Not originally. I disagree. At the time BW started incorporating G1 into its storyline, I already had every UK released BW figure up to then. I started collecting them as soon as I saw them, before I'd even seen the TV show. G1 had nothing to do with it.
I second Draven's response. BW revived Transformers without G1's help. Only when Transformers was fully revived did they go in depth with the G1 homage etc...
Late Season 1. I'm not sure when the first mentions of G1 were made, but there are 20 episodes before "Possession", which if I remember correctly is the episode that cements the two eras together. Any mention before that could've been written off as "homage" or the sort of reference, like "the planet Cybertron" that fall under the "part of calling yourself a Transformers show" category.
Or a vision of Cheetor on Cybertron watching Starscream fly by. also, didn't Starscream's ghost make his appearance in Season 1?
That's not the point. G1 References are made in all shows. We're not ignoring that BW was a continuation of G1, it's just that it never cemented as a continuation until they were positive that they still had fans that would recognize it. BW was always tied to G1. G1 just never became a part of the core plot until S2 and 3. That was Cheetor's imagination. That was not real. (thouigh did you really need me to tell you that?) He just said that.
that g1 was defined by 80s cartoon sensibility. basically hokey yet charming. with Reaganism in full force in the background. that last bit I just added.
Please, define 80's sensibilities. You said it before and I didn't understand it. Simply repeating it won't bring more understanding. Plus, how could Reganism be displayed in the background?
Many of the scenes made no sense to me, especially some of the early ones, but overall it was a fun read. Thanks!
No problem. Still entitled to a re-write and for two days work....it's better than a film that did not really have a realised plot.
I'll read it later...but I'll be remembering the whole "in two days" conditional modifier you put out there, but that it didn't get done for about a year.
Not to be the one to revive a zombie thread, but what the hell. I've spent the last few days of TFW2005 amusing myself with Conceptron's rantings on other boards, and I've only now gotten to read the script. I don't know if she's still posting or reading here, but since she solicited opinions a couple of months ago, here we go: For Conceptron, this is your constructive criticism. For the rest of you, this is me saving you from losing precious moments of your life by reading this horrid script. The opening: Straight out of Star Trek. The message from Alpha Trion to Optimus Prime is just so... I don't know... fan-only. I can only imagine being my wife in theatre saying "alpha what? what's going on sweetie??" Intro to Sam's parents: First... Jack and Jane? That's what you came up with? Oh. And for some reason, Jack's got a "weird scientist friend" (direct dialogue quote). Cause, y'know, everyone has one of those. Worked for Marty McFly, but doesn't work here. By this scene, everyone who isn't a diehard TransFan is storming the doors of the theatre demanding their money be returned. Dialogue from the first 2 pages: Extremely forced and unnaturally expository. I'm only through 2 pages. This doesn't look good. Ah. News reporter exposition. Probably one of the most hackneyed devices in all of cinema history. And not particularly well-written either. The dialogue reveals you're British. Of course that happens to Simon Furman often as well, but it's kind of amusing to hear Sam and his parents as if they were Londoners. Moving on... hmmm...the crazy scientist friend makes Sam's dad late for a...meeting with the president? Sure. Sure. Oh, and he just happened to have walked out with a top-secret, uber-classified piece of alien artifact as though he was stealing paper clips from a top-secret government facility. Sure. Happens all the time. And no one missed it at that. Amusing dialogue line #1: "Yo, a cop van like a few yards away from us" After which the muggers not only don't run away to keep from getting nabbed, but actually walk up to the police vehicle, open the damn door, and peek inside. That happens in real life. Sure it does. Also using random crime to introduce a character is way cliche. Sam trades a $100 pocketwatch for a Coke that he's only short a NICKEL on? In the USA, there's usually a change cup at the checkout and almost all of them will have 5 cents in them. And even if not, there wasn't anybody in the store who would spot him a nickel? And even if not, the clerk wouldn't say "hey, forget it, no big deal." And even if not, Sam's going to trade an expensive family heirloom for a effing COKE??? Someone said this before, but Sam sees a car with no driver, then shrugs and walks off? Like this was something he'd seen before? Crime scene introduces Jazz too. Not very creative. All these cars with nobody driving. Not very effective in the "disguise" part. Ahh, the old "I've got to get back on my medication, because I just saw a robot transform" joke. Why didn't you just have him toss away a whiskey flask instead? How'd a bus get into the jungles of Bogota? Pain and Chaos...not as G1 as a lot might like. What the F is a Neodora? And why is Chaos just shooting at random? On to more TV News reporter exposition...Then on to the fact that Sam has driven a great many miles with Bumblebee without knowing (a.) who Bumblebee is or (b.) where he is going. Then a long boring expository dialogue that is extremely contrived. Why does the White House care about robots that can transform into cars as though they automatically know they're sentient alien lifeforms? Jack can bandy about national security issues with his son who has no security clearance? Unintentionally amusing dialogue #2: BUMBLEBEE: Sam, I am here on a mission to find Neodora