Has cartoon accuracy in the Masterpiece line gone too far?

Discussion in 'Transformers Toy Discussion' started by stevej, Nov 11, 2016.

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Has cartoon accuracy in the Masterpiece line gone too far?

  1. No, keep it coming! I want them to look like they stepped off the screen!

    69 vote(s)
    26.6%
  2. No, but I prefered the earlier figures that featured additional detailing

    60 vote(s)
    23.2%
  3. I don't mind either way

    44 vote(s)
    17.0%
  4. Yes, but I'll still buy them over 3rd party items

    28 vote(s)
    10.8%
  5. Yes and it's actually made me give up on the official line in favour of 3rd party

    47 vote(s)
    18.1%
  6. None of the above (detail your thoughts in your response)

    11 vote(s)
    4.2%
  1. stevej

    stevej Well-Known Member

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    True, though I brought it up previously in a comment. I think these fans must really be a minority. I've yet to see any comments in the Inferno/Megs thread that have given me the impression that some folks are only buying characters like Megs and Inferno but who have thus far ignored and have no intention of ever getting say, Prime or Soundwave or Prowl due to them being "over-detailed". I think many folks who prefer the new direction have still purchased previous figures, unlike people who purchased previous figures who may no longer buy the latest. Not saying the folks you mention don't exist as I'm sure they do. Maybe they're just less vocal.

    As I say though, the sample size of this survey coupled with the fact I perhaps didn't cover every opinion won't really tell us all there is to know. I still find the results quite interesting.
     
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  2. Booster Gold

    Booster Gold Accept no imitations

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    True but that's only half my point. What I mean is if sales are continuing to increase, if more people (new and old) are buying MP figure (new and old) now than they were say...5 years ago then that's all TT will really care about. A few fans dropping off the line because of their issues with the aesthetics of few recent releases won't bother than unless it starts affecting sales.
     
  3. Skullhammer

    Skullhammer Powermaster

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    I prefer the Sideswipe and Bluestreak mold, look like in the cartoon but with a decent level of details. Inferno looks good overall, but needs more details.
     
  4. lordcryotek

    lordcryotek Following proto

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    The Kobayashi designs are attempting to be faithful to animation that was at its best incredibly inconsistent, which is why we end up with Ratchet and Ironhide wearing diapers and Megatron with his pants pulled up to his navel. Hasui's designs are the idealized form of the animated characters, whereas Kobayashi's are an overly-faithful copy of them. In my opinion, the Hasui-era perfectly balanced cartoon accuracy with detailed robot modes and realistic alt modes and I would much rather Takara started having him working on the Masterpiece line again because I hate seeing his designs in Generations being put out with almost no paint and terrible quality plastic.
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2016
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  5. harrismonkey

    harrismonkey Well-Known Member

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    It kills me that (IMO) he actually seems to be worse than several of the 3P offerings that were already revealed. Maybe worse than all of them, I'm not sure.

    I should mention I'm not a fan of the character to begin with and have so far passed on all of it. I am very impressed by the vehicle detail on X-Transbots and could conceivably pick that one up (unlikely though).
     
  6. botfan

    botfan Quote this Avatar

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    This is the best comment of the thread. Why did we end up with an Ironhide with huge hips when he doesn't appear that way in the primary animator's reference sketch? The big hips are an animation error, at best, and that's the representation koboyashi chose? Inferno, on the other hand, could have used a lot more influence from sources other than the toon. His animation model was a hot mess and giving us the exact same thing as a $100 figure doesn't really make sense. I also don't think any of us pictured megatron with this hips way up in his stomach when we thought of how he'd turn out in MP form and his primary sketch also doesn't show that.

    The 3Ps aren't perfect, but at least they show us early concepts and solicit feedback. This has a huge huge huge effect on their final product. FT's springer when from being a travesty to being one of the best figures to be released next year. TT could benefit from accepting a little feedback from fans.
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2016
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  7. stevej

    stevej Well-Known Member

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    I'm not ready to blame Kobayashi and I don't think we should jump to any conclusions until we understand the direction change. Kobayashi's pre-MP-10 designs all had a lot of additional detailing and even Magnus has more than he's given credit for though, yes, the back of the trailer leaves a lot to be desired (imho).

    As I say, I think Ironhide and Ratchet are great too because they manage to pull off a chunky flat panelled robot while maintaining a realistic alt-mode. Inferno is the first example I've seen where the alt-mode has been severely compromised and simplified to allow for such a faithful cartoon styled representation of the bot mode. That, in a nutshell, is the shame for me.
     
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  8. Booster Gold

    Booster Gold Accept no imitations

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    Yeah Ironhide and Ratchets robot modes where what was severely compromised for the sake of....I don't know...I feel like Kobayashi was trolling us with these two and yet they still receive much (IMO undue) admiration. They are the worst of both worlds, huge nappies and simplistic legs for show accuracy..unsightly hip panels, torso gaps/voids and window forearms for general irritation. Oh dear you've set me off again...
     
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  9. TigerBlade

    TigerBlade Prepare for extermination

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    And that's the beauty of opinions. For every post I see who says TT's is the worst I see another who says it's everything they ever wanted an Inferno to be.

    It goes back to options. Unless you care which companies stamp is on it there has never been a better time. Want slavish toon? You got it. Want more details? You got it. Want a shorter version? You got it. Want a taller version? Guess what. You got it.

