How do you feel about "Pretools" in general?

Discussion in 'Transformers Toy Discussion' started by Matt_M, Oct 7, 2016.

  1. Matt_M

    Matt_M Snarkabot

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2010
    Posts:
    2,570
    News Credits:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    262
    Likes:
    +621
    Ever since the Botcon tease, fans have been looking forward to the Overlord reveal. NYCC gives us the first look at the Overlord mold! But it's Black Shadow, not Overlord.

    Titans Return has a lot of this, though it was present in previous lines as well. Nobody is fooled by who the upcoming Voyager Prime and Megatron are going to be, and Sentinel Prime was just as obvious. Going back to CW, Vortex's mold was used more than once before he got to be Vortex.

    My question is, how do you feel about what is essentially the "repaint" of the figure coming out first?

    I have mixed feelings. At first, I was displeased that we're not getting Blitzwing/Overlord/Octane/Astrotrain first, for example. But then, I swung to "We're still getting Blitzwing and this is a good use of the mold, so who cares?"

    But then I worry about how, in previous lines, late wave distribution can be very hit-or-miss, and I wonder if I will ever see Overlord when Armada Megatron clogged my local stores' shelves for the entirety of CW.

    So I guess, in short, I'm fine with the "pretooling" phenomenon in general, I'm just a worry-wart.

    What about you?
     
  2. Metal Sonic

    Metal Sonic Hard to get rid of

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2013
    Posts:
    1,231
    News Credits:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    197
    Location:
    Somewhere
    Likes:
    +3,088
    On one hand, you're essentially getting two reveals at once. You know you're getting Octane, but you also know there'll be a repaint as G2 Optimus Prime. Which is neat!

    On the other... said Optimus Prime doesn't look very good. Sentinel Prime and Stripes are quite significantly less desirable, and almost kinda feel... forced? Nobody would really care as much about Sentinel Prime AFTER Astrotrain.

    I guess what I'm saying is, if you're doing a pretool, make it desirable. Like Black Shadow.
     
  3. Gangu Stars

    Gangu Stars That rug really tied the room together did it not?

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2013
    Posts:
    562
    Trophy Points:
    172
    Likes:
    +958
    So far...I'm cool with it.

    I still have a few stores near me with Combiner Wars stuff keeping Titans Return toys from being stocked. And Hasbro has been bad about including key, or at least very interesting items in late waves that never make it to the main retailers. You're left with maybe being lucky to find one if a regional discounter gets them in, and you're there on he day they are stocked since it's often in such low numbers.

    Saw too many G.I.Joe items cancelled or re-imagined for other releases in the last 8 years, and a similar thing with Combiner Wars to not let my hopes get to high about anything coming out near the release of the Last Knight product.
     
  4. Bob Schoonover

    Bob Schoonover Poorly-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2010
    Posts:
    5,834
    News Credits:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    247
    Likes:
    +9,105
    The fear of late wave stuff never making the shelves is why I buy cases or half cases from BBTS - I don't risk anything that way.

    As to the reveal order, I kind of enjoy seeing the non-primary use first. They're usually a little wacky, and it allows for any QC issues to get sorted out before the primary shows up (think Brawl's waist - would people have been as up in arms if Drillhorn didn't tab in as well but Brawl did?).
     
    • Like Like x 2
  5. Noideaforaname

    Noideaforaname Pico, let's go up to Zuma

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2010
    Posts:
    8,978
    News Credits:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    247
    Location:
    New Jersey
    Likes:
    +3,955
    I think it's rather handy having an idea as to what two uses of the mold looks like from the start.... even if most of the time you'll lean towards the one who the mold was obviously designed after anyways. Though I'm curious as to how well these things will sell this way. They always seem to over-order the early waves. which combined with people *knowing* there's a more desirable version later on could lead to 'pretools' shelfwarming something fierce.
     
  6. Girl Pants

    Girl Pants aka brickonator

    Joined:
    May 23, 2007
    Posts:
    2,703
    News Credits:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    262
    Likes:
    +408
    It's fine, and like has been said, getting two reveals at once is really cool.

