Doctor Who Discussion Thread

Discussion in 'Movies and Television' started by deathsheadx, Apr 5, 2008.

  1. SaberPrime

    SaberPrime System Pride

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    Pretty much everything. By the way I'm getting the impression from you that you're only familiar with New Who or maybe have limited knowledge of the classic series. You should of noticed the contradictions between what Vastra was saying and what was previously established by classic era Time Lords. I can't really blame you for that when the series is over 50 years old and many of the classic episodes have been lost. Mostly in the Troughton era.

    This is the second time you've said mommy instead of mummy. I'm just going to assume you're doing that intentionally as a joke because the British tend to pronounce mommy as mummy. Though I'm not entirely sure if you're actually trying to be funny or not.

    Anyway... What information did the Doctor learn from each death that he didn't already know after the first person died? Also, the Doctor has always been a bit of a jerk, I mean the first Doctor literally kidnapped Barbara and Ian but he's never gotten this bad. If the companions are meant to keep him kind, they aren't doing a very good job with 12, he's worse than ever now. Plus there was a period where 10 was traveling alone between when Donna forgot him and when he regenerated he didn't have a companion and he was still nicer than 12 is. 11 also traveled alone for a while after he faked his death, again, he didn't lose his kindness just because he didn't have a companion around. 12 lost it and the only time he's ever traveled alone was between Clara leaving and the Husbands of River Song.

    Maybe nothing but again, I'm not mad that someone died. People died even before 12. It happens. I'm mad that he didn't try. The Doctor always tries, some times he fails, but he always tries to save them.

    The fact that they can move adults doesn't imply that they're strong. They're just pulling people under water, that doesn't really require a lot of strength. If they were in the air lifting people up that would be different but when people are being pulled down gravity is doing most of the work. If someone falls though a hole in the ice they're going to sink anyway even without creatures down there pulling them in.

    Yes the ice was closing around him but there was a few seconds when the hole was still large enough to pull him back out. Plus again it's possible he could of broken through the ice depending on how thick it actually is to rescue the kid.

    If the Doctor had time to save his Sonic, then he had time to save the kid. If there was really nothing he could do, then his Sonic would of been lost as well. The same effort he put in to save the Sonic Screwdriver could have been put in to save the kid. He chose not to save the kid and only cared about the Sonic which shows he's just heartless. It shows he's not the Doctor anymore. That's the Valeyard, the darker aspect of his personality. The Doctor would have tried to save him, even if it a wasted effort, even if he would have died anyway, he should have at least tried.

    There's also the fact that this is the only Doctor who doesn't show any sign of morning after a death. Even the first Doctor cared about the people who died and he was quite possibly the biggest jerk of any previous Doctor. The War Doctor even showed signs of grieving before he actually did anything to grieve for. He knew what he was planing to do would destroy both the Time Lords and the Daleks but he also knew he didn't have any other choice and he still displayed signs that he was conflicted with that decision. He's more of a Doctor than 12 and he wasn't even the Doctor during that time.

    The only time I ever see 12 showing signs of being the Doctor is when he's protecting Clara or Bill, and when he was with River, anyone else who isn't one of those three he doesn't appear to care. It's not enough to just say you care, I need to see it in his actions and his actions tell a different story. His actions show me that he's a heartless bastard that doesn't care about anyone except the people who are the closest to him. Clara and Bill have seen that too and that's why they've both reacted so negatively towards him. Clara trusted 11 but she started to lose that trust with 12 because of how differently he's acted. And don't forget Clara has been inside his time stream, she's interacted with every incarnation of the Doctor. She probably knows him better than any other companion. That should really give you an indication of how different 12 is when Clara even has trouble trusting him. Bill is literally just getting to know him, she doesn't even understand what regeneration is so it's not as big of a deal but still.

    The real world purpose of the companion is to give the audience someone to relate to. How they feel about the Doctor, how they interact with him is suppose to represent the audience in a way. Obviously this can never be perfect as you and I have demonstrated in this discussion. We're always going to have different opinions about things so how the companion reacts can't always match up perfectly with how we react. That being said, in these instances I'm in total agreement with them. You obviously disagree and that's fine. So um... agree to disagree?

