Day 1 locked "Multiplayer Havoc" DLC...

Discussion in 'Transformers Video Game Discussion' started by Tiller, Aug 21, 2012.

  1. Dark Magnus

    Dark Magnus Your opinion is wrong!

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2003
    Posts:
    6,684
    News Credits:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    302
    Likes:
    +59
    Ebay:
    I miss the days of unlockable content.

    At the very least, they could have made this content free for the first week and then charged $5 for the "extra" characters after that. Sort of a thank you to early supporters.
     
  2. Kalyx triaD

    Kalyx triaD R-Tyme Entertainment

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2007
    Posts:
    131
    Trophy Points:
    56
    Likes:
    +0
    - You in fact do not own all content on-disc, just what was advertised.
    - Content on-disc is no different from content off-disc. You're still paying for it, and the compatibility issues are mitigated.
    - Day/Week-1 DLC sales like hotcakes. Nobody's forcing these kids to buy them. Ergo they will be done all the time. If gamers actually knew how to boycott, we'd see a difference by now.
    - This thing about the game being unfinished? Stop it. The DLC pack doesn't affect the game in the slightest, it's extra stuff. You'll live without it.
     
  3. Grimlockimus

    Grimlockimus Wot?

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2011
    Posts:
    6,495
    News Credits:
    20
    Trophy Points:
    247
    Likes:
    +5,141
    So...guessing the DLC isn't up for PS3 yet? Or is it not up for anyone?
     
  4. Tiller

    Tiller I don't know nothin'

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2009
    Posts:
    4,986
    News Credits:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    262
    Likes:
    +905
    Ebay:
    Except we saw devs playing with these characters without even mentioning this was the case. We had no idea there were DLC characters until the game launched. There was a lack of advertising.
     
  5. Dashdragon

    Dashdragon Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2012
    Posts:
    936
    News Credits:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    117
    Likes:
    +1
    That's playing into a gray area as, of course, we don't technically own ANY of the content on the disk for any game we own due to IP laws. However, you did pay to play the entire game that is on the disk, which if parts are locked out without paying more...well...that's technically false advertising...if we're going to get technical.

    Not exactly sure what you're getting at here. Off-disk(c) content is most assuredly different than on-disk. One is on the disk you paid for, the other is not. One is being paid for by the original sticker price from the sales purchase that came after it was developed, the other was created afterwards for additional profit. Typically done to increase revenue after the initial launch sales dwindle.

    Unfortunately this is mostly true. Though it's not to say that nothing can be done..just it's not looking all that hopeful at this point.

    They lost a sale on my end though and probably a few others. Maybe a steam sale or a GOTY edition down the road might change my mind. They'd have made more if they just increased the base price and unlocked everything on the disk as I and any others of like mindset would have bought it.

    Also this thread wouldn't exist (nor the many others I'm sure exist throughout the interwebs)

    I think I missed the part about the game being unfinished...maybe that was earlier in the thread or your interpreting things a bit differently.

    However, it's not a matter of 'live without it'. It's a matter of paying to play everything on the disk that the customer explicitly paid for in the first place.
     
  6. Squints

    Squints Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2007
    Posts:
    577
    Trophy Points:
    111
    Likes:
    +0
    I wish I had more time to formulate a response, but I don't really have much time, so I just want to cut down to the one part that I feel is a fundamental misunderstanding here (the part I bolded in your post).

    It's not like they spent 30 out of 40 hours that they were paid for on the game, another 10 hours on the skin, and were paid more than they would be paid for 40 hours of work despite only doing 40 hours of work. It's that they spent 40 out of 40 hours that they were paid for on the game, then spent another 10 hours on the skin, and, having done 50 hours worth of work, quite reasonably required 50 hours worth of pay.

    I don't know how much clearer I can make it that the most probable cause wasn't exclusively to be evil and screw over players, but more that they worked on something extra AFTER they were finished with the COMPLETE game and couldn't possibly do more with the completed game.

    In other words, it's not that they spent the game's development cycle working on $50 worth of game and $10 worth of DLC. They spent the game's development cycle working on $60 worth of game, then spent some time afterward working on $10 worth of DLC, which they then realized they could partially package with the game so as to ease some of the logistical problems that might otherwise have arisen.