before the Decepticons. SAM: I’ll help you find it, I don’t do much else anyway. Sam goes to help Bumblebee, but....... follows him there in his own car???? What, riding in Bumblebee not good enough for ya anymore? Gosh, what page am I on now? Only 27? Feels like longer. Y'know, for all your rantings about humans having too much screen time, I've been through over a quarter of your script and so far it's almost exclusively humans. Unintentionally hilarious dialogue #3: These are reports of certain transforming robots stealing glowing objects from those locations. Page 31 of the script. Another long expository dialogue, only this time featuring government ages. Almost a third of the way through the movie and we're still doing oral exposition. There's something to be said for showing and not saying. Know what I mean? And as it is, we're a third of the way through without seeing much Transformer action, which as I recall was one of your beefs with the Bay film. Ha. Jack freely admits he's aware that his weird scientist friend (played by Anthony Michael Hall?) stole classified stuff from the government. (As in, eye will go to jay-ul for the rest of may lay-uf... Sorry, had to channel Maggie there.) The government then proceeds to totally forget he just admitted to aiding and abetting. So... essentially the Decepticons are just tearing shit up, hoping to find the Neodora? (Wasn't that the thing used in Supergirl the movie? Oh wait, that was the Omega Hedron.) Jack doesn't have call waiting on his cell phone? Or voice mail? I love it when Brits try to write in an American ebonics dialect. It always sounds so racist...like the old cartoons with black women in them. Unintentionally funny line #4: We have to reach get to my dad, he might not be safe Man, that is one long ass government meeting... Unintentionally hilarious line if you have a dirty mind #5: It’s not penetrating! Followed by: Keep hitting it, it’s all we’ve got! Ah, good ol' G1 Ironhide southern dialect returning. Not that Brits can write that well either. By the way, non Transfans and even a good portion of Transfans have long since left the theater at this point. And those that have not are conversing amongst themselves or texting their friends, letting them know which movie not to see. Page 39... Unintentionally funny (but not ha ha) line #6: There are no friendly robots! How do you tell that to the American people. We can’t make our army look bad. Make sure you tell the media that we found a way to take down those bastards, we! Stupidest line in the script so far: JAZZ: I wish it could be over, all this Decepticon beating ain’t good for my back Unintentionally WTF line #7: IRONHIDE: Ratchet, you’ve been missing all the fun RATCHET: Can’t say that I have, Ironhide Well, we're halfway through the script and we've already blown way past the budget for this film, given the CGI and practical shots called for thus far... We're still calling the head Decepticon "leader" are we? I always thought that was a stupid designation. Spit take: Thundercracker wants to throw down with Optimus Prime? Since when did he grow a pair?? Jazz...king of the non sequitir statements. Seriously...in this script is he even having the same conversations as everyone else around him? Ratchet fixes wounded people now, does he? Bumblebee only just learned to speak English, but now Ratchet is able to do surgical procedures on a species he just met???? And in a non-sterile environment? I'm not so sure I want his big ass fingers trying to suture my internal injuries! Page 45 now. Five TransFans are left in the movie theater, and if Unicron doesn't show up in the end, they are going to be PISSED. Damn those Witwickys are news watching fools, aren't they? I wonder if it's Fox or CNN. Jack strikes me as a Republican. They all have weird scientist friends, after all. Oh dear... midway through the script and the Witwickys are still having expository conversations. For some reason we never actually saw Jane observing the mayhem, but we're definitely getting to hear her second hand tale. And it's all to prove that some robots are good, gosh darn it! One TransFan decides that even if Unicron shows up, it won't be worth it and then leaves the theater. Unintentionally funny dialogue #8, I think: So I was hiding in a grocery store and the bad robot was just destroying everything and we were all terrified. Then these good robots came and beat the bad robot, then more bad robots came and were beating the good robots. We were being protected by these two good robots, then this other bad robot... Now if this ain't G1, I don't know what is: Page 50, Decepticons snivelling and basically saying "I would've whooped his ass, but I wasn't feeling like it today." Is the watch that Sam traded in going to pay off? Because if not, I'm going to laugh. Unintentionally "put away your damn lightsaber" moment #9: BUMBLEBEE: What if the Decepticons can be changed for good? Optimus finishes instructing his men to remain hidden on earth. Next scene: Jazz (in robot mode) challenges a Ferrari to a race. Jazz is the token ****** in this universe apparently. Scene makes no sense. Unintentional "wow you thought this through didn't you" line #10: You could say so. We just happen to be immune to your bullets Followed by: IRONHIDE: They have many names; Decepticons, Deceptikreeps, Deceptichops...I’m starting to like Deceptigoons. (Sigh...Conceptron... when you hit someone across the jaw, you're said to be "busting their chops." So when Ironhide said "When are we gonna start bustin' Deceptichops" in the 86 movie, he wasn't calling them "Deceptichops" so much as he was referring to watch part of anatomy he'd like to apply his fist to.) Damn, more TV news exposition. This is getting repetitive. Unintentional OMG line #11: Sir, the president seems to like them. I think his son likes the really big red and blue one. These government