Could Hasbro/Takara take a 3rd party release and rerelease as offical?

Discussion in 'Transformers 3rd Party Discussion' started by Ambrojh, Feb 10, 2019.

  1. Ambrojh

    Ambrojh Well-Known Member

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    What if Hasbro or Takara simply took whatever 3rd party company release and added the Autobot or Decepticon symbol to the piece and added the Hasbro or Takara stamp on it and mass produce it for cheaper, what would the 3p company be able to do? I bring this up as the image of the Hasbro Seige Jetfire looks like Fans Toys Pheonix.
     
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  2. Windsweeper II

    Windsweeper II The Pristine

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    Interesting question.
     
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  3. AutobotAvalanche

    AutobotAvalanche Number One in Boogieland Moderator

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    I think they might be able to get away with it, if only because of the 3P companies operating in the shadows as it is. If they wanted to come forward and take action, the main advantage they have (being obscure and in China) would be lost.
     
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  4. backhawkdown

    backhawkdown Well-Known Member

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    No. The toy doesn’t belong to them. Both Hasbro and the 3P companies are private entities (although Hasbro’s is publicly traded). Hasbro has no right to go to a separate, private entity and take their property. They would first need a court order stating the 3p figure is a derivative work and declaring it is property that belongs to Hasbro on that grounds. The court would then have to definitely rule the toy belongs to Hasbro.

    Perhaps you don’t mean can they legally do so and are just asking if they can do so from an ability standpoint. Of course, Hasbro could simply reverse engineer the toy and produce it; they are a pretty competent company with the technology and ability to do so. Seems like a silly question to ask from that standpoint. But if Hasbro did so, it would be up to the 3P company to sue them to stop it, which would be unlikely. So Hasbro would likely get away with it if they did so.
     
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  5. deaculpa

    deaculpa Seven Star Fist

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    You mean like ft Phoenix? I’d say so.

    F4DD809F-5252-4008-BB6F-67C100A317B2.jpeg 0BEBD62A-BB3A-4A34-9B5F-F0A36D5D9ABD.jpeg
     
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  6. Banatine

    Banatine Well-Known Member

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    I think the question isn’t COULD they, but more likely WOULD they?

    After all the VAST majority of 3rd party stuff is made to a much higher standard of quality that HasTak wants to make things at for mass market sales, in terms of parts count and complexity and paint apps etc.

    I think the irony is that HasTak couldn't copy a 3P’s work without making it as a cheap knock-off...

    That said, Seige Jetfire does indeed look an awful lot like Phoenix, except far better because it has panel lining and better proportions (to me at least). I guess we’ll have to see when it’s released and somebody does a direct side by side comparison :) 
     
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  7. El Duque

    El Duque Well-Known Member

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    Both figures draw from the same source material, naturally they will look the same.
     
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  8. Decepticon13

    Decepticon13 Well-Known Member

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  9. edgecrusher

    edgecrusher Pepperidge Farm remembers TFW2005 Supporter

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    This is the crux of it. They won't because they're a big corporation run by bean counters rather than fans.
     
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  10. Max Rawhide

    Max Rawhide Well-Known Member

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    Not a lawyer, but this is what I've come to understand from the many discussion regarding this topic.

    If the 3P company's have registered their design, then that belongs to them. As soon as Hasbro releases it (either by re-engineering or stealing the CAD files), they have the right (and the obligation) to sue for copyright infringement. And should it come to court, they would win, because it is their design and Hasbro is stealing it. (Hasbro would then be a KO company.)

    However, as soon as the 3rd party company goes to court, they are registered and Hasbro will try to sue them for IP and copyright infringement. Will they win? Very likely not (because most 3rd party companies create their own TF's and don't use the TF name or brandname). But Hasbro is a big company with well paid, expensive lawyers so the whole situation will drag on for months or even years. This will ruin the 3rd party company, because they have to hire lawyers as well and those cost a lot of money. And while the whole thing is in court, they can't release new figures amd thus no revenue.


    A 3P company could thus sue, but likely won't.


    Well, it's trying to recreate the same design, so naturally they will look similar. Important point is, is the transformation and the dimensions the same.[/QUOTE]
     
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  11. GR1ML0CK

    GR1ML0CK Dinobot Commander

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  12. Ambrojh

    Ambrojh Well-Known Member

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    I am not an attorney either, nor do I expect anyone here to be an expert on copyright or international infringement law. It's just a question on what us the buyers/fans think. But, yes, if Hasbro basically kos a 3p release. I think Hasbro is able to produce the same piece for cheaper, as either they own the factory or have excellent terms.
     
  13. RMStunticon

    RMStunticon Dan Kuroto Fan

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  14. Robogeek28

    Robogeek28 Who're you calling a geek?

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    Hasbro needs to worry about child safety laws, so anything coming from a 3rd party stolen design would still need to go through whatever tests official figures hafta go through, and many things on the 3rd party designs probably wouldn't pass the tests, so I couldn't see Hasbro even bothering with it.
     
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  15. myrrh

    myrrh Knell-Mown Wember

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    ...by way of precedent, takara sort-of already has: kobayashi was hired on the strength of his fan-made arcee prototype, and hasbro subsequently turned around a mass-production evolution of his original design as thrilling 30 arcee...

    [​IMG]
     
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  16. deaculpa

    deaculpa Seven Star Fist

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    I’d say they took some pretty clear design queues from the ft interpretation. By this logic, they would all look like like FT and FT would look like past Hasbro versions.



    upload_2019-2-10_14-26-44.jpeg
     
  17. backhawkdown

    backhawkdown Well-Known Member

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    No, the logic doesn’t lead you down that path at all. The figure you posted doesn’t even attempt to replicate the animation model the way Phoenix and Siege Jetfire do.
     
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  18. kronatron

    kronatron Well-Known Member

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    I've often wondered the same. But to me it just does not seem practical for a multimillion dollar producer to go after a particular factory that probably has business ties to them already.

    I think the better question might be, why not absorb those companies as subsidiaries of hasbro/takara? Full permission to use names/designs, but tailored to a more mature collectors' market so they don't have to worry about safety laws because it's not presented as a child's toy.

    That's my two cents.
     
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  19. lordcryotek

    lordcryotek Try it out, try it out man

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    I'd actually like to see Has/Tak go further with what they're doing with Siege and create a line that's more like what MMC is doing--just all voyager+ figures at a $50+ price point. That way they have a mid-grade collector line that would allow Hasui to do his thing without parts count limitations (like the MPs he used to do that helped to inspire the third party market's MP style) and also bring in more fans who aren't into the animation accurate figures but want something a bit better than the hollow-ass CHUG figures of yore. But no, it'd be silly for them to go in and steal a mold from their competitors, I don't see any benefit in doing that. I think the most they've done is be inspired by what the third parties are making.
     
    Last edited: Feb 10, 2019
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  20. Shunwei

    Shunwei Well-Known Member

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    well Sunstreaker did take a lot of ideas from badcube. From a distance they look very similar