I feel like the purple with blue bits deco is just too historically valuable when it comes to these original stories to just wipe away in the most accessible editions of these comics to the public.

    Purple Soundwave, yellow face/eyes Bumblebee, black helmet Megatron, blue face/white eyes Starscream, etx etx are part of the unique identity of the G1 comics.

    Tbh I feel like they deserve more homage in the plastic form. Between Prime Wars and WFC (plus what came before) there is a wealth of Generations molds that could easily be redeco'd into oddball Marvel palletes.

    Imagine Siege Starscream, Soundwave, or Megatron in their Marvel decos. Shockwave is already a good enough fit. We got Marvel Kup from TR somehow, which was great but not everything we deserve tbh.

    I think they missed an opportunity in the BB toyline to release TR Soundwave in a Marvel deco instead of something barely different from the original.
     
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2019
    • Like Like x 2
  2. Predakwon

    Predakwon ...Green Lantern's light!

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2003
    Posts:
    8,478
    News Credits:
    64
    Trophy Points:
    332
    Location:
    NYC/LI
    Likes:
    +6,950
    Ebay:
    I wouldn't worry about the purple to blue Soundwave too much. IDW got lazy again and he's purple again in the later volumes.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  3. HeresAHint

    HeresAHint keepin' it wavy

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2018
    Posts:
    41
    Trophy Points:
    42
    Location:
    Garrus 9
    Likes:
    +155
    what's the easiest way to read these? I don't see them on Comixology or Marvel Unlimited.

    edit: prefer digital
     
  4. dj_convoy II

    dj_convoy II Remix!

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2006
    Posts:
    2,293
    News Credits:
    6
    Trophy Points:
    262
    Likes:
    +1,461
    Comixology, but wait for a sale. They just wrapped one up, but they have TF sales or just kind wide sales several times a year.
     
  5. batfan007

    batfan007 Double the Dragon

    Joined:
    May 19, 2016
    Posts:
    4,663
    News Credits:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    222
    Location:
    Magical Land of OZ
    Likes:
    +7,306
    I don't think the digitally re-colored comics are bad or anything, but my preference is the originals.

    A common issue with Marvel comics originally printed in the 70's and 80's (pre-digital coloring) is that when digitally re-colored they often come across lifeless and flat, the color gradient fills everything, giving a it flatland look as if there is no horizon or distance, in addition it looks like you are watching TV and someone has turned the color contrast ALL THE WAY UP, so that the colors are like bright lights blinding you.

    Seeing the original versions, in digital (not changed) shows the flaws of the older printing methods that give you the ugly looking dots and kind of washed out looking colors. But on the actual page in front of your eye, I much prefer the original's over the printed digitally re-colored modern ones.

    It's also personal pref, but if you see the images below you can spot some of the things I just mentioned. Compare shockwave for example and the mountain in the background, one has a background, the other re-colored one looks like one flat plane with no depth.

    The actual colors are of course better in the redone ones, I'm just talking about the differences in perspective and shading/tones that are lost when it was redone (and in other Marvel Comics of the same era). If you fast forward to reprints of just about anything from the latte 90's onward, we mostly get past this technology hiccup, with the coloring and printing process having moved on and made things more smoother when reprinting or amending any way (with rare exception).



    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]



    [​IMG]

    In this last cropped image, the recolored one to my eyes makes everything look like its in the foreground as a result of the color contrast turned up to '11'.
    If you were looking at the black and white inks, or the original pencils, you don't get those issues.
    *The text bleed on dialogue balloons is pretty bad in both versions (both digital versions and print versions).


    Below is a high quality scan of a piece of the actual original art from an issue where Megatron takes out his frustrations on combaticon Brawl - it was listed for sale ages back on Heritage Auctions (which sells lots of original animation cels, and comic art pages).
    The original art when colored with the eighties method, or the modern redone version - well both are lacking really and make of a mess of the art, mucking up the shading, lines and overall look. But that's just my jaded opinion. Most folks won't even notice this stuff, therefore it don't matter. But after reading comics for decades, it's hard for me NOT to notice anything like this.