    Also have I mention that I've been liking Bill more and more every episode I see? It's kinda of weird how quickly I've gotten attached to her. I was kind of on the fence about Clara at first until Nightmare in Silver and I never actually hated her the way I did in Bill's first episode. That doesn't really make sense. Maybe it's because Bill is only going to be on for this series that they're developing her character so quickly.
     
  2. soundwaverulls

    soundwaverulls Taking a break

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    I am very familiar with Classic Who, but I don't see the contradictions. I can only assume that you believe Vastra implied that the Doctor has complete control over his regeneration, when that wasn't the intention. At least, I don't believe it was. It's quite evident, throughout modern and Classic Who, that the Doctor's subconscious can effect his regeneration, which is what I believe they were trying to say.

    After being around humans, cold and pompous 1 turned into the more goofy and friendly, but still brilliant 2. After regaining his freedom, having been stranded on Earth and forced to work for Unit for so long, the serious 3 became the strange, younger, loud and rebellious 4, then after spending a long time with that powerful personality, he became the bland 5. After suppressing his ego for so long (and possibly due to an almost botched regeneration) his ego came back in force with the unhinged and violent 6, who then tried to hide his darker side as the childish 7, while also being the most strategically minded Doctor, perhaps trying to make up for the many failures of his last two lives. He eventually started to ease up then became the more romantic 8, who couldn't prevent the Time War, so chose to become the War Doctor. After being a warrior for so long, he became the angry 9, who fell in love with a human and became the youthful 10 but after feeling regret throughout that life, he tried to force himself to forget as the childish 11, until Clara came into his and every Doctor's life and finally revealed his true self as 12.

    That's just me being an idiot, or at least forgetful. I very rarely have to spell those words, so I've been genuinely mixing them up.

    The first, what was it, two deaths? They gave him very little info. It was only when the professor died that he got information. The only person who died after that was the dude in charge, who you could say the Doctor could've saved, but I think he needed to make sure what he had heard from the previous person was accurate.

    Gravity might be doing a lot of the work, but that's just one more thing the Doctor would had to have fought. Gravity and the fish who're able to keep a full grown adult from trying to escape. After all, humans float. Also, the ice that's enclosing around them. You make it sound like the Doctor pulled the Sonic out of the water. He didn't, he just stopped it from going under. At that point, the kid was already under the water and lost.

    The Doctor was young when he was in his first incarnation, even if that body wasn't, by time we met him. Remember, he had never encountered true evil until the Daleks. That's what initially inspired him to give up his selfish ways and actively help people. 12 is older than all other Doctors. Evil and death is nothing new to him. After living thirteen lives, he's seen trillions die throughout his travels and throughout the wars he's fought. The Doctor developed a guilt complex during the Time War (although there's an argument to be made that happened in his 5th incarnation and the War only made it worse) and that's why the War Doctor always seemed so sad. It was the guilt. Something that took him until 12 to start getting over.

    Clara may have been all throughout the Doctor's time line, but she also said she could only sort of remember it in Time of the Doctor. Considering she was also confused by the concept of regeneration in Deep Breath, it's obvious that she can barely remember anything by that point. All she was truly familiar with was 11, the Doctor who (sorry) was trying to be fun and happy. It took Clara a long time to accept this new Doctor, because that's human, but she eventually came around to him. That's how the audience was meant to feel. Uncertain, shocked, maybe appalled, but eventually come around and accept him. It was when he started caring about Clara too much that he stopped being the Doctor. Clara said so herself. He threatening to uproot the lives of all the people under that immortal girl's protection, made himself suffer for billions of years, tore down Gallifrey's leadership and broke the laws of time just to try and bring Clara back. That's when he stopped being the Doctor. When he became selfish and let himself be ruled by grief.
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2017
  3. SaberPrime

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    Vastra did imply that he had total control over his regeneration. She even seemed to not understand what actually triggered his regeneration in the first place. She talked about it as if he was just taking off a mask... I mean she literally used that analogy. Plus remember how 11 reacted on the phone. He said "Was that me talking in the background? I sound old, please tell me I didn't get old again, I was young." That also seems to indicated that it wasn't his plan to turn into Capaldi.

    It was just a matter of circumstance. Clara happen to be there in the right place, at the right time. His regeneration had nothing to do with taking off a mask to show his true self as Vestra implied.

