Could a sane Grimlock defeat Tarn?

Discussion in 'Transformers Comics Discussion' started by General Magnus, Apr 13, 2014.

  1. Rung

    Rung DESIGNER!!!

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    dude he just performed an awesome metallicato technique and bit skid's ass and kicked magnus in the face... : o
     
  2. Chantinelle

    Chantinelle Well-Known Member

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    Honestly, nothing I've seen of Tarn so far really impresses me much. Yeah, he's got a scary voice and TWO FUSION CANNONS MAAAAN and all that guff but it's easy to look good when there's a squad of you beating the crap out of some lone dude or a bunch of no-hopers.

    Reckon a fully functional Grim firing on all cylinders would tear the guy a new one.
     
  3. SMOG

    SMOG Vocabchampion ArgueTitan

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    I don't think the teleportation is actually a "power". I think it's just one of those recall buttons that Tyrest had been using. I would file it under a "Quick! To the hydrofoil!" escaping villain plot device rather than a special ability.

    He is huge, and huge guys are often implied to be more powerful. He's a rogue Circle of Light guy, so he probably has some kind of mystic sword business going for him. Safe to say, he's probably a heavy hitter, if not a world-ender.

    Well, we know he's Forged at least. And guys of his vintage often are powerful on some quasi-mythic level. Still... I can't help thinking of Dai Atlas as a total loser. :) 

    Wait, who? Bludgeon? He may have some skillz, but what I mean is that he hasn't demonstrated any raw cosmic power on the level we might expect from a failed copy of Thunderwing (who was basically a walking apocalypse).

    It's less about what Tarn has done, and more what people have said or implied about him. Prowl pointedly included him on a list of the most powerful known Transformers. He said, point blank, that the power of guys like Grimlock, Megatron and Optimus pales (PALES!!) before the level of guys like Sixshot, Overlord and Tarn. (MTMTE#14)

    In the same issue, Rossum explains how with Ununtrium bonded to his endoskeleton, Overlord is virtually indestructible. It's also pointed out that even while helpless in Autobot custody, with full medical access, the Bots couldn't even get access to Overlord's Spark chamber... which means they couldn't break into his endoskeleton, even under completely controlled circumstances.

    Nope. If you look at the details, there is no question. Tarn and the other Phase-Six guys are in a whole other class, beyond Megatron, Prime or Grimlock. Case closed.

    zmog
     
  4. grimlockgravez

    grimlockgravez Dinobot

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    I know!!!
    It would be great!!!
    ... Bad cop Good cop. Would love it!

    Fortress Maximus (G1) - Transformers Wiki

    Once the Legislators were defeated, Rodimus commended Fortress Maximus for his defense of the ship and offered him Ultra Magnus's previous title of Duly Appointed Enforcer of the Tyrest Accord. As this position that would have him leave the Lost Light, Maximus feared he might have another breakdown if left unchecked and asked for advice from Rung, who reassured him of his mental health and convinced him to accept. Maximus subsequently departed the Lost Light, remaining on Luna 1 alongside Red Alert and the Circle of Light to guard a captive Tyrest. The Sound of Breaking Glass

    So it seems that's what happened to Fort Max.
     
  5. Scaldron

    Scaldron Well-Known Member

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    wait, really? but we see his spark glowing blue in-story, though.

    [​IMG]

    (i'd been attached to the idea that he was constructed cold and had a blue spark, and he was just uniquely resilient on his own, but eh)
     
  6. Anguirus

    Anguirus Well-Known Member

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    Oh shit.

    CANON.

    As had I, honestly. Maybe he was constructed cold but was some sort of experiment that was then covered up? I mean, I do appreciate all he's accomplished with sheer willpower and force of personality, but OTOH you can't just think yourself into an undefeated record with Overlord.
     
  7. SMOG

    SMOG Vocabchampion ArgueTitan

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    Well, to be fair Megatron's undefeated record with Overlord was before Overlord received his UUT upgrade. So basically Overlord was just a big guy with a strong spark (presumably)... and Megatron toppled him with skillz.

    But if you look at the list of OTHER things Megatron has done, it seems increasingly unlikely that a non-POP Constructed bot would have that kind of resilience. But then... Fort Max is Constructed, and he's considered one of Prowl's "once in a generation" bots too...

    Also Megatron, like, ate that Quintesson's spark. If that even counts.

    zmog
     
  8. Shortwave

    Shortwave Autobot fembot

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    To bad we cant ger Death's Head in here.
     
  9. Anguirus

    Anguirus Well-Known Member

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    No, Max cannot be constructed. He's Warborn. They stopped bleeding the Matrix long before the war. He and Fulcrum are young Forged.
     
  10. Prime_Directive

    Prime_Directive less than meets the eye

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    Plus, Max wasn't affected by the killswitch while Blaster was.
     