    The thing is, you're claiming they "cherry-picked" certain content after the fact to put behind a payment, content that was already in the game. I'm proposing that they added certain content after the fact, behind a payment that previously had nothing behind it, content (or at least parts of content) that wasn't already in the game.
     
  7. Dashdragon

    Dashdragon Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2012
    Posts:
    936
    News Credits:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    117
    Likes:
    +1
    I had actually worded that in that manner hoping that you would key in on it with that exact sort of argument (or debate/discussion/whatever) I, however, am also running out of time here so I do not think I'll be able to retort as completely and succinctly as I might have intended.

    Given our mutual ignorance of the specifics, but knowledge of the general concepts the scenario actually breaks down more to this (at least in regards to the characters part)

    Their bosses were told that they wanted a certain list of characters. They gave this to their team who produced this list of characters. Other groups did their part to get it all implemented into the game. They had some meetings and discussed money matters. They picked out a few of the characters and had the programmers flag these for the DLC gating system already built-in.

    I wouldn't even doubt if the DLC characters were put on a higher priority than the regular ones due to the fact that they get more money per skin for those than the 'vanilla' ones that they left outside of the lock.

    In the end, nobody really came and put in OT for adding these in, and any work done to the content that is contained on the disk is not 'extra'. Until that disk is finalized and sent out to the production facility to start printing the commercial copies, absolutely nothing is 'extra' work.

    I think in the end you and I will just have to disagree here, but I think our essential disagreement is a mentality thing only. One that prior to the consoles jumping in with HD's, internet, and so many shared titles with PC, was a no brainer and now has taken a complete 180. Wasn't all that long ago that no developer would dream of trying to get away with half the things that are slowly being allowed to become standard.

    As evidenced by many posters in this thread, we're doing it to ourselves too.
     
  8. Reaper Cloud

    Reaper Cloud Dark Wrecker

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2012
    Posts:
    978
    News Credits:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    112
    Likes:
    +7
    This is the big one that is screwing gamers over who actually grew up playing games to unlock items that now COST money to get.

    It will only get worse come the next generation of gaming consoles, which I will take NO part in. My gaming ends with the PS3, and I will enjoy every game that I own without giving two shits about some PS4 (or whatever it's called) title.

    Kids today are all "Gimme Gimme Gimme!" and the parents give in just to shut them up. Kids have no clue about how the real world works, and ANY adult who gives money toward a DLC that is on disc is blind to how it is taking money from them. They probably say "It's only X amount, it isn't much." Well, if companies have learned anything from the past it's this. If they can take advantage of a customer...they will continue to do so, and make it worse each time. Only when the customer says "Enough!" will it end.

    Today's society is full of no-balls cowards who give in every chance they get. People like this deserve every bad thing that happens to them.
     
  9. emoo

    emoo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2011
    Posts:
    1,681
    Trophy Points:
    197
    Likes:
    +370
    Yeah even wfc and dotm gave two unlockable characters for beating the game. Doesn't look like an option here, no menu comes up in the extras menu for character unlocks. In the other games it did even if you didn't unlock them yet they would just be blacked out images.
     
  10. Jadryx

    Jadryx Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2010
    Posts:
    2,025
    News Credits:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    151
    Likes:
    +3
    According to a review I read when you complete the campaign they give you an avatar award (one for each ending choice) They didn't spoil what it was though.
     
  11. CodeXCDM

    CodeXCDM Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2011
    Posts:
    7,851
    News Credits:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    247
    Likes:
    +1,602
    Ebay:
    False advertising indeed!

    When folks like EA, Activision (who's probably the reason this "DLC" exists, not HMS) and Capcom sell DLC... they mean "Disc-Locked" Content in many cases, and not always DownLoadable, which is what folks normally assume the acronym stands for.

    In essence... they're either deceptively using the DLC acronym because folks might not know better... or deceptively calling it DownLoadable Content when the only "DownLoad" is an unlocker string for "Disc-Locked" content.

    It does make one wonder if some day one or more folks try to sue for such misuse of the Acronym and/or proper definition of what is Downloaded Content.
     
  12. Autobot Burnout

    Autobot Burnout Droppin' Space Colonies

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2008
    Posts:
    36,734
    Trophy Points:
    392
    Location:
    [REDACTED]
    Likes:
    +18,455
    Interesting. This is going to be useful if I get the chance to bring it up in my "Technology and Culture" course in some relateable topic.
     
  13. mrcaino9

    mrcaino9 Leakin' Lubricants!!!

