I think it's more Hasbro's business model than anything else. Bandai has a ton of success with releasing very niche figures, many at pretty high pricepoints (Soul of Chogokin, SRC, S.H.Figuarts, S.M.Monsterarts...) and those lines are often filled with characters that haven't seen screen time since the 70's. Yes, that is mainly a Japanese company, but with Bandai expanding that business model into the US with their Bluefin division they are still able to be very profitable and have found plenty of sales avenues that don't include big box retail (I carry them myself!). It may not be AS profittable as their Bandai US Power Rangers product, but that doesn't make it a failure.

The problem is with expectations. Many companies want to see nothing but home runs to the point that consistantly getting on base and letting the earned runs add up just doesn't feel like they are scoring when they get in the board rooms to talk about their business. I own a store and while I'm no WalMart I still consider it successful. By Hasbro's standards they would have scrapped my shop  

 

I'm not familiar with Bluefin, but giving their website a quick look, I'm a) not seeing any toys of characters that are crazy-popular with children in the US, and b) having to assume they don't meet any American safety standards that their parent toylines would have. And that's all it takes - one well-off parent buying their kid a really expensive Transformers adult-targeting toy, not realizing that it's for adults because *it's a Transformer, and those are for children*, and little Timmy choking on one of the tiny pieces. Even if it can be proven the box has been clearly marked - oops, you've just had a publicized lawsuit, and your brand is tarnished. It's why BotCon toys have to pass all the safety tests, or why the patently-adult-targeted G1 reissues earlier this decade had to do the same thing. Transformers is far, far, FAR too ingrained as a children's brand to escape that association.

 

its not a hypocracy, people buy cars, customize those cars, and resell them to normal people. Its not illegal. Toys should be the same way.

 

So MP Megatron and Rodimus are designed for children eh? please show me a child or even most adults that can safely play with those. your argument is invalid.

 

Are you *really* going to throw two toys designed entirely for the adult Japanese collector's market, only ONE of which was released domestically as a store-exclusive because the cost of its development had already been mitigated, and claim that THAT completely invalidates the argument are that children the predominant market for Hasbro's Transformers? Or that it somehow invalidates the fact that breaking the law to get what you want is not "okay" because of that fact? *Really*? It's not like I'm saying Transformers doesn't do ANYTHING for it's adult fans. For fuck's sake, we get more bones thrown to us than MOST fans of children's media. More bones that the attitudes many of us display warrant, even.

 

I call bollocks, they surely know down the line what they have planned and they cant even get that right. Want an example just look at the TF Prime FE/RiD debockle. They can't plan that far ahead, and they can also put out great intricate molds if they wanted to they just choose not to.

 

Yes I am because it is part of the Transformers line as you claim. So are the Binal Tech/Alternators line, THS, and many other things that have come through the line even in the US that are geared toward older collectors.

 

This^ ALL OF THIS^

I'd like to add also that pissing off older fans really does have an influence on purchases for children as well. Its the older people that buy the kids toys or make them look cool to kids, or even introduce them to kids. We have a large impact on that market.

 

Ta, Lumpy. Don't think I need to add anything to that.

 

That's why I put Takara as a maybe - they might be able to lean on Takara for direct sales. But yes, if you're going through multiple intermediaries, it would be tough, if not impossible, to cut you off.

You sure about that? Thundercracker's long gone from most shops. The occasional $450+ listing on Amazon's not a great example either. iGear's main faux pas is copying such recent designs.

And you guys want to talk about entitlement? The attitude of "I don't feel like making X so you can't ever do anything similar yourself" is pretty damned entitled too. Fortunately for corporate types everywhere, financial might makes right. Wait till global IP treaties kick in and the lawyers can send their stormtroopers to flippin' Congo to confiscate all the red and blue trucks down there too...