    Kinda glad you mentioned 6. He was another one that people hated, mainly because the first thing he ever did was strangle his companion. However that was due to the Doctor being confused and disoriented following his regeneration which is quite common. I was hoping that's what was going on with 12 as well, that the effects would wear off after Deep Breath, but here we are in his last series and he's still acting like he just regenerated. Six wasn't actually violent except for that one time. Once he settled into his new body he was fine. But 12 still feels like he's unsettled. At times I'm not even sure if he knows who he is anymore. I see glimpses of the old Doctor some times but then the Valeyard comes back again and ruins it.

    But what information did he actually get? From what I remember no one gave him any additional information that he didn't already get from the first person. I don't know how the first two deaths gave him very little info when pretty much every single person who died gave him the same info every time. From what I could tell, he had all the info he needed after the very first death and every death after that was only because he refused to help. It seemed to me like the only reason he finally stopped the mummy was because he could see it and I still think he wanted to see it. I think that's why he let the other die pointless deaths without trying to save them is because he wanted to see the creature with his own eyes before he did anything to stop it.

    Yeah but he was a kid. If he was an adult, I don't think the Doctor could of pulled him out because he'd be too heavy to lift. But the kid is small enough that I think the Doctor could have pulled him out.

    Also I'm not making it sound like the Doctor pulled the Sonic out of the water you are. If he had to pull it out of the water then it would of been too late to even attempt to rescue the kid. He pulled the Sonic out of his hand while he was still alive and deliberately ignored any attempt to save him.

    Oh and if humans float then why do children that can't swim have to wear floaties? Wouldn't that be kind of pointless if we could float naturally already? Gravity still has an effect on us even if you're in water. The water isn't going to just hold you up. If you don't swim you will sink.

    That would be a good point except he seemed to change suddenly like flipping a light switch not gradually over time. The first Doctor lightened up gradually during his run. He didn't just magically lighten up all at once when Troughton came in. His personality does partially change when he regenerates. This is a result of having a new actor stepping into the role. They're always allowed to play the character the way they want not be limited by the performance of the previous actors... or actor in Troughton's case. Except for actors like David Bradly who stepped in to play the first Doctor, in that instance he had to play the part the same way that Hartnell would. Anyway, part of the change in his personality is also from natural character growth. 10 and 11 are very similar to each other despite being two different actors with their own styles of playing the character. That similarity is to show that even though he's different on the outside, he's still the same man inside. I don't see that with 12 very often.

    Even ignoring the Echos of Clara, she had direct contact with War and 10 in the 50 anniversary special. Deep Breath tried to make us believe that she was only freaking out because he got old but she's seen him like that before. There was even a really great scene when Clara and the War Doctor talked and she didn't have a problem with accepting him as the Doctor even when he didn't accept himself as the Doctor. So why would she have such a difficult time with 12? I can't be just because he's old. Deep Breath isn't the only time she had a problem with him either. I could understand that. As I mentioned before he's usually a bit off right after a regeneration but usually after that first episode he's back to normal... well as normal as a regenerated time traveling alien with two hearts can get... but with 12 there were multiple instances almost every episode in series 8 where Clara didn't know if she could trust him anymore. Look at how much she had to fight him to make him help people in that series. They were nearly always fighting each other. He lightened up in series 9 and I think this happening again in series 10 is the result of him forgetting Clara. I was a constant battle with him to keep him kind and now he doesn't even remember her.
     
  4. SaberPrime

    SaberPrime System Pride

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    Forgot to mention this when I was writing my original review for Oxygen but the speech at the beginning of the episode was a reference to Star Trek. One other non-Doctor Who reference I noticed and I'm not sure if this was intentional or not but the plot of the episode is about an evil corporation taking your air and then selling it back to you... That's the plot of Space Balls. It's not the exact same plot just enough to be a nice reference rather than a total rip off. These both should of been mentioned in the things I liked section but I was getting tired when I wrote that and totally forgot about it.
     
  5. soundwaverulls

    soundwaverulls Taking a break

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    Perhaps that was the intention, but I choose to interpret it as an unconscious decision he made. Like I said, there is evidence that what's going on in his life does effect his regeneration. He can't choose to "take off his mask" but it's what he felt like doing, subconsciously.