    There is no negative spin here. None. There's something for everyone. The only one constant factor amongst any split is the unhappy ppl tend to shout longer and louder than the ppl who are happy. Give it a few weeks and we'll be flooded with in hand pics with ppl loving it. Happens time and time again.

    Fwiw, hip panels aside, the vans were fantastic imo. They'll be even better if that upgrade kit ever comes out to move the kibble up off the hips but again, there are other options.
     
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  10. DinoSnarl

    DinoSnarl Obese chocoholic

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    Yep, gone too far. IMO the older multi-source blended designs looked better and more adult oriented.

    On the plus side, I do think the transformations have been getting easier and more enjoyable (and that is good for me because I am about as incompetent as Peaugh when it comes to transforming :tongue: ).
    On the minus side, these new designs have slowly been getting blander and more child-like in appearance.

    MP-36 with his Harry high-pants, bizarre facial expressions and messy looking shoulders is a perfect example. I would gladly display any of the three 3rd Party Megatrons instead of MP-36 and that is something I have never said before about an official figure.

    And I just saw the latest pics of MP-33. My goodness me, it looks about as detailed as one of those Soap Studios figurines. No way should MP-33 be called a masterpiece.
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2016
  11. RKillian

    RKillian http://www.rktoyandhobby.com

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    Had they designed them all together like the original line, it would never have been an issue. This is what happens when you drip feed over several years. It's why Classics/Universe/Generations/CurrentRebranding is such a basket case aesthetically too.
     
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  12. TigerBlade

    TigerBlade Prepare for extermination

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    Reading alot of replies and posting about opinions elsewhere it's also very clear ppl seem to prefer to focus on perceived negatives on a figure they don't like/have no intention of buying instead of looking at positives on a figure they prefer/want to buy.

    It's an odd phenomenon and one I've been guilty of myself. I do wonder if alot of the vocal distaste comes from those that were big into chug back in the day and therefore naturally prefer over detailing? Who knows. It always circles back to options though. Don't like the simpler look? Awesome, move along and fawn over an other option whilst those that do like it can enjoy it instead of it becoming a shit fest of personal preferences that aren't gonna change a thing.
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2016
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  13. Detroa

    Detroa Well-Known Member

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    Seeing how crazy good Megatron, Inferno and Grapple look, no, cartoon accuracy is nowhere near "too far".
     
  14. RoDu

    RoDu Well-Known Member

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    I like the bot modes for Grapple and Inferno, but in alt mode once you get past the cab, I'm like that's it? I think I shall wait for the KO of these two, not worth the price tag
     
  15. Takeshi357

    Takeshi357 "Research"

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    I think, what the problem is now, is that back then there was a kind of compromise; a compromise between the original toy, and the animation model, trying to make the silhouette match the latter as closely as possible and still have enough detail and homages to the former to create a satisfying whole. However, as the MPs become increasingly more animation accurate in detail and paint apps, the lack of detail that comes with it only manages to make the features intrisic to them as toys (joints, seams, etc.) look even more egregious, rather than incorporating them as part of the design.
     
  16. onnsake

    onnsake champ

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    Looking at pics of Megatron again, and I don't think he looks nearly as "smooth" and plain and void of details as Inferno. I guess it comes down to the design. Megatron has a lot going on in his chest/abs. His arms have lots of panels. Lots of details in the legs. So due to the nature of his modes/transformation he gets more detail.

    I think the problem with Inferno is that his Sunbow design is pretty awful. It's an extremely faithful depiction of a boring, bland fat robot.

    You know who else had a lousy Sunbow design in robot mode? Sunstreaker. Very bland. Very "smooth." What a kick in the nuts it'll be if we finally get Sunstreaker after all these years and he looks nothing at all like Sideswipe.
     
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  17. TigerBlade

    TigerBlade Prepare for extermination

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    *cough* Sunsurge *cough*

    I know it's not everyone's cup of tea but again....we circle back round to options and he does share alot of design similarities to Lambor.
     
  18. Venixion

    Venixion Its always the middle of the night in Moonside

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    This sounds incredibly entertaining. And I must see it. :lol :
     
  19. Windsweeper II

    Windsweeper II Banned

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    Thinking about what i want from a Masterpiece toy:
    Double hinged elbows and knees are a must.
    If the figure is able to sit that would be great.
    It must obviously be faithfull to the cartoon, but if that means utter blandness by all means mix in details from the G1 toy.
    both modes have to be solid, by wich i mean: no shennanigans as with MP Tracks where the upper torso is completely hollow and glaringly so if you look at it from the side.
    The transformation needs to involve everything sliding, folding, twisting and turning from a central body or from the limbs, by way of trying to convey what i mean:
    no foldforming: Universe Sideswipe's upper torso
    no hingeforming; Universe Cyclonus's arms and sides of his torso, MMC Spartan's arms.
    Every accesory you can think of that fits the character must be included.
    At least one absolutely flawless cartoon accurate neutral face.
    Adherence to overall cartoon scale.
     
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  20. brr-icy

    brr-icy G1 Collector

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    I haven't had an issue with any official mp other than tracks being over complicated and flimsy for no reason. Inferno looks like a great rendition of the cartoon character. Mmc's artfire will be the one I get of that character though, because he is closer to the toy and that was all that character ever got