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2012
    Posts:
    562
    Trophy Points:
    112
    Likes:
    +8

    ^^^I totally agree! This thread & most of it's posters proves one thing to me... IF YOU DON'T STAND FOR SOMETHING, YOU'LL FALL FOR ANYTHING!!!
     
  14. Kevin XI

    Kevin XI Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2010
    Posts:
    3,906
    News Credits:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    237
    Location:
    Lewisville TX
    Likes:
    +222
    Right on! We got some real revolutionaries in here! Fight the power!
     
  15. The Constructicon

    The Constructicon Yeah, I turn into a leg.

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2007
    Posts:
    1,372
    Trophy Points:
    126
    Likes:
    +0
    I bought it, I feel dirty...


    It feels good.
    -stomps around as Ultra Magnus-
     
  16. Blackout32

    Blackout32 PANTERA FAR BEYOND DRIVEN

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2007
    Posts:
    7,471
    Trophy Points:
    282
    Location:
    Cybertron in the Matrix of leadership
    Likes:
    +2,195
    Ebay:
    Twitter:
    YouTube:
    I didn't buy it cause I am not a multiplayer on games. I just dont see the reason for the cost cause to me I think it should be free.
     
  17. Prime Jetscream

    Prime Jetscream Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2011
    Posts:
    10,461
    News Credits:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    227
    Likes:
    +26
    When I picked up my PS3 game the stupid employee searched up the Havoc Pack for me, but told me PS3 doesn't get it just yet unlike everything else. Got home, SHOVED the game in, and it turns out the Havoc Pack IS already on PSN store.
     
  18. Kalyx triaD

    Kalyx triaD R-Tyme Entertainment

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2007
    Posts:
    131
    Trophy Points:
    56
    Likes:
    +0
    Wrong. You play what is advertised, not everything on disc. What the company deems for you and held away is entirely up to them, whether on disc or not. Thia is an issue many gamers refuse to accept, but it's completely legal and legit.

    All the analogies with cars and houses are moot, because they are cars and houses. These are games. Media printed on DVDs. Very different, and people need to square with that.

    Again, you paid for what was advertised. It being on disc does not factor. There can be content on disc you still have to pay for, just like content on your HDD you still have to pay for. It. Makes. No. Difference.

    Except in somebody's head/heart.

    Essentially you're skipping on a fantastic game because you don't have five sets of armor, based on some misunderstood sense of content ownership. Okay.

    A great many people have no idea how this actually works so yeah, these threads are everywhere.

    See above about paying for what was advertised to you.
     
  19. Prime Jetscream

    Prime Jetscream Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2011
    Posts:
    10,461
    News Credits:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    227
    Likes:
    +26
    I'm gonna buy it, but my account is empty right now. D:
     
  20. Dashdragon

    Dashdragon Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2012
    Posts:
    936
    News Credits:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    117
    Likes:
    +1
    You know, I could attempt to try and really discuss this issue with you, but you evidently think you can win an argument just by coming in and saying "You're wrong! neener neener neener!" Bottom line is people pay for a game, they get to play all of that game for which they paid for. Even you agree with that statement.

    However, you seem to be under the misconception regarding what that means, and it's this misconception that these companies are trying to play off of and push down the gaming community's throat so they can get us to the point where they can rip us off in any manner in which they choose at any time. As was said just a few posts before me, this is all caused by the Xbox live and PSN coming into the scene. Little console kiddies have known nothing else and have no understanding of games working any other way. They're just happy to be able to add content and update their games at all period I guess.

    Your condescending tone really states it all though. We're just ignorant slobs to you who just 'don't get it' when in actuality you're the one that obviously isn't understanding. Such as - I am personally not buying the game because I don't agree with their DLC strategy and have no desire to support it or them because this DLC crap needs to stop before it gets even worse. I could honestly give 2 shits about having a few sets of multi-player armor as I wouldn't play anything other than the storyline anyway. One should always be careful about making assumptions regarding a person who makes no claims towards anything. You never know who or what they may be or may have done.

    Which, btw, just because you stick up for their greed and go around defending all the bigshot gaming companies doesn't mean you're going to get an "in" with them for your little basement company if that's what you're thinking. Which, if that's the sort of system you're going to support and the attitude you're going to take to criticism of it, well...good luck with the PR should you ever get anything out there.