    My only issue is the same as OP's - that I hope the "intended" version doesn't get pushed back into one of those hard-to-find waves. But I feel like that's been a bit less of an issue lately (although I have been buying a lot more boxsets and Takara lately, so YMMV).
     
  7. Starscream 91

    Starscream 91 Mech With A Mouth

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2015
    Posts:
    10,760
    News Credits:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    272
    Location:
    Remnant
    Likes:
    +7,591
    Firstly, this fear of some stuff never coming to retail has been so off putting to me that I rarely buy a Transformer now.

    But thats not the point, I'm okay with prepaints. I like Sentinel Prime and I love the Astrotrain repaint. I like any version of the CW Helicopter mold they put out despite the pain in the ass transformation. For the most because I know I'm going to go as complete as retail will let me on a line like CW or TR so I don't care which version is released first cause I will have both... Maybe.
     
  8. Scaleface

    Scaleface Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2009
    Posts:
    25,412
    News Credits:
    99
    Trophy Points:
    392
    Location:
    Michigan, USA
    Likes:
    +5,486
    Ebay:
    This has nothing to do with tooling. They even do this for recolors. They are releasing the less popular mold mate first, so we are more likely to buy the first and second release. We buy the first release because it is a new mold, and the second release because its the cooler character.

    Hasbro KNOWS more people want Overlord, so they give us Black Shadow first. They have been doing it a lot lately. They give us Buzzsaw first, so people still buy Laserbeak. They give us Blaster first so we buy Soundwave. They give us Ultra Magnus first so we buy Optimus Prime. They give us Thundercracker first so we buy Starscream. Heck, they even gave us Stripes first so we still buy Ravage!
     
  9. Murasame

    Murasame

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2008
    Posts:
    22,128
    News Credits:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    362
    Location:
    The Lost Light
    Likes:
    +7,233
    I think it's a good thing. We're waiting for stuff anyway, if it's a few months more... no problem. It's not a race. The general buyer will probably buy the first version, if they like it and we know that we have to wait for the character we prefer. More sales for Hasbro, which is a good thing for us in return.
     
  10. bcm77

    bcm77 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2009
    Posts:
    8,448
    Trophy Points:
    282
    Location:
    Derbyshire, UK
    Likes:
    +17,451
    The only retools I buy are if the character has always been one eg a Seeker or some of the carbots such as the Nissans.

    Even then I don't want every variant because it gets boring owning the same thing several times over.

    I prefer to have original molds, that's why I'm buying MMC's Overlord.
     
  11. Soundwinder

    Soundwinder I wind sounds!

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2011
    Posts:
    5,063
    Trophy Points:
    247
    Likes:
    +710
    I like it.

    It gets us alternate versions for people who actually don't care for the character, but are interested in the mold. I personally had no interest in Sentinel Prime, but I know if he came out after Astrotrain, he would've stayed on shelves roughly forever.

    Fans get an extra deco, Hasbro gets sales from those who double-dipped, and savvy fans can pick and choose which one they want.

    The only ones who lose are those who are too eager and buy things without thinking and... I'm okay with that, I suppose.
     
  12. grimlock1972

    grimlock1972 Optimus, serving up the primest of ribs since 1984

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2009
    Posts:
    20,167
    News Credits:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    362
    Likes:
    +2,128
    I have no real issue with pretools. I always wait and get the version I want. From a business perspective it seems a good idea at best and at worst it's more of a bad idea than normal repaints.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2016
  13. TyrantGalvatron

    TyrantGalvatron Hasbro is NOT your enemy.

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2016
    Posts:
    2,915
    News Credits:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    222
    Location:
    Proud Member of the Pew Pew Posse
    Likes:
    +4,559
    Facebook:
    I disagree about Sentinel Prime. In his case, the mold fits him better than it does its intended use. The mold doesn't look much like a traditional Space Shuttle or a traditional train which makes it a terrible fit for Astrotrain.
     
  14. motorthing

    motorthing One of these days.........

