DC’s Batgirl (Joss Whedon Out?)

Discussion in 'Movies and Television' started by Haloid1177, Mar 30, 2017.

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  1. Tekkaman Blade

    Tekkaman Blade Professor of Animation

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    He is sometimes, but they don't often use him and some of their recent writers have even insulted him or his creations in their interviews or tweets. They often don't respect him and there is this famous quote.
    [​IMG]
     
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  2. Pharoid

    Pharoid Time Traveling Robot

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    Free / cheap Bibles, I don’t care and I am not misquoting you, you entirely missed the point. The Bible is in fact free or cheap all over the place and that has absolutely nothing to do with the public domain. It’s propaganda meant to convert people to Christianity not turn a profit.

    And again everything you stated is your preference and not a fact. There is no monopoly on entertainment ideas preventing anything. It’s entertainment. I suggest you try to tease out your personal opinion out of your argument and stop presenting it as fact.
     
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  3. Tekkaman Blade

    Tekkaman Blade Professor of Animation

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    Same to you as you seem very confused about your facts vs your opinions
     
  4. Pharoid

    Pharoid Time Traveling Robot

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    You mean when I said “I don’t see” you thought I was stating a fact, not my opinion? In that case this conversation makes a lot more sense. The Bible thing does too.
     
  5. Tekkaman Blade

    Tekkaman Blade Professor of Animation

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    Yeah how about we not play the usual who is right or wrong back and forth and agree to disagree. I’m bored with having to write pages and pages worth of facts and links and explain things only for it to be all ignored because someone has an opinion and the facts don’t matter to them.

    You live by your beliefs I’ll go by mine, none of it matters in the end anyway.
     
  6. Pharoid

    Pharoid Time Traveling Robot

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    First of all you replied to me. So give the fainting chair a rest.

    Secondly entertainment IPs going into the public domain being beneficial to society in any way is subjective, not factual. But I’d welcome a fact from you. You haven’t provided any just your opinion.
     
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  7. Tekkaman Blade

    Tekkaman Blade Professor of Animation

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    I've dropped this pointless conversation please do the same.
     
  8. Megastar

    Megastar Well-Known Member

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    Just to toss in my 2 cents on the matter; I don't think intellectual properties, like Spider-Man or Batman should go into public domain and should belong to the companies that created them or owns them.

    Creators who are inspired by them will just make their own thing, like how Daredevil inspired the TMNT.
     
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2022
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  9. Pharoid

    Pharoid Time Traveling Robot

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    I am curious. Is there a case of a character going into the public domain and seeing a real revival? Or celebrated characterization once the property shifted into PD? I don’t know genuinely curious.
     
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  10. Macross7

    Macross7 Well-Known Member

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    Can't think of any ones of characters created this/last century but pretty much all the PD ones Disney turned into films are now thought of as the 'default' version. You can't think of Snow White without thinking of the Disney version.
     
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  11. Pharoid

    Pharoid Time Traveling Robot

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    So here’s what I believe to be the issue. I get the knee-jerk “corporations are evil” and this can be done better by “people who care” etc..., etc..., But we are material girls living in a material world.

    Let’s say for instance you reinvent Buck Rogers (who’s currently not in the PD) and its brilliant you manage to hit the strike-plate of the cultural zeitgeist and its a phenomenon. What happens next? Do you really profit on your product? Maybe a little? But whatever interest you generate is immediately going to be lost in a sea of copy-cat products and bullshit spun out rapidly, opportunists riding your coat-tails and blurring the line between what you did and what they can take from you.

    I suspect but I don’t know that public domain is probably IP hell. Who and why would you use an old property when you can’t really profit from it? It’s obviously more lucrative to have something you own and something you can protect.
     
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  12. Tekkaman Blade

    Tekkaman Blade Professor of Animation

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  13. Pharoid

    Pharoid Time Traveling Robot

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    There have been comic characters dumped into the public domain for years, Dynamite comics did a bunch of them with Alex Ross doing covers.

    Here’s a forgettable fuck ton
    Heroes

    Long Box Heroes is even doing toys of a bunch of them.

    Obviously super popular stuff...
     
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  14. Dolza_Khyron

    Dolza_Khyron Well-Known Member

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    I don't know how I feel about public domain things. There have been a lot of great things made from public domain things, giving access to these properties to people around the world. I do really like seeing various takes on the Wizard Of Oz, for example. However, most of this comes from hindsight. Most of things that I like that are great, have been around for very long periods of time.

    We have things being made like the Pooh horror film, which really seem to have anything to do with Winnie The Pooh, other than having the masks. This appears to be a case of a studio making a movie, placing familiar things on top of it, in order to better sell it. In order to get reactions out of people on social media. In theory, I have no problem with them doing this. I have no interest in the movie myself, however, it is the speed they came out with this after Pooh went into public domain. They had to have filmed it before it went into public domain, then released trailers of it as soon as possible, because now they can.