types sure do have a lot of meetings. Jumping the shark moment... switch from TV news exposition to Montel Williams type talk show exposition. One of the four remaining Transformers fans in the theater just went to get his popcorn refilled and then silently slipped into another theater to redeem the money he just wasted. Fortunately he got out right before the scene shifted to completely contrived conversations between children on the street about the intricacies of the Autobot occupation of earth. Bumblebee puts on his Spidey suit and swoops in to save a girl from a bunch of muggers. But before he can save the day, Sam speaks one sentence with such authority that one of the muggers/would-be rapists immediately runs away pissing his pants. The other does the same after Bumblebee shows up, but that's only because he's laughing at how a VW Beetle is standing on two legs. Thus Sam and Bee defeat Danny and Marty (two rapist names if I've ever heard 'em) and comfort Cheryl, played by Megan Fox just to spite Conceptron, who will of course now become Sam's non-sexual girlfriend...or maybe not. Jeez, Cheryl, they just kept you from getting your cherry popped, might wanna cut the robot a little slack? Oh wait! Humans can read the "receptors" just like Autobots... wait... receptors? What happened to the Nymphadora...errr neodora.?? Unintentionally dirty and funny line #12: GREG: Jack...Jack, I touched it, I touched it And we're back with our round the clock live team news coverage, bringing you all the plot exposition you could ever need to know and more, even though we're nearly three fourths of the way through the script. This just in, Starscream and Thundercracker fire bullets. Not very G1 of you. Once, just once, in any fiction, could Optimus Prime NOT wait to arrive until everything is blown to shit? It's like the Decepticon is about to deliver the death blow, and THEN it's Prime Time. Greg writes the coordinates for the neodora down on a piece of paper for Optimus Prime. Optimus reaches for the piece of paper, but his BIG ASS FINGERS can't seem to hold on to a tiny sheet of paper. He zooms his optics in 1000%, but couldn't distinguish between Greg's S and 5. His 2's and 7's are confusing as well. Jeepers, Conceptron, a PIECE OF PAPER?? At this point, the humans do what they always do and refuse to stay out of the fight, even though Prime tells them to stay away and it's Our Fight (tm). Given Conceptron's rantings about "humans never killing Decepticons," she thought this was a good idea to include in the story. (This story has nothing new in it, by the way...it's cobbled together from various G1 episodes.) The government is still meeting. Meanwhile, one of the three remaining TransFans in the theater gets a call from his contact about Henkei Thundercracker. He retreats to the back of the theater and talks loudly on his cell phone for the rest of the movie. The others don't mind. One of them asks the projectionist to turn down the volume on the movie so the guy can have his phone conversation. Unintentionally DUH line #13: SAM: Bumblebee, we have to get to Neodora now BUMBLEBEE: Why? What’s the rush (Um, weren't you saying earlier that you HAD to find it before the 'Cons and not to do so would be like end of the world type stuff? What...now you want to kick back and watch Judge Judy?) I'm so done with the concept of "Neodora"... seriously, WTF. Something tells me Conceptron is a huge Decepticon fan.... Unintentionally inane combat line: JAZZ: It’s not about size, it’s about style (Yeah, that's what SHE said.) TransFan number 2 goes to look for Unicron in another movie. TransFan number 1 goes with him. With 83 pages down and just a few more pages to go until page 118.... the projectionist skips to the end, sees that this script ended up just like the movie, shoots himself so he never has to see it again, and thereby escapes a painful end as a legion of TransFans burns down the theater in protest over such a CRAPPY SCRIPT. FAIL.
Agreed on pretty much everything. I realize I never did come back to this thread after I finished reading the script. G1 homages are nice, but get really old and boring really fast.
so yeah, that was kinda.... shite sorry to zombie thread it up, but honestly conceptron that was a pitifully weak script especially after having seen the movie yourself, you should have been able to take the aesthetic and run with it instead of pumping out this b movie wannabe i honestly have to say plan 9 from outer space was more coherant than this, and less of an insult to a genre but that's just as a film/writing student
For someone as vocal as you have been about how bad you thought the movie was, you didn't do much better. As a matter of opinion, it was pretty bad. I think Velcrohead summed it up pretty well as to what was wrong with it. What I really disliked most about it was that the scenes constantly changed after only several lines of dialogue, most of which were poorly written. This was written with die hard fans in mind and would have done nothing to bring in new viewers, which is what you want to happen when you produce and release a movie. If a script like this was released in place of the one we got, the franchise would take a hit as big, if not bigger than the negative backlash the 1986 movie received. You know, the one that actually was within existing Transformers continuity.
What was up with Jazz? I'm no expert scriptwriter so I'll be gentle. The actual movie was better. The script seemed kind of rushed and too "fan-fic-ish." it didn't leave the reader/viewer wanting more. i had some issues with scene shifting smoothness as well. personally I am not a fan of scripts. I believe it is better to write a story and have actors ACT out their roles within that story bringing in a more natural dialogue. BTW: Jeplague's Project N Crisis was a story which could translate into a good movie if you ask me.