    At this point, I'm starting to feel you're ignoring what I'm saying.

    Before he just had legends and hysterical ramblings. It wasn't until the professor that he had a reliable description of its appearance and ability. If he just wanted to see it, like you suggest, why wouldn't he have just taken someone's memories earlier? The dude in charge had PTSD, not a physical problem, the Doctor could've taken that.

    OK, maybe we can't float well. Swimming isn't a big interest of mine and I don't know how long ago it was that I was taught to swim. Anyway, rewatching the scene, the Doctor was keeping his distance, clearly trying to avoid attracting the creatures attention. If he interfered, they might've gone after him. He also warns off that girl, because he cares whether people die. He simply believed that kid was already lost.

    That's a fair point. Capaldi has received some of the laziest and poorly thought out characterization of any Doctor and his stories have generally been very messy. That said, I'm not going to criticize the idea behind the characterization. I think 12's characterization makes perfect sense, for reasons I've already gone over, even if how it's conveyed is weak.

    Again, lazy writing. Clara can't have been freaking out about the 12's actions, at the start of Deep Breath, when he hadn't even taken any. She just lost her memories of Day of the Doctor and the idea of the Doctor being old, somehow. Afterwards, she did have a problem with his actions. I'm not denying that, but you can't deny that she learned to accept him. At the end of Mummy on the Orient Express, he explained himself and she understood and that's when the audience is supposed to be made to understand. "Sometimes, the only choices you have are bad ones, but you still have to choose."

    In series 10, Capaldi has honestly become much friendlier than he ever was with Clara. Beforehand, he barely had any social skills. Yes, in S9 he did freak out over people dying, but it was clearly portrayed as a bad thing. The Doctor's guilt making him a worse person was actually a running theme. Not only was it a major part of the last three episodes, but it was also part of the Girl Who Died/the Woman Who Lived, when he forced a life of immortality and solitude to the titular character of those episodes. The Doctor has too much power and responsibility to get caught up in grief.
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2017
  6. SaberPrime

    SaberPrime System Pride

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    As I mentioned before, the subconscious decision was to remind him about the people he saved in Pompeii. You know the guy who was also played by Peter Capaldi. I can never remember that character's name. But they showed flash backs to that episode as the Doctor remembered where he saw his face before. Again, had nothing to do with Clara.

    Not ignoring you, I just don't agree with you. You seem to be ignoring me though. I said agree to disagree like two posts ago and you're still going on about this. We're never going to agree so why do insist on continuing this argument? It was pretty clear to me a while ago that we simply have different opinions and I've accepted that. Why can't you? I don't mind continuing this discussion cause it's mostly been pretty civil except for that comment but I don't really understand what the point of this is.

    I know he has some low level psychic abilities which he doesn't really like to use because he says it gives him a head ache, but when has it ever been established that he could take something like PTSD from another person? Plus the Doctor already has it so he wouldn't need to take it from someone else. Post Traumatic Stress Syndrome is a disorder most common in soldiers. Being the last survivor of a war will do that to you.

    OK earlier you said the hand was obviously dead and now you say he was clearly trying to avoid attracting the creature's attention neither of which seem very clear or obvious. It seems like the creatures only go after people who wander off alone. Whenever people are in groups the creatures will swarms around but not attack. This would suggest that they wouldn't try to take both the boy and the Doctor at the same time since they're never shown to attack multiple people simultaneously. This means that had the Doctor stepped in sooner the creatures would most likely release the boy and go for a different victim. Beside, if it was too dangerous to save him then it would also be too dangerous to save the Sonic.

    I interpreted it as he warns off the girl, not because he cares, but because he didn't want the kids running off with his screwdriver again. He had this look on his face like the only thing on his mind in that moment was getting his Sonic Screwdriver back. I could tell even before he ran to grab it what he was going to do. It wasn't a look of concern or remorse, it was a look of anger at a thief. I bet he let the kid die as punishment for stealing.