    [​IMG]


    Sidenote: I would really like either a mainline release or fan custom Purple-Wave for sure. He's just a cool variant. :D 
     
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2019
    • Like Like x 8
  6. Digilaut

    Digilaut Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2008
    Posts:
    11,474
    News Credits:
    15
    Trophy Points:
    312
    Likes:
    +1,497
    Very insightful post, batfan007! :thumb 

    I think it’s a shame they had to go and ‘mess’ with it. Cleaning it up for readability, or restoring pages that were too damaged? Sure. I even get if they have to alter things in the case of lost licensing...but outright changing colors of things and removing that tasty, tasty moiré effect is a real shame and a weird decision overall.

    (Which reminds me of ReGeneration 1. Purely talking about the colors here, I’m not sure why they felt the need to go with ‘modern’ coloring with an artstyle that doesn’t really lend itself to it - plus the fact it’s meant to be a continuation of the G1 books, in a way. Were they afraid modern audiences wouldn’t pick it up otherwise? A shame, because the retro-pages in the RID/MTMTE annuals were perfect. Steering off-topic here.)
     
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2019
    • Like Like x 3
  7. Chiller

    Chiller Failed Decepticon

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2014
    Posts:
    1,284
    News Credits:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    197
    Location:
    over there --->
    Likes:
    +1,444
    I find it really strange that my eyes tell me there is more shading and tones in the original, but really it's just the same as the new ones.
    The old ones do look much better, but if reading on a tablet (how I usually read this stuff) my brain prefers the newer ones. The old one looks like something that has been copied from a different medium, and so therefore I'm consuming it in the wrong way. It's like hearing vinyl clicks and pops when listening to an mp3.

    Agreed that it doesn't quite work... but I'm glad they did it. Otherwise, we would never have gotten to see what the old art style + modern colouring looked like.
    I suspect eventually (ReGeneration1 10 year anniversary or some such) we'll get it re-released using a retro colouring style (maybe even with the dots).
     
    • Like Like x 3
  8. Shepard Prime

    Shepard Prime Autobot and N7 for life

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2011
    Posts:
    2,761
    Trophy Points:
    222
    Likes:
    +2,439
    It seems like it depends on who's in charge of the remaster (tho' I definitely prefer the original Marvel run over the remaster for sure). The Big Two, with a few exceptions, just toss these remasters out with not much thought into how best they should be presented. And that sucks because color aside, many of these are fantastic showcases of the art since rescanning the art brought out the detail you would miss even with the best photostats or plates.

    But then you get IDW's remaster of The Maxx, where you have Sam Kieth personally supervising the recoloring process. Or Dave Stewart's remaster of Miller and Darrow's Big Guy and Rusty the Boy Robot and Hard Broiled.

    Particularly with Big Guy. Geof Darrow's insane artwork just comes to new life with Dave's fantastic color theory and eye for contrast.

    All that said, it's a shame that corporate comics get their remasters rushed out because the price to do it right i guess doesnt even out in sales but I would loooove for IDW to take another stab at a collection but done right.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  9. HeresAHint

    HeresAHint keepin' it wavy

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2018
    Posts:
    41
    Trophy Points:
    42
    Location:
    Garrus 9
    Likes:
    +155
    For Marvel's stuff? I have all of the IDW stuff already except for the new reboot issue. I was hoping to read some of this Marvel G1 stuff.
     
  10. dj_convoy II

    dj_convoy II Remix!

