I blame Hasbro. Starscream's originally planned name was "Ulchtar". Where did we go so wrong?

 

Outside of base of operations, name one transformer that has their own house.

And sure, Swindle was a profiteer. But mostly what he did was trade in military goods.

 

These elements were in fact NOT in place since “the beginning“. These elements were added mostly by Furman, who also infused a lot of unnecessary theological aspects to the lore turning freaking planets into gods of order and chaos and other such nonsense.

Just because YOU think I’m wrong, doesn’t mean that I am.

 

Except you are. Many of these things were literally in the story since the first character biographies. Before the G1 cartoon. Before the G1 comics. Certainly before Furman.

And I'll answer this for you. In G1, Mirage was confirmed to have owned several acres of land on Cyberton as well as expensive estates.

 

I don’t remember any of my tech-specs telling me how some characters were senators and politicians.

I get that you’re trying to defend your point. But at least try to be factual.

 

They are all speaking Cybertronian languages and using Cybertronian slang. You, the reader/viewer, are incapable of understanding it, so your brain automatically translates it to English and human idioms.

 

Crosscut was specifically designated as being a Senator. And even if you want to dispute that he was a later G1 character, individuals such as Ratbat held government roles like accountant or auditor since the offset. Also well before Furman.

Now, about those other unrefuted and very factual points you swung right past...

 

The little yellow dude in G1 was called "Bumblebee" before anyone got to Earth or even knew what a bumblebee was. Their medic was named "Ratchet" and a jeep was named "Hound." Nobody questioned this.

Heck, IDW's recent BW run tried to expand on Megatron's backstory by actually divulging his original name...and people thought "Galavar" was dumb because it sounded made up. They were also critical of "Nyx" and "Skold" for similar reasons.

If all of the Autobots live in their "base of operations" then what is it other than their house? Or are you going off the literal definition because you forget the old saying "a house is not a home."

 

Ratbat was also Decepticon leader in the comics. Forgive me if I don’t take a Cassette’s leadership of a faction ruled by the strongest too seriously.

Thus, proving my point even further.
Although I will say that his scheme of a brainwashing car wash was on point. LOL

 

Your argument was that government positions didn't exist and I provided you with a verifiable example of one that does as far back as 1986. Their caliber of leading is a non sequitur, and his altmode is absolutely irrelevant but I recognize your concession.

 

There's a name for this type of political ideology, by the way.

"Ratbat couldn't be a Senator because he turned in to a cassette" reminds me of the days when Minnesota's slogan was "My governor can beat up your governor..." and god that was embarrassing.

 

Oh great, an argument.

 

My point was always that the comic books came with a lot of wacky shit that paid no mind to be established lore.
Decepticon leader Ratbat is a prime example of this. No pun intended.

If anything the comic books were always guilty of complicating simplicity and muddling the lore.
Which is why now we have debates on actual continuity, origins, or even why Fembots and Robo-tits and ass. When even the show covered this beautifully and neatly.

But now we have shit that would suggest the autobots were the oppressors.
No thank you

 

Yes. It’s Kraterocracy. A very important point established in both the books and show and cemented into pop zeitgeist in the movie.

it’s literally why Bonecrusher called for “survival of the fittest“ when it came time to keep the wounded or throw them overboard.

 

I've seen plenty of geewunners in my time, but never one so unique that he disagreed with geewun itself.

 

The cartoon was a kids show meant to sell toys. The comics were (and still are) aimed at a traditionally older audience who wants their stories to be a bit more complex and reflect how the world isn't black and white.

If you want simpler themes, Cyberverse is right there.

 

Bruh, the first Transformers comic by Bob Budiansky featured Megatron trying to turn Cybertron into a mobile headquarters for conquest. As in racism, theft, and slavery of other species.

I do believe Mirage's original profile by Bob Budiansky for Hasbro and Marvel had him as an old money toff.
Botch's Transformers Box Art Archive - Tech Specs
http://tftechspecs.com/pics2/12212.jpg

 

The cartoon also established the why flying spaghetti monsters from space created bipedal machines to sell off to a humanoid consumer base. Which also explains why they came in female and why they had robo-tits and ass, as well as why shockwave thought they were extinct and why you only saw the remaining ones as pin-ups, exotic dancers or nurses. They were pretty much sex slaves.
Now if that’s not some hard-core shit for a cartoon then I don’t know what is. And the fact that they got away with saying this by clues and hints says even more.

Not so black and white if you think about it. And a lot more complex than Cyberverse.

 

Because they're an incredibly long lived species? Cybertronian leaders don't "age out" of positions, meaning fresh voices and opinions don't get cycled in as frequently as they would in a human civilization. Optimus Prime and Megatron live for millions of years, so their opinions persist for millions of years. (Partially thanks to a 4 million year long nap.).

Imagine if George Washington has been the president for the last 300 years. Imagine if Ghengis Kahn or Caeser were still around. Like, seriously, from around "War Dawn" to the year 2006, the Autobots and Decepticons had the same leadership in the cartoon.

Comics were much more messy, but also had alliances and schisms that went beyond just autobot vs decepticon.

Also the "consumer goods vs military hardware" schism isn't absolute. Warpath was an Autobot, after all.

Mirage had a large estate as part of his backstory, didn't he?

The issue wasn't what he was selling, it was what he was selling it for; he literally sells his fellow combaticons for money in the cartoon, which was my point; Transformers use money. and Swindle was an early example of that.

 

...bro don't put your hangups on me.