    The only thing going though my mind watching that scene was YOU CAN SAVE HIM! *sees Capaldi's face* Crap he's the Valeyard again. *Kid dies*

    I wouldn't call the stories messy... Just his character is. It feels like the writers can't make up their minds what they want this Doctor to be. Some episodes he's the Valeyard, some episodes he's the Doctor, and other episodes he's got Alzheimer's Disease. He forgets how to fly the TARDIS, he forgets who Strax is, he didn't immediately remember the man from Pompeii, he forgot about Jack Harkness for a while, then remembered him again, he keeps forgetting how old he looks, he also mentions forgetting how short human life spans are. I'm intentionally not mentioning that time with the worm or Clara because there's actually a reason for those times he couldn't remember but most of the time his memory seems to come and go randomly like he's experiencing early signs of Alzheimer's. He was a much darker character in series 8, then series 9 seemed to abandon that and went for a more light hearted Doctor again giving him the sun glasses and the guitar, and basically as a character he's all over the place... and yet some how still predictable...

    I do agree that the problem seems to be with the way the character is being written. Peter Capaldi is doing the best he can with the scripts he's been given. He's a terrific actor. I mean he's played three different characters in the same universe and I never see them as being one person. Just three guys who share the same face. I'm pretty sure the guy from Torchwood is a descendant of the man from Pompeii which would explain why they look alike if they're related to each other. Of course he never met the Doctor... though I still want Jack to show up at some point with 12 just to see his reaction to the Doctor's new face because he has seen it before on someone else.

    Actually she does have reason to be freaking out other than his age... like the fact that he suddenly forgot how to fly the TARDIS. He was also talking about not liking the color of his kidneys which I still don't understand. How does he know what color his kidneys are... oh wait we're talking about a British series so... He was also talking about not liking the colour of his kidneys which I still don't understand. How does he know what colour his kidneys are? If my best friend suddenly started ranting about the colour of his kidneys and asking me how to fly the vehicle that he's driving I'd be freaking out too.

    I think Clara understanding his logic and accepting it is bad writing. I get that we're suppose to be made to understand and accept it too obviously as I explained this in a previous post but I feel like his words don't actually explain anything about his actions and that's just terrible writing.

    He still barely has any social skills what are you talking about? Actually his social skills have always been a bit off in every incarnation. You can see this in the way he's dressed, with some Doctor's more than others but every Doctor costume is always something he thinks a normal human would wear but actually makes him stand out as being a bit odd. I think 9 had the most normal looking costume but he still stood out with all that black against the bright colors that most everyone else was wearing. And now I'm trying to decide weather or not I should make a joke about 9 being the Emo Doctor...

    He never freaked out over anyone dying... except Clara, obviously there was a huge freak out there that caused him to to to great lengths and break some rules in order to bring her back but as I mentioned before his companions are the exception. Anyone that isn't a main character to the series he doesn't care. I think the running theme was that they were trying to make the audience question if he was a good man... he even literally asks Clara if he's a good man. This is another reason why I thought and still think this is all leading up to the reveal that he was actually the Valeyard all along. Of course then in series 9 I felt like they abandoned this idea because he stopped having those questionable moments. They made him more like he was before the regeneration. But now with that scene in Thin Ice I think maybe it's not an abandoned idea after all.

    I have a theory that the Multi-Master story later in the series is going to reveal Capaldi as the Valeyard and also explain why Anthony Ainsley's Master knew about the Doctor's future incarnation. Someone was spotted on set wearing a costume that looked like a Classic era Master. You can't see his face because the pictures were taken from the back but this seems to suggest that someone is playing an early incarnation of the Master in series 10. Rodger Delgado was actually 13 so there's technically 12 incarnations we've never seen before. It's not really know if this mysterious Master is someone filling in for Delgado or Ainsley or if he's intended to be an even younger version of the Master that time traveled into the future. No matter what it would explain how the Master knew who the Valeyard was. Kinda obvious that at some point either in that incarnation or a younger version of him traveled into the future where he met the Valeyard before the events of the Trial.

