Instead of slaughtering most of the 84-85 cast in TF:M...

Discussion in 'Transformers General Discussion' started by Excelsior Prime, Jun 1, 2011.

  1. Takeshi357

    Takeshi357 "Research"

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2007
    Posts:
    4,947
    News Credits:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    262
    Likes:
    +458
    Yeah, one could argue in favor of Galvatron and co. that his personality and name changes are enough to consider him an entirely new character; this stands even more true for Scourge and Cyclonus, who are so different to the characters they were rebuilt from that I can't even remember who became who.

    Introducing a character a whole year before his toy actually hit the shelves? :O

    If you need any evidence to back this, just watch Dragonball Z.
     
  2. SMS55

    SMS55 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2009
    Posts:
    1,058
    Trophy Points:
    142
    Likes:
    +30
    I have to disagree with you. The death of Optimus received such a backlash that it altered the G.I. Joe movie. The return of Optimus was done because of the loss in viewership, but it was too late as eventually G-1 was pulled. Hasbro underestimated the attachment people had to these characters. A few deaths would have been ok to introduce new characters but perhaps some redesigns while maintaining the personality of the character would have been better.
     
  3. Buster_Witwicky

    Buster_Witwicky ALL HAIL KORROK

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2010
    Posts:
    550
    Trophy Points:
    101
    Likes:
    +0
    I admit they could've done something better with Optimus seeing as many of the fans were children. Taking the toy off the shelves was a big mistake, they could've just done a reissue that came with the Matrix.

    Another problem was that Hot Rod was an entirely new character. His history with Optimus Prime was only implied due to the timeskip. It would've made more sense to focus on Bumblebee, who the audience knows is prone to mistakes and who already has a relationship built with Prime. I'm not sure about the whole Volkswagen thing at that time, but they could still make a new mold for him since he was only a Mini-bot in G1. Bumblebee was the character kids could relate to. Him accepting the death of his leader, the death of the man he looks up to, would help kids get through it as well.

    I could go on about Bumblebee, but that's not the point. Optimus Prime getting resurrected is on thing, he's the Matrix-bearer, the iconic Transformer, the person kids aspired to be. Ironhide, Wheeljack, as likable as all those guys were they were supporting characters. They were not Optimus Prime. The idea of them being brought back to life utterly destroys the impact of death.
     
  4. Macross7

    Macross7 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2006
    Posts:
    10,352
    News Credits:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    307
    Likes:
    +3,001
    Ebay:
    I wonder if the complaints over the deaths of favorite G1 characters since their toy was no longer sold is what lead to Beast Wars going with the 'upgrade route'. Season 3 was already well into production & the show was soon canceled so they couldn't really upgrade many. Bumblebee stands out as a popular character whose toy was off shelves & got turned into the new toy of Goldbug instead of dying. Almost ever series since has had characters getting upgraded to new toys. Rattrap's toy gone, well he's still around as this new toy.
     
  5. Nevermore

    Nevermore It's self-perpetuating a parahumanoidarianised!

    Joined:
    May 14, 2004
    Posts:
    18,799
    News Credits:
    442
    Trophy Points:
    387
    Location:
    Germany
    Likes:
    +8,581
    The complaints led to Hasbro releasing new toys of existing characters with existing names period.

    Powermaster Optimus Prime, Classic Pretenders, Action Masters, Generation 2, the list goes on and on and on.

    Before the reactions to TF:TM, Hasbro viewed "characters" as exchangeable marketing tools. They did NOT view "Optimus Prime" as a character. They viewed him as a product. Out with the old, in with the new.

    The backlash following TF:TM changed that attitude.
     
  6. vmagnum

    vmagnum Horrorcon

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2009
    Posts:
    646
    Trophy Points:
    117
    Likes:
    +15
    Aha. I see where this is heading..you're that typical Powermaster lover that you wished prime was in G1 cartoon (I'm here heyyaaa) My two cents? Sadly, the powermaster concept was way later than that, and somehow they feel that death gives that extra nudge to the viewers
     
  7. StarSaber79

    StarSaber79 Banned

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2008
    Posts:
    1,565
    News Credits:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    126
    Likes:
    +6
    I think its fine that they jsut killed them off. It is better that way in my opinion. I prefer Rodimus to Optimus anwyays.
     
  8. Excelsior Prime

    Excelsior Prime Autobot Leader

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2007
    Posts:
    482
    Trophy Points:
    126
    Likes:
    +0
    Kindly explain HOW Rodimus Prime is a "far more interesting" character.

    He's got some angst, but angst does not an interesting character make.
     
  9. Nevermore

    Nevermore It's self-perpetuating a parahumanoidarianised!

    Joined:
    May 14, 2004
    Posts:
    18,799
    News Credits:
    442
    Trophy Points:
    387
    Location:
    Germany
    Likes:
    +8,581
    Whereas Optimus being basically the flawless father figure leader makes him more interesting... how?
     
  10. ABrown

    ABrown Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2010
    Posts:
    2,013
    Trophy Points:
    217
    Likes:
    +510
    Did Powermaster Optimus not come out until after Rebirth aired? I didn't realize that. I would've been like 6 or 7 years old when Rebirth aired. I still think that it would've been cool to have PM Optimus featured in the series though.
     
  11. SPLIT LIP

    SPLIT LIP AKA Beve Stuscemi

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2005
    Posts:
    79,818
    News Credits:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    412
    Location:
    agile house
    Likes:
    +28,105
    Because they didn't think of the toys as characters back then.
     
