Discussion in 'Transformers News and Rumors' started by fakebusker83, Jul 21, 2014.
Custom replacement parts, custom weapons and custom alt shells please...
I agree. They license artists to make stuff for WeLoveFine (T-shirt store) so I'm glad that they're licensing more artists to make stuff.
That we will, good sir.
This is only logical. After all, with 3D printing getting cheaper and more accessible it's only a matter of time before Hasbro loses control of their properties (much as the recording industry did with MP3 and music). Still not sure what the long term result will be, but at least there will be sanctioned/official support which should, at the very least, curb any piracy/theft issues.
Cool. I'll be sure to check this out at SDCC
It's going to take a while for full TF figures. Hasbro is starting this the right way - smaller figures that don't require assembly.
Name fandom that ISN'T like that.
ok get ready for a long post. after some reading and much thought during the afternoon, below is what i personally speculate and entirely my opinion
to try to understand what is happening here, you need to step back and look at this whole thing in terms of my little pony first. you also need to look at this from the perspective of hasbro, a huge corporation with only one understandable objective: the bottom line. after all, they do have shareholders to report to.
if you read through all the articles and links (shapeways press release, NY times article, superfanart.com website), this is most likely what happened and what made hasbro do its so-called partnership:
- some people on shapeways have created some my little pony characters, does a wonderful job at it, sells for a modest price and is selling like hotcakes. the awesome pony printed in full-color sandstone spread like wildfire across the internet. hasbro start to take notice and is not happy about it since the creator is getting all the profits and hasbro is not getting a penny. they approached shapeways with a cease & desist order or something to that sort to shut down these ponies on the basis of intellectual property infringement, but noticed that this is bad press for them as people will accuse them for restricting artistic freedom. so they decided to do a compromise instead: you pay us a part of the profit in form of licensing/loyalty fees and we will let you off the hook. they entered an agreement with 5-6 shapeways artists (shown on superfanart.com website), have them showcase their awesome ponies at a SDCC booth, and label this as a "partnership" and we give these guys a seal of approval (officially licensed product) since they paid their licensing fees, yay!
according to superfanart.com website, you can sign up to be one of those cool guys and hasbro will email you back the rules and conditions. i actually signed up using a dummy gmail account, so we will see what happens when i get back the terms and conditions. i would imagine you having to submit the file to hasbro and check for any obscene stuff or anything that is against hasbro's interests before approving it to be sold on shapeways and taking a piece of the profit every time the item is sold.
so lets all translate this to transformers terms, should hasbro later pursue the transformers branding partnership with shapeways, which i think is 99.9%. this is probably what will happen:
you modelled a G1 optimus prime head with a face plate for use with AOE evasion OP. you sign up for their superfanart.com site and you submit your file to shapeways, hasbro intercepts the file and checks if it looks or shapes like a sexual organ or looks like a certain WW2 dictator's face. if there is nothing wrong with it, it gets a seal of approval, and gets showcased on their superfanart site and the op head is now a hasbro licensed product. hasbro sits back, gets a piece of the profit whenever the item gets sold, and calls it a day
now, onto the worst case scenario, since im a pessimistic guy. keep in mind to think in the eyes of hasbro, a big corporation with only one objective - the bottom line:
you modelled a satirical OP head that looks like a certain WW2 dictator's face for use with AOE evasion OP. you sign up for their superfanart.com site and you submit your file to shapeways, hasbro intercepts the file and checks, they flag the piece as inappropriate and gets rejected and they do not endorse it. do you really think they will actually say "nah we can't really endorse it but sure go ahead and sell it on your own on shapeways anyways". what if this head sells like hot cakes with you reaping in all the profits without the need of paying any licensing fees, while the normal face plate head is just sitting on the superfanart website collecting dust? we are circling back to the beginning with someone selling my little ponies like hotcakes, and i am sure hasbro will not let that slip again
sure a OP head that looks like a certain dictator may be a little extreme, but a more realistic example of a rejected piece will be an upgrade for a 3rd party product. if hasbro endorses the upgrade and gives it a seal of approval and calls it a hasbro licensed product, they are indirectly also giving the seal of approval for the third party product as well, and im sure none of the 3rd party companies have ever paid hasbro any licensing fees. hasbro may turn a blind eye on 3rd party products, but i do not see them legally and openly endorsing it, directly or indirectly via these upgrade parts. and what if it's an upgrade part for the oversize KO masterpiece grimlock, or igear's MP faith leader or seekers, or maketoy's upcoming updated battle tankers which is a rip-off of RTS G2 prime? do you think they will allow me selling a shapeways part for KFC citizen stack when they may have a MP ultra magnus in the plans?