    I could be wrong but even if that never happens I'm still looking forward to that episode. The Master is my favorite Doctor Who villain so I think the only way they could screw that episode up is depending on the actor the cast to play that classic era Master. Delgado and Ainsley are both dead so I think the best thing they could do is to make him a younger incarnation rather than a replacement for one of them. If they cast a new actor as an incarnation we haven't seen before then he has more freedom to play the Master any way he wants. However if he's playing the Delgado or Ainsley Master then he's going to be restricted by the performance of that actor. If that restriction is placed on him and he doesn't do a good job of portraying that character it could ruin my enjoyment of the episode. Especially if he's playing Rodger Delgado, that's my favorite Master so they better not screw him up. I like all the Masters and the Mistress, but as a villain Delgado was intimidating even when he mistakenly thought a children's puppet show was an alien communication which is hilarious but at the same time he was still scary. There was another character in that scene who knew they were puppets but he was too afraid of the Master to correct him. And I would be too which is why it was both funny a terrifying at the same time. That's the hardest thing to pull off is a character who can be both humorous and scary. I can't really picture anyone being able to mimic that performance. As a different incarnation sure but you can't replace Delgado. I just don't see how that could be possible. They could surprise me like David Brady as William Hartnell but we'll see whenever that episode airs.
     
  7. Switchblade

    Switchblade One Flesh, One End

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    The big problem at the heart of Deep Breath is that it did a lot of retreading of ideas from The Christmas Invasion, in terms of the companion freaking out because the Doctor regenerated. It makes sense why they did this - Smith to Capaldi was the first regeneration since the show had gotten really big internationally. There was definitely a fanbase built around the Tennant years, but when Smith came on board the show exploded in popularity - the actors were going to ComicCon, special episodes were getting theatrical releases, the 50th anniversary was airing around the world at the same time... Doctor Who had become a true global phenomenon for the first time in the its history. But when Matt Smith left, that meant that a lot of new viewers were getting their first live regeneration and it was going to be harder for them, even if they knew that there had already been a dozen other actors playing the part.

    Deep Breath was, basically, a "Baby's First Regeneration" story. That's why we spend so much time with Clara worrying about the new Doctor. That's why Vastra has to explain how regeneration works. That's why we got that goddamn Matt Smith cameo reassuring Clara that the new Doctor is okay. It had nothing to do with Clara and everything to do with trying to ease the Smith era viewers into the new show. It just falls flat on its face in a lot of ways because they picked the one modern companion who has firsthand experience with the idea of different Doctors to be the focus of the "the Doctor's changed and I don't know what's going on!" plot. Obviously, it's something that you can wrap your head around intellectually but it's completely different when you live it, but that's not the route they went - Clara just came off as an idiot with the memory of a goldfish. It also didn't help that they tried doing the Colin Baker thing again with Capaldi, but thankfully that started phasing out pretty early on and he became more of the goofy asshole that we've come to know and love.
     
  8. Achilles1943

    Achilles1943 Well-Known Member

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    about that post of mine with the reasons why the mondas theory seems unlikely ...

    the pope appears in the next episode

    it would be a very freaky and unlikly coincidence if both earth and mondas had the same religions with the same figures
     
  9. Dead Metal

    Dead Metal Well-Known Member

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    There was no hole to pull the boy out. The boy was pulled under. The hand clutching the sonic was sticking out, the ice formed around the hand. The Doctor only managed to snatch the Sonic the same moment the dead hand was pulled under.
    The fish didn't break or melt ice, they had ice manipulation powers, they even state that the monster makes the Themse freeze over in the first place. The fish manipulate it and suck victims under, and reform the ice to hide evidence.
    The boy was lost, before the Doctor ever got close enough.
     
  10. soundwaverulls

    soundwaverulls Taking a break

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    I consider it a dick move to try and convince someone to end the debate, while simultaneously trying to win the debate with a long post of arguments, however, simply because this has been dragging on forever, I'm just going to pull out of the discussion, regardless.
     
  11. SaberPrime

    SaberPrime System Pride

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    How is "agree to disagree" trying to win a debate? If I wanted to win I wouldn't have attempted to end it that way. That's me realizing that there can never be a winner. The only way to win a debate is for one of us to convince the other that our opinion is the right one and I don't believe that can ever happen.

    If it's because I still wrote a long post responding to yours that's just because I think it's rude not to respond and agree or not it's still an interesting discussion. As I said in that quote, I wouldn't mind continuing as long as we're being civil. Not really sure what the point is but I guess we're both done now. ;) 
     
  12. Achilles1943

    Achilles1943 Well-Known Member

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  13. SHINOBI03

    SHINOBI03 Well-Known Member

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    Wow, really? And didn't they say Bill's actress is leaving as well? So is the next Doctor another semi-reboot the same way they did with David Tennant - Matt Smith transition?
     