  12. Nevermore

    Nevermore It's self-perpetuating a parahumanoidarianised!

    Joined:
    May 14, 2004
    Posts:
    18,799
    News Credits:
    442
    Trophy Points:
    387
    Location:
    Germany
    Likes:
    +8,581
    Rebirth aired in 1987.

    Powermasters weren't released until 1988.
     
  13. Murasame

    Murasame

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2008
    Posts:
    21,379
    News Credits:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    362
    Location:
    The Lost Light
    Likes:
    +6,092
    I was watching G1 on TV when it was first shown in my country and had Transformers like Siren, Nightbeat, Powermaster Optimus Prime, Getaway, Guzzle, Grimlock, and many Micromasters and the only one appearing on TV was Grimlock. :( 
     
  14. Nevermore

    Nevermore It's self-perpetuating a parahumanoidarianised!

    Joined:
    May 14, 2004
    Posts:
    18,799
    News Credits:
    442
    Trophy Points:
    387
    Location:
    Germany
    Likes:
    +8,581
    Well, to be fair, the German airing schedule of G1 was... weird.
     
  15. Murasame

    Murasame

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2008
    Posts:
    21,379
    News Credits:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    362
    Location:
    The Lost Light
    Likes:
    +6,092
    Yes. It was completely mixed so you actually thought it was like having a Team of Autobots on Earth and one on Cybertron and with leaving out the movie until 1994 the only time you saw Optimus die was in that season 3 episode. And I thought all the time that Rodimus Prime was the son of Optimus Prime, because they had the same surname. And I wondered why there was another Autobot looking similar to Rodimus, named Hot Rod :lol 

    But it somehow worked. It was actually more interesting that way, but I always preferred the episodes featuring Cybertron and the origins of the Transformers and the Quintessons.

    I think it proves that Hasbro could have handled the whole thing differently.


    edit:
    And you had two groups of Decepticons, the ones lead by Megatron and the ones led by Galvatron. And suddenly Starscream is a ghost and you don't know why. RTL really messed with our little minds that way they aired the episodes randomly and left out some episodes and the movie ;) 

    And how I always wondered if that flying head around Cybertron named Unicron once had a body or not... and why it is not always floating around Cybertron...
     
  16. Nevermore

    Nevermore It's self-perpetuating a parahumanoidarianised!

    Joined:
    May 14, 2004
    Posts:
    18,799
    News Credits:
    442
    Trophy Points:
    387
    Location:
    Germany
    Likes:
    +8,581
    Well, i knew that those "space" episodes were set after the "Earth" episodes, of which we only ever got to see six, and the comics filled in some gaps, but...

    I and the boys I talked to all assumed that Rodimus and Optimus were brothers. I never realized that Hot Rod was slightly different in "Dark Awakening" and "The Rebirth", I was just confused why he sometimes was a sleek racer car and sometimes he was this bulky vehicle. I either thought it was an animation error, or the extra compartment was optional.

    I realized that Galvatron was separate from Megatron (and at least from the comics, I learned that he was the same guy, changed by Unicron), but for a long time I assumed that Starscream "died" when Megatron ripped out his innards in "Hoist Goes Hollywood".

    They left out most of season 1 and 2!

    Again, the comics filled in some of the gaps for me.
     
  17. Takeshi357

    Takeshi357 "Research"

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2007
    Posts:
    4,947
    News Credits:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    262
    Likes:
    +458
    The real tragedy is that the Optimus Prime of the Marvel comics was just angsty - yet everyone praised him for it!

    Still, Star Saber makes Optimus look like Rodimus. *shudder*
     
  18. theestampede

    theestampede Wandering Artist

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2009
    Posts:
    5,662
    News Credits:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    287
    Likes:
    +1,837
    I prefer the characters dieing and new ones being introduced. Makes the dangers the characters are facing feel so much worse and makes the universe they live in that much larger.
     
  19. Feralstorm

    Feralstorm To Infinity - and Your Mom TFW2005 Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2003
    Posts:
    18,305
    News Credits:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    417
    Likes:
    +2,147
    If Hasbro had the benefit of a hindsight-assisted "do-over" in 85-86, They probably would have gone the upgrade route over the kill-and-replace, because...

    One thing people probably should keep in mind is the whole "merchandise-based kids cartoon to sell our stuff" thing was in its infancy in the eighties, broadcasting rule changes only recently making such programs possible in that form. Adding "the movie" on top of that was a similarly infant idea. The toy companies and their hired writers were still feeling out what worked and what didn't with making a piece of media that functions effectively for advertising an evolving toy line while being entertaining enough to keep an audience to sell stuff to.
     
  20. Excelsior Prime

    Excelsior Prime Autobot Leader

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2007
    Posts:
    482
    Trophy Points:
    126
    Likes:
    +0
    Optimus wasn't flawless. He was, however, confident, self-assured, and courageous.

    Optimus Prime was inspirational. He was a role model, and I don't see how a role model can ever be boring.

    I started watching "Five Faces of Darkness" for the first time since I saw it when it originally aired. I can't believe how horribly characterized Rodimus is. He lets Springer and Arcee go after his missing friends, and just stands there, whining: "Why did I have to be the Chosen One?"

    Maybe it's just me, but I don't find indecision and angst interesting, and while I know the point was to give us a leader who was new at being a leader was the point, the execution was sorely lacking.