i doubt hasbro will give my superion maximus upgrade kit the seal of approval. even though it uses their superion maximus, the upgrade kit also requires fansproject and DMY upgrades and they are not official hasbro products.
this is what i see in the future if hasbro gets a partnership on the TF brand:
1. as much as its hasbro's right and reason to charge licensing fees on their branded stuff, the selling price for these "licensed hasbro shapeways creation" may go up to reflect the licensing fees. at this point we have no idea how much the licensing costs are, and thats what i am trying to find out by signing up for the my pony thing with dummy gmail account. hopefully, the licensing fee is small enough that the creator is okay to swallow. but otherwise, it's still a "cost" to the creator, so its very possible that the cost will be passed down to the customer
2. hasbro weeding out transformers parts that they do not approve, namely creations that is based off or to be used for 3rd party and KO items. they will most likely only allow full figures, or parts that ONLY involves using their official products: transformers weapons or heads, kreon parts etc.
3. once a person signs up for superfanart, i suspect ALL of their models in the future will get inspected by hasbro to make sure there is no intellectual property slip-though, in case they miss out on a potentially hot-selling hasbro-related item they can profit from. also, what happens if one of the artist's item gets approved, but not their next creation? once you opt-in for the superfanart thing, i feel that you are on hasbro's radar for good
4. there is next to zero chance for these shapeways designs getting mass produced. none of the designs are safety tested, and i doubt hasbro is going to invest money on that. its clear from the articles that hasbro just want to sit back and collect licensing fees. the ponies on superfanart continue to sell as sandstone shapeways prints only. unless i see these ponies being mass produced, it aint happening guys
for the average fan and TF consumer, point 1 may affect you, maybe not, maybe not so much. maybe you may not even notice a thing, but its there - hidden in the final price
and as a shapeways creator, i myself (and likely fakebusker83 as well with the "curating" process) am worried about points 2 and 3. it limits what i, as well as the entire TF shapeways community, can and will create and sell on shapeways, and i will need to think twice before i release anything. i for one will not opt-in for their superfanart thing, mainly because i dont want to restrict myself to create stuff only for official hasbro products. it may be a lesser problem for someone like fakebusker83 or wulongti or javaco. since their work is 99% based from official toys or entirely new figures, i feel these guys are safe in this case. the only time i will consider joining is if points 2 and 3 are not restricted, but i get a feeling that hasbro's legal department would not allow that. or i stop doing upgrades involving 3rd party items and just stick to official toys only
but on second thought, i dont think i like the idea of having my real name and face pasted all over the interwebs on their superfanart website lol
on the brighter side, however, i see 2 good things to this for the creators:
- obviously you get more exposure if you choose to opt-in and have your real name and photo publicly exposed. but at what other costs? that will be determined by the rules hasbro set with the partnership
- once your design gets hasbro's seal of approval and becomes a "hasbro licensed product", the chance of your stuff getting KO'ed will drop IMHO. sure, people in china will still do it as they dont give a crap, but i feel that the online retailers here will think twice before stocking them to avoid getting into legal trouble with hasbro. needless to say, i am referring to the some of awesome stuff fakebusker83 did
just my 2 cents, we shall see what kind of rules hasbro throws at us when they take over the TF brand on shapeways, and i certainly hope things will turn out better than my pessimism
Bronimus Prime. Dooo EEET.
Bucky O' Hare
Yup, friend of Stagwolf, Tecrom Designs, he did the 2005 Witwiticky clan as well as Slizardo, Primacron, and an assortment of other TFy bits.
TecromDesigns on Shapeways
What I am missing tho is what is to stop a person from having their own SW store with their own content? Are you afraid that HASBRO will search out and analize all models on Shapeways site looking for something that is shaped similar to HASBRO product?