    This seems like something that is easily exploited, in order to avoid paying not only the owners, but the creators/families as well. While I don't really care if Disney gets their credit/check/okay in this, but I do have a problem with the creators, and their families not getting their dues. To me that is what is important, not screwing over the people who created these things and their estates once they've passed. This is already something that studios are abusing, with this Winnie The Pooh thing. I do like it when these things are already in public domain, because we get a lot of great things out of it (Along with some terrible things as well.), but set dates allow these companies to sit on projects, and just wait until that date has passed, before telling the public about it. So, it sounds to me like public domain is a double edged sword.
     
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  15. Scrapmaker

    Scrapmaker Hadar Sen Olmen

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    To be clear I don't think letting things lapse into the public domain is necessarily the solution either. There can be good adaptations and bad adaptations of things in the public domain, but I think Marvel and DC both benefit from being definitively under some measure of exclusive control. I just also oppose Disney's growing monopoly and would rather they not get any bigger, even if they are good at brand management and marketing.
     
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  16. G1Prowl

    G1Prowl Prick, apparently

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    The Protectors by Malibu Comics were almost all public domain characters. However, there are some restrictions on how they are allowed to present those characters. Marvel owns the Malibu rendition of those characters now so, for instance, you couldn't make The Ferret look like he did in the Malibu run. While you're still able to do your own versions of certain characters you are stuck in a rut with what you CANNOT touch if someone has done said PD character and yours takes cues from their version at all.
     
  17. Pharoid

    Pharoid Time Traveling Robot

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    So just to be clear....there are NO cases of properties transitioning into the Public Domain and enjoying any success or reinvigorated popularity...

    Yet despite no evidence of it being beneficial for a property people are extolling it’s virtues....
     
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  18. Gordon_4

    Gordon_4 The Big Engine

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    So does that make George a fellow white slaver? Since you know, HE sold Star Wars when a sufficiently large asking price was presented. He has seller’s remorse, and he has no one to blame for that but himself.
     
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  19. Tekkaman Blade

    Tekkaman Blade Professor of Animation

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    Again your confusing your own opinions with fact. You ask a question and when no one answers it to your satisfaction in a couple hours claim it as fact. I didn't answer your first post because I didn't want to get into another back and forth with you. Still really don't, but there seems to be an error in your conclusion at least as you have stated it.

    Lets look at a recent example Sherlock Holmes. After going public Domain there were several series and movies launched including Sherlock, Elementary and the Robert Downy Jr movies. All would be considered sucessful and generating more interest in the property.
    List of awards and nominations received by Sherlock - Wikipedia
    Emmys 2016: ‘Sherlock’ Wins Outstanding Television Movie – Deadline
    Elementary

    How about Tarzan after Disney made their movie? Quasimodo after a disney movie got pretty popular years after their books were published and they entered the public domain, Snow White, Dracula, Frankenstein, Rapunzel, The Mummy, The little Mermaid. Ebeneezer Scrooge, all these characters have had periods of popularity and all are after they entered the public domain.

    Again keep in mind for the last 20 years there haven't been a lot of historically popular properties that even entered the public domain because of law changes extending copyright.
    For the First Time in More Than 20 Years, Copyrighted Works Will Enter the Public Domain | Arts & Culture| Smithsonian Magazine

    Studios can't even start working on a movie till something enters public domain, if they do they can get sued because they were working on it when someone else still owned the copyright. So typically it takes a year or two after public domain entry till a project comes out.

    Zorro for example recently entered public domain and there are now several projects in the works based on it.
    'Zorro' Reboot Series in the Works From Secuoya Studios, John Gertz - Variety
    Zorro Series Starring Wilmer Valderrama in the Works at Disney TV - Variety
    ‘Zorro’ Drama With Female Lead From Robert Rodriguez, Rebecca Rodriguez, Sofia Vergara & Propagate In Works At NBC – Deadline
    Female-Led Zorro Series Moving Ahead at The CW
    Zorro: The Chronicles launches in June - Gematsu

    Those won't even hit for a year or two.

    I recommend doing a bit more research before declaring something as a fact.

    But again this is the Batgirl thread, we should probably be talking about Batgirl.
     
    Last edited: Aug 9, 2022
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  20. Pharoid

    Pharoid Time Traveling Robot

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    I’ll explain my point again. Everything you mentioned is more or less a one-off. Nothing “stuck” these aren’t recurring brands. They don’t exist in the public consciousness far beyond their initial iterations. Forever stunted and suffering from generation loss. In fact the only thing that is recurring are the monsters; Dracula, Frankenstein, the Mummy etc. but they are recurring as The Universal Monsters, a branded property. They have some toy presence, some retail existence, as Universal Monsters. And of course frozen in time.. Almost everything you mentioned is effectively a dead character. With the exception of Disney which is an entirely different situation and you know that it is.

    Is Zorro relevant anymore? Is Tarzan relevant anymore? What’s the next Dracula movie going to be? Another retelling of the same story? The character has become so prevalent, so ubiquitous that he’s rendered pointless. That’s what stunted is, these characters aren’t progressing any more, they aren’t alive. They are constantly living in a closed loop, retelling the same story with different players.

    So ask yourself as a fan, what’s my favorite brand that I want in the public domain so everyone can have a go at it, like a whore. Is it Transformers? Star Wars? Superman? When everyone has control no one has control and the story stops.
     
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