You have a photo of the type of vice you use? I thought vices will be limited by the size you can fit into it. I just ordered an automatic centre punch, wished I had known about this earlier. So not advisable to use it then? Don't want to break the joint. I guess I can keep it for breaking car windows in emergencies. I'm in the learning stage of punching pins. I also just ordered this: Having trouble with one of the pins lately. Both ends look the same, and light tapping either side doesn't seem to move the pin at all.