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2013
    Posts:
    17,865
    News Credits:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    302
    Location:
    Sarf Lunnun Tarn
    Likes:
    +43,236
    Ok thus far.
     
  15. TyrantGalvatron

    TyrantGalvatron Hasbro is NOT your enemy.

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2016
    Posts:
    2,915
    News Credits:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    222
    Location:
    Proud Member of the Pew Pew Posse
    Likes:
    +4,559
    Facebook:
    As for the original question, I don't have a problem with pretools at all.

    But the Original poster did bring up a great point that needs to be discussed. If the pretools come out first and the original characters the molds were intended for end up in late waves, there's a real chance that some of them will be very difficult to find.
     
  16. WishfulThinking

    WishfulThinking "Don't touch it! It's Zvil!"

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2014
    Posts:
    12,592
    News Credits:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    287
    Location:
    Wichita, KS
    Likes:
    +10,406
    The Sky Shadow/Overlord prepaint/tooling has me worried too...and is actually the first time I was perturbed that about the primary character being introduced second. Part of this may be because with Astrotrain, Blitzwing and Octane...I have those in CHUG already and they're middling to decent toys as is. But Overlord doesn't have one and Sky Shadow does...so I feel like Overlord's BIG REVEAL has been upstaged by a lesser reveal of the same toy.

    That said, I'm pre-ordering Overlord for sure. I'm taking no chances with an Armada Megatron/Thundercracker/Skywarp situation where they clogged up the shelves, making it hard to find Ultra Magnus, G1 Megatron and Starscream.

    HOWEVER, there's a pretty good chance that Tomy may reveal their Overlord around the same time as Hasbro now.
     
  17. bignick1693

    bignick1693 Maximal

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2010
    Posts:
    10,234
    News Credits:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    312
    Likes:
    +1,883
    I didn't buy most of them before as retools and still don't as pre tools. Skipping Sky Shadow for the real guy Overlord.

    Only TR one I plan on buying is Megatron.
     
  18. tikgnat

    tikgnat Baweepgranaweepninnybong.

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2002
    Posts:
    27,264
    News Credits:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    462
    Location:
    Beneath the Loft, London, UK
    Likes:
    +18,644
    Ebay:
    Twitter:
    I thought that I would have a problem with it... except when I thought about it I actually don't care. If the pretool/repaint is something I don't particularly like the look of, nobodys forcing me to buy it and I just wait for the version that I do want.

    So Voyager Optimus? Nah. Octane? Yes. Ravage/Stripes? Nah on both counts (so far).
     
  19. DoubleClouder

    DoubleClouder Prototype / Testshot collector

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2006
    Posts:
    5,203
    News Credits:
    13
    Trophy Points:
    287
    Likes:
    +1,754
    I have kind of mixed feelings about the pretool. I have no issue with getting a retool of a mold, but I don't like when the intended character comes later. For some reason, I think it take away some of the excitement when the original intended character comes out. For example, I really like Sentinel Prime and I think Astrotrain looks good, but I didn't feel as excited to get Astrotrain, because I already felt like I owned the figure already, especially since that one is really only headswap and colorchange.. Got a little bit of the same feeling from PMOP and Ultra Magnus. Now let me say, I think these pretools are fantastic when they are more than a headswap. The Scourge/Highbrow and the upcoming Broadside/Alpha Trion definitely fit the bill.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  20. Windsweeper II

    Windsweeper II The Pristine

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2015
    Posts:
    16,889
    News Credits:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    302
    Likes:
    +16,708
    It al just depends on wether i want a toy of both characters in that form:
    I'd be perfectly happy to own two Takara versions of the Sentinel/Astrotrain mold if they give their version of Sentinel a Sunbow deco.
    Skyshadow however i prefer to be a Pretender or at least an appropriate update of the concept wich the titanmaster thing cannot be imo, but i will certainly buy Overlord as at Leaderclass he would be perfect for my IDW shelf.
    Octane and Blitzwing ? Well i have no need of those molds as OP or Megs but i do want them as representations of the Con Triplechangers.