Avengers (4): Endgame - Movie Discussion

Discussion in 'Movies and Television' started by eagc7, Apr 22, 2018.

  1. Insurgent

    Insurgent Big Red Fire Snorting Dragon

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    Maybe. They never actually explained that part. I just figured since the platform was in the original timeline, that acting as an 'anchor point' is what stopped them from going to 2023 of the divergent timelines.
     
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  2. ViperDragon

    ViperDragon Well-Known Member

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    That's exactly the way I saw it too. Without the time GPS you wouldn't be able to return to the MCU prime timeline. Also, explains how Capt made it back to sit on the bench and not show up on the platform. Capt living his life in the alt timeline with Peggy could still of had all the smart characters, like Hank Pym, Bruce, etc (maybe even Reed Richards!) that all could of helped him make the trip back to the MCU prime timeline too. We don't know what fun adventures and people he met in that timeline. I would really love to see a one shot or small movie of that life!
     
  3. Nemesis Otaku

    Nemesis Otaku “Part of the journey is the End.”

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  4. Primeultra

    Primeultra Well-Known Member

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    Actually some of the writers have stated that Cap did not live with an alternate Peggy in an alternate time line

    They said that Cap was always the husband that the main timeline Peggy spoke of

    Which means it’s a predestination paradox
     
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  5. bignick1693

    bignick1693 Maximal

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    That is what I got after watching the film. I figured old Steve was always hiding in the shadows. The only big plot hole that came to my mind is would old Peggy with dementia in Winter Soldiers start telling him about their marriage. I guess Steve could just take it as her mind being shot and thinking of something that never happened. I also want to their his kids show up in some way in Falcon and the Winter Soldier show.
     
  6. Digilaut

    Digilaut I'm Mary Poppins, y'all!

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    Watched two (great!) interviews with the writers on Youtube, as well as some with the directors. The writers are very careful to clarify that their vision on the timetravel (Cap lives in ‘out’ timeline) is their personal opinion, and that the Russos have a different opinion, and that in the end it all depends on which way Marvel wants to go with it in future movies.

    But yes, the intention of the writers was always that he was in this timeline, hence why the movies go out of their way to not show Peggy’s husband. :) 

    Personally all the time ‘plot holes’ disappear when you accept that everything is a branched timeline - like the fact the movie tries to explain returning stones to where they were taken from ‘repairs’ the timeline and doesn’t create a branch - even though they also state you can’t alter something that has already happened, which they clearly do by killing Thanos and letting Loki escape :lol  - but there is definitely something poetic if Cap and Peggy were always ‘meant to be’ right here.
     
  7. Primeultra

    Primeultra Well-Known Member

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    May I ask what made u think Peggy had dementia?
    She sounded perfectly within her facilities

    And you can’t have expected her to tell him, at that point in time, that in the future he was going to travel back to the past to marry her

    I no longer think the movie was actually saying that

    I feel that the conversation between Bruce and the The ancient one was saying that returning the stones from where/when they were taken prevented those branches from descending into chaos/destruction from not having the stones
     
  8. Night Flame

    Night Flame TFW2005 Supporter

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    The line "prune all branches" begs to differ.
     
  9. Primeultra

    Primeultra Well-Known Member

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    Can you refresh my memory a bit?

    Who said it, when and accompanying dialogue if you have it?

    And Pruning doesn’t automatically mean the branch will no longer grow
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2019
  10. mx-01 archon

    mx-01 archon Well-Known Member

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    Pretty sure Bruce said it when he was demonstrating returning the stone back to its proper place in the timeline.
     
  11. Night Flame

    Night Flame TFW2005 Supporter

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    Nope.

    Bruce was over-explaining what Cap needed to do before sending him to return the stones, and Cap popped off impatiently, like he'd heard it a thousand times already, "Right, got it. Prune all branches." Which left me with the impression Bruce had already used those words on him at least once.
     
  12. mx-01 archon

    mx-01 archon Well-Known Member

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    Ah, right.
     
  13. Primeultra

    Primeultra Well-Known Member

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    OK thanks

    But that doesn’t necessarily preclude my interpretation of the conversation Between the ancient one in Bruce

    “Pruning a branch” is sometimes done to that clean up/stop sickness from spreading

    Dialog
    • The Ancient One: I'm sorry, I can't help you, Bruce. If I give up the time stone to help your reality, I'm dooming my own.

      Bruce : With all due respect, I'm not sure that science really supports that.

      TAO : The Infinity stones create what you experience as the flow of time. Remove one stone and that flow splits. Now, this may benefit your reality but my new one, not so much. In this new branched reality, without our chief weapon against the forces of darkness, our world will be over run. Millions will suffer. So, tell me Doctor, can your science prevent all that?

      Bruce : No, but we can erase it. Because once we are done with the stones, we can return each one to it's own time line at the moment it was taken. So, chronologically, in that reality, they never left.

      I’m not seeing them saying they are erasing the new realities, only erasing the possibilities that those new branches will become “sick”
     
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  14. mx-01 archon

    mx-01 archon Well-Known Member

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    When Bruce replaced the stone in The Ancient One's demo, the branch that was created faded away.

    That's what the later "pruning the branches" line was meant to refer to.
     
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  15. Primeultra

    Primeultra Well-Known Member

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    Yes, The black one

    That was intended to represent the “sick one” that would be the result of not having a stone

    The other colorful one way be you saw what the one she referred to as “her reality”

    Remember, she referred to her reality being different and separated from Bruce’s at least twice, the demo was representative of her reality

    That's what the later "pruning the branches" line was meant to refer to, cutting the sick one off from her reality, not Bruce’s
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2019
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  16. TFXProtector

    TFXProtector Well-Known Member

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  17. mx-01 archon

    mx-01 archon Well-Known Member

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    Yes, that was my understanding.

    Returning the stones to their respective realities had nothing to do with continuing to fix the events in the "Prime" universe. It was about being responsible, and not dooming other realities to uncertain and disastrous fates with their Stones absent. Otherwise, they'd be no better than Thanos, sacrificing other realities for their own selfish gains.
     
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  18. SaberPrime

    SaberPrime System Pride

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    Interesting theory but...

    Actually that scene with old Steve contradicts the whole time platform anchor thing. That would suggest that the only way back to that same point he left is by going through the time platform. Old Steve showing up on that bench makes no sense as taking the long way around would mean ending up in a divergent future.

    The only ways old Steve could end up there is if:

    A. history changed which means Old Steve didn't exist on that bench until after Young Steve went back in time.

    B. The whole thing about time being self sustaining which would mean Old Steve was there the entire time but the other Avengers just couldn't see him until they caught up with the moment Young Steve left.
     
  19. mx-01 archon

    mx-01 archon Well-Known Member

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    And that's entirely possible. All we know of the scene is that there was a guy on a bench by the lake that Bucky seemed to recognize.

    We don't know if he was always there or what, just that Bucky had a sudden look of realization about the scene. He very well could have always been there, and only after Steve disappeared did Bucky make the connection.
     
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  20. Night Flame

    Night Flame TFW2005 Supporter

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    That was my take as well. She mentions the reality would "branch" if the stone is removed, and the branch is "pruned" if it's returned at the same precise moment.

    Also, the whole old Steve situation leaves a lot of hanging questions about the nature of time travel within the MCU. Was Steve always there? Was Steve both old Steve and young Steve when Peggy was married? Or was old Steve a figment of his own imagination until young Steve went to become old Steve?

    It's messy. Time travel is a tough one to wrap your head around.