I'd rather have retail release or not at all. I don't get this desire to have ANYTHING other than extreme niche market figs be produced by FunPub. Does no one remember 2007? Granted, we wound up better in the end at retail, but it should still serve as a reminder to the fandom at least to have less of a desire to see certain mainstream characters as limited edition con releases. Like Over-run and Runamuck.
I said what I think are the mistakes. Because it's my opinion. In your opinion there are different mistakes. So, please don't say "They ARE mistakes" like it's an objective fact. It's what you prefer. Not everyone has the same viewpoint. But to explain my viewpoint better: yes, there are things not perfect in FOC Bruticus. But alot of what you're picking out is "looks". A different sculpt, a different realization without the constraints of matching the video game models and it could be quite better. You can nitpick the looks of Vortex, but the basic engineering and design of him functions quite well as an arm or leg, in terms of providing a foot & knee and of providing a shoulder, twisting & bending elbow and a hand. Universal style limbs... here you're stuck on the forest view and not seeing the trees. I'm not saying every alt mode of the limbs needs to be similar, but the basic, "skeletal" engineering of the limbs should be similar. Take G1 Defensor as an example: First Aid, Blades, and Groove: flip back the front part of the vehicle, the head can fold down on a post from the chest, arms move out from the side of the vehicles, legs fold out or extend of the back of the vehicle. That's the same basic design for a helicopter, an ambulance, and a motorcycle. And that pretty much(with a few minor flourishes) also applies to all the Aerialbots, all the Stunticons, Brawl, Swindle, Strafe, Nosecone, Lightspeed(flip the 'ends' of the vehicle), Cutthroat, Sinnertwin, Rippersnapper(make it beasts instead of vehicles). A "universal" limb design in that sense. Ok? I am not stating a desire to specifically have FunPub make it, or to make something that's "mainstream" be "niche" instead. I think Hasbro has simply 'used up' FOC Bruticus as much as they can with several releases, it's worn out it's welcome for retail/retail exclusives. So the only further way to likely get a release is through FunPub. I don't get the mentality of "retail or nothing".
Because FP only makes like 500 of them at $75. If you're not fast enough, you lose out. G2 Ramjet was up for about a day, which is kind of a big deal if you're one of those paying members that FunPub/TFCC just can't figure out how to send e-mails to. Between a retail release where half a million fans have a shot at it or some low-run exclusive with no chance of reissue because exclusivity is what's really being sold, I'll choose retail every damned time. Aside from that, Hasbro must've flooded some of your markets with FoC Combaticons because they sure weren't sent here. If that's how any future combiner is going to go, I don't really see the difference between releasing it and not.
^This. The 3P Combiners pretty much empty my wallets and satisfy my desire of getting the CHUG style combiners for my classics collection. I highly doubt HasTak has the ability to make better combiners anyway. But if they do I will buy them, no question, because the toys will be significantly cheaper than their 3P counterpart. For now I just want them to make better individual TFs like the Dinobots, Roadbuster, and Whirl. TFs that 3P haven't tackled yet.
That.....at least the last sentence. And as a personal opinion that carries no facts at all If I never have to look at FOC Broot again or any other poorly thought out re-uses I'll be happy.
I've never liked the Scramble City approach, but you ONLY need to partsform if you do Scramble City. As far back as Puzzler perfectly good non-partsforming combiners have been made. Hell to this day Rail Racer is the best combiner TF's ever made as far as I'm concerned. With Tripredacus and Magnaboss not far behind.
