Bay's Action with a Good Story is a Good Idea

Discussion in 'Transformers Movie Discussion' started by xDOTMShockwave, Nov 10, 2019.

  1. xDOTMShockwave

    xDOTMShockwave Banned

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    0E4E439F-00FD-41AA-8D65-662EBB88F950.png 9B4A36E3-7B5B-47D0-9997-13C63E993AD7.png 0FD00D36-85AD-4A9A-8F28-2DC626BA41A7.png F0E54653-DE68-47A5-AB98-7E31EFFA226C.png I’ve seen so many people on here complain and complain about how Bays action is bad because there’s “too many explosions”. Yet if you look up his action scenes on YouTube, some of them FROM ONLY A YEAR AGO HAVE 60 MILLION+ VIEWS. So CLEARLY audiences liked them. So why complain about how Lorenzo said future TF movies will infuse Bays action when THATS the main reason this movie franchise has made billions? Can you blame him when millions have gone to rewatch these scenes years later? CLEARLY audiences liked them.
     
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  2. AutobotAvalanche

    AutobotAvalanche Number One in Boogieland Moderator

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    I love a lot of the Bay fight scenes as well, but YouTube view counts does not a strong argument make.
     
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  3. xDOTMShockwave

    xDOTMShockwave Banned

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    Why not? They have a positive amount of likes and the comments are only singing it’s praises about how they liked them. Action scenes with a lot of views that were uploaded only a year ago or a couple years ago from movies made like 8 years ago have millions of views for a reason imo.
     
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2019
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  4. Appleseed

    Appleseed Well-Known Member

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    That's for sure.. But sadly all the lame sequels he trust Ehren Kruger and Akiva Goldsman.
     
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  5. Dark Skull

    Dark Skull Well-Known Enabler Moderator

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    Likes on YouTube merely mean they like the video someone put together. Comments saying they love the action scenes are just that. But what about the comments that are probably buried somewhere where they didn't like it? The title suggests that "bay's action" with a "good story" is a good idea. That may be true, but the TF movies have shown that they didn't really have a good cohesive story (as per a lot of the reviews whether professional or by fans). And it's all subjective. One's opinion on what's good or not does not invalidate another person's opinion.
     
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  6. Rodimal Rodimus

    Rodimal Rodimus Agent of Unit:E

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    Is that why TLK bombed?
     
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  7. xDOTMShockwave

    xDOTMShockwave Banned

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    TLK literally had no memorable action scenes. All of them were lazily produced.
     
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  8. ObakaChanTachi

    ObakaChanTachi Is dead!

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    If only movies were that easy to make. I keep seeing people here whining "we need TF movies with good stories!" despite they themselves have no idea or filmmaking education onto how to create a "good story".

    Wishing for a story to be good will not make it good, nor will it ever happen. You need a storyline, plot, characters, writing etc. etc. . And the worst part of it all? The fact taste is a subjective issue.

    Bumblebee is the closest we've had to a "good story" yet I still see a handful of fans here decry it as worse than TLK (though sometimes for valid reasons).

    We'll never have a "good story" because a good story simply does not exist beyond our feeble fantasies. One man's masterpiece is another man's Emoji Movie. The best, most logical approach we can do with at least is a story a majority of us fans can enjoy. Which again, needs more effort than one man on a laptop on an Internet forum writing "I wish Transformers movies were good!"
     
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  9. xDOTMShockwave

    xDOTMShockwave Banned

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    Very true tbh. Everyone has different ideas on what a good story actually is
     
  10. primal789

    primal789 Prime

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    Yeah I really don't know what happened there...they probably got cut short.
     
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  11. Rodimal Rodimus

    Rodimal Rodimus Agent of Unit:E

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    Yeah, all of the films.

    You sure? Cause I've yet to find at least one that actually thinks that.

    Such as ?
     
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  12. ObakaChanTachi

    ObakaChanTachi Is dead!

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    There's at least one relatively active poster here that actually thinks that way. I wouldn't want to name-call them though.
     
  13. Hanzkaz

    Hanzkaz Well-Known Member

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    One of my main problems with the Bayverse was the story (or what passed for it). By the last movie, the whole thing was a mish-mash.

    Anyway, I find it easier to watch Bayverse movies via Youtube clips. I get to skip a lot of the awful dialogue, story contradictions, caricatures, toilet humour, incoherencies, cynicism, creepiness (and I don't mean horror creepy), and go straight to the action scenes which are the only thing I watch Bayverse movies for.

    The Bayverse actually works better as Youtube clips.

    Now, Bumblebee, on the other hand, is worth the effort of putting a disc into a player and settling down in front of the TV for a few hours (IMO).
     
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  14. cybeast

    cybeast Well-Known Member

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    I...don't think so? The action is Bay's movies are just too fast paced for me, I can barely see what's going on.
     