 

I can name entire lines that are NORMAL lines that were geared toward BOTH kids and adults. Why not start with the series that really brought TF back into the Spotlight? TF 2000/RiD was geared toward both Fans and Kids. The show was pretty mediocre but the toys were fantastic and even included some reissues. CHUGS? Transformers Galaxy/Cybertron was another good toyline designed for both Fans and kids. Not sure how well it sold here but seemed to do much better than the movie toys of the last movie. Why cant hasbro do more of that? There is a way to cater to both Fans and Kids at the same time without making masterpiece.

Also i REALLY Doubt any 15 year old kid buying transformers falls under the fan category. Hasbro's aimed audience falls off at 11-12.

 

Sorry, no, you can keep naming things that were *enjoyed* by fans and kids, but that doesn't change the fact that they were toylines targeted at children that were able to contain, through the auspices of Hasbro recognizing their adult fanbase and giving them little treats and nods, many elements that adult fans appreciated.

 

Figuarts, Monsterarts, and Ultra-Act easily pass US safety standards just as well as any Marvel Legend figure does. SRC has several of the more recent Megazords in the line (and the first Megazord we got in the US will be coming in the next couple months). No, the characters aren't the insanely popular with kids variety, and that's my point, they manage to be successful in their own right having a line, in the case of SOC and SRC similar to their Sentai / Power Rangers line, yet aimed exclusively at the adult collector. With the Ultra-Act and Figuarts lines, those have been a mainstay of Japanese TV for 40 years so I'd say "insanely popular" probably is valid for them even though these are not kids lines. For a more local example...look at Barbie, those Bob Mackie "choke on this big ass jewelry" and cost prohibitive designs, yet Mattel still feels they are viable enough to be a part of their business that is similar, but totally separate from their main children's line.

To the best of my knowledge, no rich kid has choked resulting an a lawsuit over the collectible Barbie dolls in over 25 years  

 

Toys are for children. Period. If it's a toy, then it was meant for a child.

If adults choose to collect them, that's our business - but Hasbro is a TOY company. And toys are for CHILDREN. So when Hasbro makes toys, they do so with the idea of marketing them to children, but SELLING THEM to parents.

We as collectors have been LUCKY that they care enough to throw us a few bones. But Hasbro does not care about pleasing adults - they care about making toys for children.

 

Hasbro must care somewhat about the adult fans. I highly doubt parents would be willing to fly across the country to take their kids to Botcon. Also, as many others have said, MP and Alternators are not for children.

 

QFT

My 9 y/o notices what toys excite Mommy. He also notices what Mommy comments & passes on.

Crap toys that are a radical departure of the original form/character bio - or the upteenth redeco of a recent figure (most of the Movie toys), do not enter my home thanks to my bank account. OTOH, he does see what "newly issued" toys do come home, or what Mommy bemoans the cost for some 3P stuff - but would buy if $ wasn't an issue.

 

Alternators and MPs are for children 5 and up - says so right on the box.

We still like to collect them - heck, I know I do - but they're not FOR us. They're for children 5 and up.

 

Riiiight - and that's why AVON sells $40 collectible Barbie dolls, and there are versions as expensive & much more.

Cuz a child is gonna cough up $40 from their allowance. I dunno how much you got as a kid, or give to yours, but $40 would have been almost a year's worth of allowance in-between candy & other toys; or at least 2 birthday-checks.

Don't forget "Hello Kitty". I sell AVON - and I can tell you for a fact, that we market Hello Kitty in large part to our adult female customers. The girls get Disney Princess & other stuff; but very little Hello Kitty.

Point? If a toy manufacturer wants to engage the grown-up segment of the fandom, who have the money to spend, they will. If not, they'll continue to ignore or marginalize the adult fans.

 

There maybe as many as a quarter of a million TFP Bumblebee (or insert other popular character) deluxes produced by Hasbro. Safe to say at least 100,000 for the big sellers.

Botcon sells 3000 or so Primus packages. TFCC exclusives usually sell less than that. TFCC membership appears to be less than 5000. Even the alternators ended up as store exclusives in some cases which would only have been made in the tens of thousands (probably low tens) at most.

However you want to look at it the areas generally viewed as aimed at adults are a small percentage of overall sales.