Which I think ultimately necessitates partsforming in combiners to begin with. As far as working digits go...I don't think that's a necessity. There's that Shapeways kit for FoC Bruticus with fixed pose hands that look FANTASTIC, and likewise my second favorite 3P combiner, TFC Iron Army, has fixed hands that also look fantastic. As far as I'm concerned, I think the hands just need to look proportionate to the rest of the limb. Individually articulated fingers are just a bonus, not a requirement. If it can hold a weapon, that's all I care about. Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't even the large combiners TFC Hercules and TFC Uranos have hands that partsform that don't integrate into other modes? I thought it was the case for Exgraver that the hand only integrated in alt mode, but it had to be left out in robot mode. I mean, so far FP Bruticus' hands are weapons and his feet are weapons in 'bot mode, and FP Menasor will have all the comber parts stored in the trailer of Motormaster...but aside from that it doesn't seem to be the case that combiner parts NEED to be integrated. Most of them are, but it seems in the case of Hercules that the hands have to be left out in one mode or another. Personally, I don't see the issue. Storage options aren't difficult, and it isn't like you're storing a ton of stuff nowadays. Keeping a tupperware container around your collection for stuff like combiner kibble, and just a pair of hands and/or feet at most shouldn't be much of an issue for anyone I freely acknowledge that FoC Bruticus isn't aimed at the collectors. What I'm trying to get across is that Hasbro does acknowledge their base of collectors, and does cater to them. Classics, Universe 2.0, Generations, and Thrilling 30 all point to that. I don't think it would be out of Hasbro's reach to price a combiner at a price point closer to voyagers, yet partsform, and have it good looking as well. If you aim it at the collector during special time periods, such as Thrilling 30 for example, I think it will probably do well.
It's an opinion that's based solely on observation and objective comparison, not personal feelings. If you DIRECTLY compare FP Bruticus to FoC Bruticus, you can clearly see what had to be sacrificed for the sake of Scramble City and integrated parts. Opinion as it may be, it's an opinion that I formed after reviewing each offering extensively. But looks do matter, that's why I emphasize looks. The look of the limb needs to look like it fits the body. If by the engineering the limb looks too skinny, or malformed, or whatever, then it ruins the look of the figure. Combiners work because the limbs look proportionate. Again, look at how 3P engineers their combiners. Efforts are made to make sure the limbs look proportionate to each other, and in the case of FP Bruticus, that forearm piece for Vortex helps to beef up the limb considerably so it doesn't look out of place. And that's the problem with FoC Vortex. If you do it officially, then the arm is too long, too gangly, and super thin in the middle. It looks wrong no matter how you cut it. Fan mode transformations make the arm look better, but it sacrifices what little articulation the arm had to begin with, and that isn't much of a compromise. Let's not forget the crappy hand. I like the Karate Chop hand funny enough, but it's still a shitty hand no matter how you cut it. I actually agree on the universal limbs, but you're not getting my point. FP Menasor works because all four limbs are cars, with very similar transformations an identical transformations for arms...T-Bone, Car Crash, Down Force, and Last Chance all form the arms where the legs are the elbow and forearm, and the torsos plug into M3's torso. But what about a 100% new Bruticus? Each limb is going to work differently because of their shape and alt modes. You won't get the same techniques in a tank as you would a humvee, and I would argue that if you wanted a G1 accurate 3P Bruticus where Vortex' cockpit is his forearm, then he would have to be designed radically different from Blast Off to get that effect. Defensor is pretty rad as his design would be great to have a universal limb style system. I think the only stumbling block would be Groove, as it might be difficult to make him look good as a leg AND an arm given his alt mode.
And how many integrated parts, non scramble city guys have you looked at. Because I not only stand by Rail Racer being the best official combiner I'll take him over all the third party stuff too.
Rail Racer is nice...but only in the combined mode. He looks pretty goddamn fantastic in combined mode, really...but the three 'bots leave a lot to be desired. Tripredacus? He looks pretty bad too, but the three individual bots do look nice, to give credit where credit is due. Magna Boss is pretty nice looking, but the individual modes suffer for the sake of integrated parts.
See TASTES. I like Tripredacus combined mode and his three parts as individuals. I think Rail Racer components look GREAT on their own And the only member of Magna Boss I fails suffers is Ironhide. What flaws their are in each of them I think out way useless parts outside of combined mode. You don't view parts forming as a flaw, I do. NEITHER OF US IS INHERENTLY RIGHT.
I think Magnaboss would have turned out better if Silverbolt's bird legs had been used to make the combined mode arms. and the only part of Tripredacus that really suffered to me was Ramhorn's beetle mode (In fact I fully support the Idea of Tripredacus being redecoed/retooled to make Violen Jagger)
If that's your tastes then I'm not gonna argue. All I care about is when the combiner team looks good in ALL modes...and that's something that only 3P can deliver at this point. If an alt mode or 'bot mode doesn't look good, and a figure only looks good when combined with something else...then what's the point? In the end, if you like toys that have compromised looks due to the need to have integrated parts or scramble city or whatever, then fine. You seem to like figures that sacrifice a lot for the sake of one mode, whether it be the combined mode, or individual modes. That's fine, I'm not the judge of your collection. I don't see how hard it is to grasp that partsforming is a good thing, but I'm not going to discuss it further with you on the matter since you're so entrenched on the subject. If that's your tastes, then fine, but I hope that Hasbro's next combiner isn't one that suits your tastes, so to speak. I'd rather partsform and get a BITCHIN' set that looks good in any mode I want to display, than a figure that only looks good in one mode over the others...or like FoC and looks bad in any mode you put it in. I think it's fully within Hasbro's ability as long as the combiner is aimed at a collectors market.