  11. Sentinel Prime

    Sentinel Prime Traitor to the cause

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    Any fight with a powerful Autobot against Tarn wouldn't last long for the simple fact that Tarn is (my guess) the Autobot's mole in the D.J.D. and he'd stop the fight to reveal himself before it got really ugly.

    SP4H
     
  12. noblekale

    noblekale There can be only one!

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    I didn't think that was Megatron's spark though. I just thought it was related to the space bridge tech Shockwave put in, or maybe a power core. It doesn't look like Ratchet's spark casing.
     
  13. Rung

    Rung DESIGNER!!!

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    AH YES, thank you for mentioning fortmax, i was acutally going to ask where the hell has he been? but didn't they all leave luna 1? isn't redalert in lost light? captive tyrest? but he died! where is this? i can't remember.
     
  14. GingerSynapse

    GingerSynapse Well-Known Member

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    I thought that as well. It's been pretty well touted he's a .01 percenter, but I don't think I've ever seen a panel with his spark exposed.
     
  15. RatTrap1985

    RatTrap1985 Under your rolls of fat

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    I have no idea, but I'd like to see it.
     
  16. Knightdramon

    Knightdramon Hasbro LIES to the US

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    While yes, with that revelation Fort Max is forged, Tyrest did mention that they were producing more sparks than they had bodies for, and they were storing them.

    So coming online after the matrix bleeding doesn't necessarily mean you're forged.
     
  17. Anguirus

    Anguirus Well-Known Member

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    ^ So they didn't use up their supply of sparks in however many millions of years between that dude hiding the Matrix and the present day?

    I do not think that bodies were systematically constructed during the war. Weird stuff like Insecticons and Ironhide 2.0, and replacement bodies for OP and Megatron. But the "population expansion" I think of as a one-off event.
     
  18. SMOG

    SMOG Vocabchampion ArgueTitan

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    Yeah, I'd forgotten about the killswitch incident.

    Do we know Fulcrum was warborn? He could be older, no?

    It's cute that you think so. :) 

    By that, I mean that the IDW universe is morally black and white enough that Agent 113 would blow his cover that easily. I think he's in DEEP.

    Yeah, that.

    I can't imagine why, though. They boosted the population of on-the-ground cybertronians, but that also left them with a massive surplus of sparks. TFs live a long time. Before the war, I doubt they were burning through the populace at such a pace that they'd need to dip into the surplus sparks in storage.

    However, once the war began, I'll bet those sparks suddenly became extremely valuable commodities. Considering the enormous casualties incurred in the great war, and the decreasing incidence of hotspots, I'll bet they needed to bust open the reserve sparks.

    Overlord's "natural birth" seemed to be highly exceptional... and that was even before the war, which makes him pretty young (younger than most of the cast, considering some writers' propensity for trying to squeeze named cameos for practically everyone into pre-war stories, which I think is a bad practice in general). If Fort Max is 'warborn' that makes him even younger... so either he was a stored spark, or an even more exceptional find (as a Point One Percenter... presumably).

    Was it established even that Constructed are never POPs?

    zmog
     
  19. Rung

    Rung DESIGNER!!!

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    i always thought rodimus was a warborn... IDW ruined it for me.
     
  20. Anguirus

    Anguirus Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, his big speech to the DJD was about how he was "born at the height of the Decepticon Empire."

    The whole point was that Nova wanted to build the population. The limiting factor was not "how many Transformers there currently are" because no matter HOW many there were, Nova wanted more. The only limiting factor--and I think this is being rather over-interpreted from a hyperbolic line from Tyrest, but here goes anyway--was that they couldn't BUILD bodies fast enough.

    It took three years to hand-build Megatron's body in the Ongoing. The Transformers had six million years to match the "bled" sparks to bodies on an industrialized world.

    Right now I'm reading all the constructed-cold guys as being roughly the same age (give or take a couple million) and Forged can be any age, but since the hot spots are now dry, young ones are very rare. Even Warborn people aren't that common. I think that when Construction began the Constructed-Cold bots quickly started to outnumber Forged bots, hence the tension (and the success of Nova's idea to bolster the population). But, in the millions of years since, enough Forged have been born that the ratio is more like 50-50 now. This assumes they were killed in the war at a roughly equal rate.

    Yes. I remember it was established in the comics: if nowhere else, by Minimus Ambus in his little cell-block speech. From the Wiki:

    "When describing himself, Ambus draws a distinction between himself and "heavyweight class" Point One Percenters, naming Impactor and Roller as examples of that group. However, Last Stand of the Wreckers informed us that Impactor had been found guilty during the Aequitas trials, and this issue tells us that all those found guilty were Constructed Cold, while one has to be Forged in order to be a Point One Percenter. The text was amended for the trade to remove this mistake, replacing Impactor's name with Grimlock's."

    And my personal theory on Maximus ("...on a good day") is that he's not green-sparked, but just a more-powerful spark that was given a super-weaponed-up body and trained as the ultimate soldier.