  14. Tekkaman Blade

    Tekkaman Blade Professor of Animation

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    Yes there is a new creative team after this season so they are letting them basically start from scratch.

    But if you miss the Tennant years
    Doctor Who - The Tenth Doctor and Rose Return! - News - Big Finish
     
    Last edited: May 16, 2017
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  15. Achilles1943

    Achilles1943 Well-Known Member

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    in my oppinion the 11th doctor fase was the start of a much better part of the series ... hopefully the same thing happens again
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2017
  16. Christian Prime

    Christian Prime SF Ibuki & Makoto Fanboy!

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    Like the Fourth Doctor getting a new companion, this is also some good news! :D 

    Got myself the first volume of The Tenth Doctor Adventures in that triple disc set back in April and the wait was worth it, since I cannot be able to buy the Limited Edition of that long ago, sadly.

    Recently listened to the Volume 2 trailer and it sounds promising. :) 
     
  17. Tekkaman Blade

    Tekkaman Blade Professor of Animation

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    Well we have confirmed who is in the vault now, and why.
    Pretty much who everyone expected
    That was actually a pretty well written episode and I didn't see the ending coming.
    Also that scene with Bill and her date was great.
     
  18. Switchblade

    Switchblade One Flesh, One End

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    I need to watch this one again. I was really distracted during it and missed most of the middle. I liked the beginning and ending, though. Capaldi's big speech near the end of the episode was another good 12th Doctor moment.
     
  19. Max Rawhide

    Max Rawhide Rollin' Rollin' Rollin' ... uh, never mind

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    As a rule of thumb, I don't care for episodes like this. Maybe it's the trauma over the finale of Enterprise :D .

    But this was really well done and, unlike the Enterprise episode, it serves a purpose.

    And really everyone was on fire in this episode. Capaldi was brilliant, Bill absolutely great (and fun), Nardole was kicking ass and the guest actors really helped. Great episode all around thanks to a solid written story and great acting.

    Series 10 is well on its way to becoming my favourite of the three Capaldi years. And Capaldi's Doctor, though I don't really care for this type of Doctor (I prefer the quirky, otherwordly ones like Throughton, T Baker, McCoy and Smith), I'm really starting to love him. Like McGann, his Doctor may not be my kind of Doctor, but he's absolute great. Definitely a close runner-up to me for favourite Doctor of the new era: Eleven-Twelve----Nine------------shitface (as Tennant's Character is called in Broadchurch).


    And the vault does indeed hold the most logical person. I wonder how long the Doctor has already guarded it. He said he would for a thousand years...
     
    Last edited: May 21, 2017
  20. soundwaverulls

    soundwaverulls Taking a break

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    So, that's who was in the Vault. I'm glad it's already revealed as it's exactly who I was expecting. Why they're in the vault is somewhat interesting and does have me a little curious where Moffat's going with this.

    The rest of the episode was quite good. It starts with a decent mystery, has a logical answer to the initial question, reveals a clever twist about when the audience started seeing something and ends on a semi dark note. It very much reminds me of Heaven Sent, what with there being a mystery and an answer that's quite messed up, which the Doctor can't entirely escape from. Plus, there was a lot of religious stuff, which was possibly inspired by the aforementioned episode's rather unfitting title "Heaven Sent". Speaking of, I did find those executioners quite enjoyable. Lines like "divine intervention is permitted for up to five minutes" is the sort of Moffat humor that I've personally always found amusing.

    The executioners' defeat was sadly the usual "I'm the Doctor. Basically, run." that the Doctor's pulled 100 times over the course of Moffat's run. Oh and speaking of that, I do have to criticize the episode for being kinda pointless. This is the kind of episode that needs to say something about its characters, which it really didn't. It tried to, but it was the same sort of "the Doctor is just that awesome" rubbish Moffat puts in nearly every episode he writes. And the final reveal also raises some questions. If these aliens had this level of access to every brain on the planet, why couldn't they just transmit something to each brain to kill everyone? Kinda renders this whole scheme pointless.

    Still, it was dark, fairly solid, even if pointless and most importantly, different, which might make it my favorite episode of Series 10 so far.