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  15. Spartan Prime

    Spartan Prime is an apathetic douchebag

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    The problem becomes how those views and up-votes got there. No one who disliked the scenes, the movies, the characters, -the action-, are going to go find them. It's all going to be done by people who thoroughly enjoyed them (or people who use them to bitch about them). You won't get a sample of the views or votes that really mean anything to the average person. It's biased right out the gate.

    Concerning the action itself, it's too fantastic in a fantasy sense than it is anything grounded in reality- despite their efforts. Prime, a robot semi-truck, bounces and jumps around with all the lithe and weight of a ballerina. In many scenes, there is no weight to the actual characters in relation to the environment around them. There is only a sense of scale and size when nothing is happening and we aren't there for that. Examples; Prime and Megatron and Starscream fighting in the warehouse in RotF (a tank a semi and a fighter jet stand on a warehouse's second floor balcony and nothing collapses) or DoTM- my favorite of the films- ending with Megatron, Sentinel Prime and Optimus fighting on a four-lane bridge over a river, jumping and slamming one another into everything and nothing even cracks. In the first movie, Megatron and Prime crash into the city streets and the pavement couldn't give a fuck less about it.

    The catch here is that all Transformers needs to be is fun. And they are. They are mindless popcorn flicks based on a toy line that was a mindless cartoon commercial. But they don't stand up to a whole lot of realism and when watching a live action movie you need some of that. Fun? Sure. Choreographed well? Sometimes. Realistic? No. You can see why people would need a change. Bay's shtick is tired. Bumblebee was good and all and TLK was trash all around, but you can see why people are burned out and they didn't make that much money.

    A change all around is good. From the designs to the plots. The action, too.
     
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2019
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  16. NemesisPrime12

    NemesisPrime12 Well-Known Member

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    Which is why he'll fit better as an action and/or sfx consultant, than a director
     
  17. xDOTMShockwave

    xDOTMShockwave Banned

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    Lol, you’re telling me Bay didn’t at least try in the movies except TLK. They were clearly at least trying to make a good story and had action scenes that were complete. TLK was just a mess- action was all over the place, plot? There wasn’t one essentially. If you honestly think they were “lazy” with all of the movies you’re just being foolish. Such as? Some people prefer the plot to be based on real life events e.g. linking it with interesting events like the moon landing and others prefer it to not be and for it to be based on something else.

    I agree

    Lmaooo... what. You say that all the transformers need to be are “fun”, then go on to some random rant about how they aren’t “realistic” enough in fights. They’re fucken cars that transform into robots of course and you’re debating realism ofc they’re not going to be realistic. Biased? My point is that ALOT of people viewed in the first place so it must have been something that caught their eye and most people watched at least 60% of it. If it was such an “eyesore” why have tens of millions watched and liked and sung their praises in the comments? Literally... The only people crying about these action scenes are the huge TF fans.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 11, 2019
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  18. primal789

    primal789 Prime

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    Action over the place or almost inexistent...I really liked the linking with real events as it feels more real..plain and simple.Now I may have to agree to disagree with many here but I believe the Witwiccan stuff only made sense...like okay they were keeping stuff hidden for ages but now almost all died out and the TF war was known to the world in the last years.Went into a more Da Vinci Code approach and I don't think it was bad...there were other things though.
     
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  19. Spartan Prime

    Spartan Prime is an apathetic douchebag

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    Then you aren't getting my point.

    I've enjoyed the live action movies. I've seen every one on opening week, and even RotF and DoTM multiple times in theaters alone. They still aren't good, objectively. You can make a live-action film with fantastic elements like robots that turn into shit and blow stuff up. But that doesn't mean you can play merry-hob with physics and reality without it coming off as hokey after a while ESPECIALLY when you are trying to play it off in the franchise's first and only real-life continuity. You can also make a movie that appeals to a particular fanbase and they will enjoy it with fervor. But that also doesn't mean that they are "good" outside of that fanbase who loves it. Shit, I've probably seen each of those fight scenes a dozen times or two myself.

    Because (and this should really have gone without saying) youtube hits don't keep a franchise afloat. And I guarantee you that no one at Paramount- and CERTAINLY not Michael Bay- give half a damn about how many likes a video has on the internet if they don't get money from it. What they DO care about is how their franchise's diminishing returns are strangling their future paychecks.

    At this point, the film franchise needs to get outside of its own box, or die embarrassingly just when it shows it has the potential to get on track. A lot comes with that. That includes the lifelessness of the live-action fight scenes.

    Tl;dr- "fun" doesn't equal "good", and "fun" won't keep people showing up to theaters when the "good" is disappearing from the hearts and minds of the fandom who the movies are aimed for.
     
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  20. Rodimal Rodimus

    Rodimal Rodimus Agent of Unit:E

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    Watch Bobsheaux's and Doug Walker's reviews and you'll understand, kid.

    If you think I'm "foolish" for having opinions, then I have to wonder if you're possibly projecting.

    You see, I'm a big fan of continuity and consistency, which I don't see much of in any of these. Any issues you and I had with AOE/TLK were in previous films as well, only less prevalent.

    You can't defend these things forever, you know.
     
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