Discussion in 'Comic Books and Graphic Novels' started by Gears, Mar 5, 2006.
No. "Batjerk" is what drove away readers.
Compromise: DCAU Batman, before the show went over to the WB.
Um..so, yeah, I had to look up what the fuck DCAU even meant. I liked Batman:TAS...before the WB/New Batman Adventures switch and a Keeber elf posing as Tim Drake became Robin.
B:TAS Batman was never happyhappyjoyjoy Batman, so I don't get the implication that I'll hate this Batman revamp if I hated TAS...which was for all practical purposes, a spinoff of the Burton movies, which was based in no small part DKR/'angsty' Batman...which is kind of why I liked all of the above.
It does suck that this is happening. I like my batman with a side of paranoia, and dickheadiness. oh well atleast im saving money.
Holy Crappy retcon batman!
If you think that a Batman who isn't a total asshole is such a rotten idea, then you REALLY need to read some Batman from the 70s & 80s. TALES OF THE DEMON and SON OF THE DEMON would be the first two books I'd recommend. Heck, find some Batman from the 90s by Alan Grant & Norm Breyfogle too. They had a huge run on Detective Comics and Batman as well as the first arc on Shadow of the Bat.
A retcon is the adding of new information to "historical" material, or deliberately changing previously established facts in a work of serial fiction. Man of Steel was a retcon. This was not a retcon.
Batman was broken. He was over the edge with paranoia. His history wasn't rewritten. He's just better now.
When someones right there right..
"Holy stupid change batman."
I would also like to add that we atleast have frank millers all star batman.. sorry. the batman i started reading wasnt a sissy dancing around "accidently" bumping into robins groin.
and batman was not broken. hes a man who is messed up from his parents death.
Hes only being written like a dick lately. to make this stupid change back into adam west seem like a better idea.
I disagree. Batman has been slowly becoming more and more paranoid over the last few years cause of all of the crap he's had to go thru. (Contagon, Earthquake, framed for murder, a Gang War, etc...) But unlike some books, this has been written with a sense of realism that shows a natural progression of character.
The fact that he seems so different now by comparison is due to the story jumping ahead one year later. When they begin to fill in the gaps of missing time, things will smooth out a little better.
Besides, after a big build-up for so long over Bats being so paranoid, they only had two directions to take the character, over the edge or back away from it. I'm happy they chose to bring him back a bit a opposed to having him self destruct. That's what Elseworld stories are for.
Two of my favorite Bat-books.
The Brooding Dark Knight is Batman, plain and simple. I think what they are going for is a balance between the older cheerful Bats and the ultra-paranoid Bats. He will always be slightly paranoid and untrusting, anyone would be if they saw their parents shot to death. But on the flip-side he's got the biggest extended-superhero family of any character. Characters like Jim, Clark, Dick and Tim, he should have a closer relationship with.
Good to see you posting man
No kidding. I did a double take.
As for Batman of old and new, I haven't read the new issue but I can completely understand dark brooding Batman. He's supposed to be paranoid. He's the man among the supermen. If you were the "weakest" of the bunch and have witnessed many superhuman changes and problems over the years, wouldn't you want to know what's going on in case of an emergency? Damn right.
However I can see the idea of a lighter batman also. Not as anti-hero but still a force. At least for a while.
So long as we don't see the bat-tutsi, I'll be hapyp.
Didio and well... pretty every single creator involved with Batman and most of the company's editors & Paul Levitz (etc) have all gone on record as saying that the psycho paranoid Batman you guys seem to like (now that he's gone) was broken and needed to be fixed. And it's not just Batman that needed fixed. It's his whole world. The Leslie Thompkins thing where she let Spoiler die just to teach Bruce a lesson was pretty much the last straw.
Even Frank Miller, who admits that his All-Star Batman is a parody of mindless hyperviolent & decompressed comics, has said straight out that Robin's role in THAT book will be to strip the hyper-paranoid psychosis away from Batman. (I highly suspect that All-Star Bats will be relatively normal again by the time Neal Adams starts his run as artist on the title. Probably less call for ass-shots too.) The golden age of Batman comics is pretty much universally regarded as the O'Neil & Adams era. Even by the guy that f-ed Batman up by making him a psycho in the first place. That's why they've stripped the crap away so that they can rebuild the foundation that had decayed over the past decade.
No offense, but those of you that like psycho-Bats all of a sudden can still read a psycho Batman over in JMS's Squadron Supreme. Or Moon Knight.
JMS's Nighthawk is no Batman. He's a rich, stuck up, racially motivated anti-hero. Still a fantastic read but seriously one sided.
Are you so paranoid of your closest friends that you have a back-up plan in case they go nuts and turn to evil? If you do, you need some new friends fast.
Batman HAD a reason to be paranoid of the Power Pact because they f-ed with his mind. But Kal, Diana, J'Onn, Kyle, Wally & Arthur? None of them did anything to him. Kal is his closest friend. Wally & Dick have always been best friends. He watched Wally & Dick grow up from teen sidekicks into full-blown heroes on their own. He has nothing but respect for Wally. Kyle's a bit thick, but his heart's in the right place. And Bruce has never had any reason to doubt J'Onn or Arthur. Bruce personally turned over the leadership of the JLI to J'Onn when it became a part of the United Nations. The mistrust of Diana is recent. They retconed his relationship with Diana, since he's suddenly shocked that a woman he has seen kill in battle actually killed Max Lord in order to save Kal's life. Batman trusts these people because they have never intentionally let him down. He has no reason other than bad writing to mistrust any of them.
so... white Batman guy it is then.
Frankly, although I prefer a Batman that resembles the one from Batman: TAS or Batman Begins, I really don't mind the transition to a "less-darker" Batman. However, the way I see it, he's not so paranoid or delusional, but more of an anticipatory thinker who considers the situation where if his friends ever turn against him, he would be most prepared (that's not saying it won't backfire a la OMAC project).
True in the case of his closest allies and friends, they may never turn against him, but as they say "your worst enemies are your best friends (or the ones who know you the best)."
I don't think his contingency plan was just paranoia of them turing against him but for fear of them being turned against him. IE mind controlled such as Max Lord did to Superman.
I concede that is most likely what he had planned since, after all he is human.
I was just basing the other situation of close friends betraying or not coming to help Bats from a few unlucky instances in my life.
Exactly. the slightly more paranoid batman makes more sense. I mean.. it soo fits his character to have files. and plans just incase one of the supermen goes bad. I dont like a punk batman whose going to depend on everyone else to fix his problems instead of himself.
Oh well. at the end of the day. Ill only be saving money. so i shouldnt bitch that much.
Thanks, nice to see Im remembered.
The Continuity wave brought me back.
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