How will they know that I have Hitler Prime head, especially if I call it Hitbot or some stupid thing?
i did some investigating and found this regarding my little pony artists:
letsay my name is barack obama, and i already have a shapeways account named USApresident and have been selling stuff (ponies and what not) for some time. i apply for superfanarts (SFA from now on). they approve my pony model. it gets featured on their site. my name (barack obama) and face gets featured on their site for the world to see. it seems that i get a new shapeways ID for SFA called SFAbarackobama (basically SFA+your real name). some of those artists have a link in their SFA pony product description linking back to their original account store (in this case USApresident)
so it looks like people can still have their own store (under USApresident) feature the rest of their stuff, and their SFA account (under SFAbarackobama) only features the hasbro approved stuff.
yes i am worried that when i submit a model for hasbro's consideration they may take the time to go through your store and see what else you are selling under the same shapeways account. what's stopping them from snooping around my shapeways store? i doubt they will be able to scan through the entire site, but looking through one person's store inventory is not hard to do at all; we all do it ourselves.
letsay i submit a OP gun for hasbro's consideration. what would they do if they find out that i also have an awesome-and-already-selling-like-hotcakes FOC ruination upgrade kit that i did not submit (or chose not to submit, for whatever reason) to hasbro?
i guess one way to dodge the hasbro radar is to remove every single transformers reference: tags, names, photos etc, but i am not sure how long this "dodging/hiding" can last for. also, i feel that once you opt-in to their SFA thingy you pretty much expose yourself openly to their radar
what hasbro decides to do with not-submitted or rejected models is a huge question that remains to be answered
Valid points and concerns.
Is there legalese in the agreement that all submissions become property of Hasbro? Rejected and accepted alike?
I guess if it came down to it, I open a second store to sell my goods - be it at SHAPEWAYS or elsewhere.
thats why i set up a dummy email account and tried to sign up for their pony elite group; im sure they will let you know all the legal terms and conditions before you agreeing to it. we will know in the next few weeks
or you just DO NOT opt-in to this partnership, period. the increased exposure is not worth the legal contraint from hasbro IMHO. i am ok with and can live with the licensing fees, but restricting what i design and sell......not so much
or you stick to ONLY creating stuff related to official toys (and opt-in), or stick to ONLY creating stuff related to unofficial or 3rd party toys (and not opt-in) and stay out of hasbro's radar, NEVER cross or mix between the two, and stay that way for good. my superion kit is a mix of both unfortunately so im screwed....
or you can do private sales where you take orders from say here on TFW2005, never post your design to the public on shapeways, and print in bulk at cost as a personal order, send to your place, and ship orders out yourself. will be extremely tedious and will involve double shipping costs and handling work. turnaround time for customers receiving the goods will likely double. much worse for people outside of the states such as myself
or find another reliable place that offers the same and consistent quality as shapeways and move there......until the hasbro plague spreads to this second website, that is
or give up our 3d printing hobby and call it a day.
this is why i have yet to see anything good coming out this.....no idea why some people are jumping with joy over this
People are probably thinking of exposure, the idea of *officially* being a TF contributor (vanity) and maybe a couple $$ on the side. I can see that.
Until I see evidence to the contrary (which just might happen) I'm thinking someone can have their cake and eat it too.
at least in the world of transformers toys, with so many independent groups and 3rd party companies being able to gain attention solely on their own, the idea of being "officially" a tf contributor is moot IMHO. if your design is good, the internet will do the exposure for you via word of mouth, without any need for hasbro to help you promote. i am happy with the current state personally, no need or desire to get famous or anything, and definitely no need for hasbro to get in the way
What are these bronies getting out of it so far? What are their expectations?
Did any got to the site to see what the figures are made out of? No, Ok there made out of Full Color Sandstone. The Material is Hard, But BRITTLE most be handled Carefully. Being Exposed to water will cause Fading. The MLP figures I get from WeLoveFine are made out of Vinyl and are worth the Money, These are not. I do think they will sell, but not the way Hasbro Hopes. They need to use a Better Material. And, Yes I'm a Brony and a Furry. Plus, I was a Furry before I joined this Fandom.
That sucks. I was expecting plastic
They look good but $99 and up!! No thank you!
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