they don't really care about the that market too much though. Masterprice is the only one aimed fully at it and Generations is a half and half. It pulls nostalgia strings but is otherwise priced and made to also sell to non-collectors. And when it comes to combiners I care FAR more about getting way from scramble city in both the "any of the side figures can become any of the limbs" and the dull and almost always disappointing "One big dude, and just staple some other guys to him and call it a day" combining method. Then integrated elements, I just get wary when people push personal preference as fact. Over all I find teams of six and three seem to work much better, especially when though is put into how to get them together rather then following the "just smooch them on their, screw the gaps" Scramble city goes for.
Defensor would be a solid choice due to the variety of vehicles. I don't think Hasbro would want 5 cars or 5/6 construction vehicles all sitting on the pegs at the same time.
Personally, I don't mind Partsforming Combiner Kibble, as long as said Kibble has a use in other modes. I don't like how G1 figures handled it, by just tossing the feet, fists, chest plate, and helmet aside. but I do like how the Micromaster combiners would turn those parts into a vehicle, or how the Energon sets turned the feet and hands into weapons. if that's the kind of partsforming we get then let's go with that by all means. I could see it working well for Defensor, the feet forming a pair of Riot Shield for Groove and Streetwise to use. the hands becoming cannons for Blades and First Aid, and Hot Spot keeping the Head integrated into his body.
I think Hasbro cares enough that they actually throw out characters for us that only hit a chord with collectors. When was the last time Springer got a cartoon? The last time Blitzwing got a mass media appearance is 2007. We get stuff like Prime, and the movies which are for mass media consumption. A lot of people will recognize Bumblebee from the movie before they recognize a G1 Bumblebee from the movie. To go even further than that, I'd hazard to say that the only characters most people recognize are going to be those in the movies or in Prime. So when Hasbro releases characters like Trailbreaker, Hoist, Thundercracker, and Springer, who had NO recent mass media portrayals, it shows that Hasbro does care, and does cater to the collector and the long time fans. I mean, look at 2011 Black Shadow...he never even appeared in any American Transformers media. Hasbro knows that some times you have to cater to your long time fans. They do it time to time, and I think it is one of those times they can do a knock out combiner. I don't think parts formed hands and feet looking better are mere opinions. I would hazard to say there's a lot more people who agree that partsforming, which allows for more proportionate hands and feet, are a much more preferred method than integrated. Again, I don't know about you, but I would think that a figure that is overall proportionate would be something that is desirable. Parts forming allows for better overall proportions all across the board.
just had an accidental brainstorm for Technobot retools let's have... Scattorshot-Bomb Burst Strafe-Bugly Afterburner-Iguanus Lightspeed-Roadblock, or Roadgrabber's Shell Nosecone-Stranglehold, not quite a rhino I'm aware but I can see thematic similarities between mechanical rhino and drilly tank things btw, these Guys were all Decepticon Pretenders
And that is your opinion, not mine and from read some of the posts in this thread, also not the opinion of others. Personally i think MagnaBoss and Railracer pull off all 3 modes well. Others have stated this too. Your opinion is not fact, nor is mine. The only fact(s) that can be found are 1)that you think only 3rd party can do combiners properly, I (and others) disagree. 2)You don't like combiners with intergrated parts, where as I do. Again your opinion, not mine. There's no guarantee the next 3rd party combiner will be too your tastes, hence why we have multiple groups currently doing Predaking! Again, personal opinion. While FOC Brute may not be the shining example of a good combiner, I for 1, think that his vehicle and robot modes look good, and he is only let down by his Official combined mode. Having said that how many people were b*t*hing when Hercules was released and the treads of Not-Scavenger and Not-Boncrusher formed the forearms instead of the shoulder port? That wasn't perfect for some people, hence why there was an explosion of add on's so that the treads would be in the right place!