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2006
    Posts:
    2,293
    News Credits:
    6
    Trophy Points:
    262
    Likes:
    +1,461
    Marvel and Marvel UK, even. Look under Transformers Classics.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  11. Haywired

    Haywired Hakunamatatacon

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2014
    Posts:
    8,130
    Trophy Points:
    247
    Likes:
    +10,267

    Oh yes, retro-styled pages in the mainline TF books were how the entire RG1 should be colored. Coloring was the first thing I didn't like in RG1. Only made worse by the retro-styled covers clashing with the coloring style for interior art.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  12. HeresAHint

    HeresAHint keepin' it wavy

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2018
    Posts:
    41
    Trophy Points:
    42
    Location:
    Garrus 9
    Likes:
    +155
    ah excellent, thanks!
     
    • Like Like x 2
  13. batfan007

    batfan007 Double the Dragon

    Joined:
    May 19, 2016
    Posts:
    4,663
    News Credits:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    222
    Location:
    Magical Land of OZ
    Likes:
    +7,306
    I didn't mention either that a straight up reprint without any corrections also doesn't translate into a nice comic either. I think they did some marvel stuff like that way back early post-2000 maybe? (non-TF, reprints of older stuff). Stuff that everyone complained about and was almost unreadable. It was really taking two things that were just incompatible -
    that is old pre-computer coloring and printing, and the beginnings of digital coloring and lettering that really kicked off in the 90s, and then the post era of 2000 where things got dramatically better due to better tech, and people learning to use said advances in a way that translated well to the final finished page without compromise.

    Fortunately printing and computer technology has moved on in leaps and bounds over last 30 years and it's possible to do all sorts of wonderful looking modern comics, or redo old ones right with the proper style, but fix up the balloons and color bleeds and printing press errors etc on pages.

    The earlier Titan Books versions of the Marvel TFUS books are still around cheap. you can often find them on ebay etc. but for value, those big IDW ones in 8 volumes are easier to get and worth it imo. Titan ones you can spot with that G2 transformers style font on the front cover below.

    Rather annoyingly, I started collecting those Titan ones, then they did the IDW reprints, so started getting those.......then the bloody G1 Hachette collection - started getting that one too as I want all the extra / little essays etc as well the final colorized versions of the late run UK stuff. None of this stuff really bothers me as such, just mentioning so the differences can be known etc. I've been reading marvel comics my whole life, so if I enjoy the story, I don't really care too much how it looks.

    Bit annoyed that the Hachette lot (one that is still running now) printed everything out of order, super annoying to read so I'm waiting months until it's done and I can actually re-read them all in hand.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    The IDW full 7 volumes is the best value for money imo, and they are perfectly readable, and real nice big sizes to put on the shelf. (NOTE: picture above is TITAN BOOKS reprint, way older ones that are the most close to the original books in the print and colors etc).

    VOL #8 of the IDW TFUS Classic is the profiles compiled into one book, and the headmasters mini-series.
    So if you just want the main story, VOL#1-7 of TFUS IDW is the way to go.

    They also did some UK reprints in TF Classics, but that is its own continuity (that they sort of tried to mash with the US one, well Furman did what he could creatively within the publishers limitations etc).
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2019
    • Like Like x 1
  14. Wh33l JcK

    Wh33l JcK Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2014
    Posts:
    5,910
    Trophy Points:
    247
    Likes:
    +3,703
    I've been trying to read the Marvel stuff. I'm on the 3rd volume... I got to admit it is kind of painful to read. I thought I would like it more.

    Does it get better?
     
  15. shamanking282

    shamanking282 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2008
    Posts:
    4,162
    News Credits:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    262
    Likes:
    +3,263
    I would say that, while imaginative, you've already read Budiansky's best story (The Smelting Pool/Blaster 2-parter on Cybertron). Budiansky definitely wrote in a very stilted style, almost feeling more '60s than '80s, and if you're not used to that, it can seem really weird and often boring. I would say things do pick up once you hit the Headmasters miniseries (even though it's in the back of TF Classics volume 7, read it between issues 37 and 38) until the end of the Underbase Saga (47-50), Budiansky's last major story. Simon Furman starts writing at issue 56, and the book basically starts getting more awesome from there until the end. If you can, I advise you to hold on until then.
     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2019
    • Like Like x 1