Armada/Micron Legend Appreciation Megathread

Discussion in 'Transformers Earthspark and Cartoon Discussion' started by Lovecraft, May 13, 2019.

  1. Lovecraft

    Lovecraft Banned

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    I grew up with TRANSFORMERS ARMADA. I was 4 years old in 2002 when it premiered and too young to recognize its flaws. But I remember Starscream's sacrifice, Optimus tossing his Matrix aside and fighting Megatron in Mortal Combat, and a generally larger than life atmosphere.

    My first Transformer was Sideways, by 2005 I had a nearly complete UT cast that would command a hearty sum today. Unfortunately none of these toys survived 2 younger siblings and innumerous cousins who inherited them after my siblings grew up.

    I haven't seen the English dub since then, I couldn't watch it as soon as my cognitive ability developed. This really really bummed me out.

    But MICRON LEGEND is a night and day difference. An even more egregious job than ENERGON, because that sucks in any language, or CAR ROBOTS, because RID1 is embellished but still watchable.

    What happened to ARMADA because of CNs rushed schedule and the lazy dub is a SIN. Plain and simple. While the animation is still a very mixed bag just like ARMADA, MICRON LEGEND is at least a finished product, with fleeting but noticeable improvements.

    Story and character wise, however, MICRON LEGEND is seriously BRILLIANT.

    Everyone is more consistent. Red Alert becomes another faithful Ratchet incarnation, and Hot Shot becomes a quite worthy Hot Rod. Demolisher is named 'Ironhide' but is interestingly a very faithful Ironhide, just a Decepticon. He's durable, loyal to a fault, jovial with his comrades some days grouchy on the others, and a hot headed albeit respectable soldier. But he's a Decepticon tank.

    The converations flow naturally. The kids are TRULY LIKABLE, even the fat kid is more insightful. I can't even articulate how profoundly well put together MICRON LEGEND is thematically and cinematically compared with ARMADA.

    Thrust still gets called 'Squid-head' (i was afraid this might be a joke created for the dub) and Sideways is terrifying. He was terrifying anyhow, but its just nice to see the original vision born out.

    MICRON LEGEND is a layered, poignant series that illustrates consistently that Autobots and Decepticons are warriors at heart, not very far apart at all. The Autobots fight for freedom but millions of years of war have made them complacent in it.

    It's not even until 'Vow' that Optimus realizes the Minicons are fully sentient! Optimus is a really interesting guy in this series. Brave, virtuous, well-seasoned and respected on all sides of the conflict, but not infallible. He's old, embittered, and trapped in the cycle of combat. He's like Bayverse Prime written with some actual nuance.

    The ancient sunken city with the holographic 'ghosts' warning of the Minicons destructive power was chilling to me. This version of Unicron is probably the best version of the Big Ol Planeteater too. The idea of him feeding on war, acting through agents to lead on Megatron and Optimus for fools, and the Minicons duality of existence being weapons of mass destruction born from evil but being gifted with human souls, makes Unicron a thought provoking, terrifying presence before his machinations are even truly revealed.

    That's all I've got for now. Hopefully we can foster some rewarding discussions. Special thanks to @kary and @DecepticonBuster for their hard work on the MICRON LEGEND fan sub.

    Ground Rules
    1. No Hate! If you don't like Armada/ML, and/or you won't even give it a chance, just go away. However, constructive criticisms and comparisons between dubs, other shows, etc are not hate. It's not what you say, it's how you say it 86% of the time.
    2. This is primarily for Armada/Micron Legend discussion, other Unicron Trilogy shows are relevant subject matter but not the core topic of this thread.
    3. Other than that, have fun! Post pics, screenshots, quotes, questions, answers, insight, and memories.
    4. Toy discussion is welcomed, since toy engineering was so core to the story, but remember this is not the toy board. Same goes for the Armada comics. Mods can provide better insight to the 'wiggle room' in a cartoon centered board. I reckon they won't be Decepticons about it.
     
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2019
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  2. Deathcatg

    Deathcatg Well-Known Member

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    The Mini-Cons were a very fun addition. Even though the ones from that era aren't compatible with the modern 5mm port stuff with modern Transformers figures, they're still fun to mix with their modern counterparts and make great background bots for City Bases bots. I still have my Space Mini-Con Team from that long ago, and if my plans to acquire Titan Omega Supreme happen, they'd be great teammates with Countdown.
     
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  3. GALVATOM

    GALVATOM Better off Pred

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    Somehow I missed out completely on RiD so Armada was my 2nd TF show after Beast Wars. I was born in 88 and had rented a few G1 tapes and had a few toys before Beast Wars but Armada was my first real vehicle Transformer show and toy line. The G1 stuff I had experienced was at such a young age it was just a foggy memory. It was like the legendary giant figures depicted dormant in the Ark during Beast Wars had come to life.

    I've not watched the full series in it's original language yet but it's something I intend to do, I'm even more excited to do so after reading some of the nuances in the show Lovecraft mentioned above.

    Oddly it seemed I was late to the party anyway. As episodes began airing on saturday mornings on "Cheese TV" here in Australia it seemed the toys had been on shelves already for quite some time. So I was a little confused by all the Powerlinx repaints that were available by the time I went out looking for some of the characters on the toy shelf. I just wanted a Cyclonus, and was happy to get one, next time the show came on TV I was a little confused as to why mine was green and the one on tv was blue haha. So to chase down older figures that where still involved in the show I was watching I started looking online, that's when I discovered Takara and how sometimes their toys looked a little bit better. If you wanted a tan faced Demolishor or mostly white Starscream instead of the black or grey Hasbro versions you needed to import.

    Even with only fully experiencing the dub I can't look at Armada Starscream without hearing the regal and sad violin of Conspiracy, and that episode was great too. Can any other series boast an entirely Decepticon episode? Maybe Web World? The characters were great, Cyclonus so trigger happy and wild, Sideways was cool and mysterious, Demolishor almost had a heart and it seems we'd explore that a little later in Energon. Him and Cyclonus reuniting after such a long time and having a little spar was great. Thrust was a suck up, traitor and questionable tactician given his fame for such a thing. Wheeljack with his slashed Autobot badge, if you hadn't seen the episode that was a very intriguing design feature. Poor Smokescreen, cool Blurr, goofy Sideswipe, Serious Red etc etc... I'm sure more eloquent posters will praise these characters here in time.

    What else was cool? I liked that the Con's base was a wrecked ship on the moon. Pretty iconic location I reckon.
     
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  4. Lovecraft

    Lovecraft Banned

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    The Moon needs more love in sci fi than it gets these days, so I'm always thrilled to see it get its moments.
     
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  5. IamaMeatRabbit

    IamaMeatRabbit Well-Known Member

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    I finished watching Armada this weekend. I was a bit bored by the first two seasons, but seasons 3 and 4 were some of the best episodes of a TF cartoon I’ve seen yet. I especially liked the nightmare fuel in the Unicron episodes. All in all, it’s one of the better TF cartoons I’ve seen (IMO). My list would go Animated>Prime>Armada>G1
     
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  6. Gzstg

    Gzstg Autobot Historian, Armada Dub Defender

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    Armada was my first transformers series. I was seven when it came out and loved the toys I got especially the mini-cons. To this day Armada remains my favorite despite the shows many flaws non of which I noticed when I was seven. but as a adult even with Cartoon Networks botched job on it I still love it. I wish more refences were made to it and the rest of the unicron trilogy as well.
     
  7. Lovecraft

    Lovecraft Banned

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    Cartoon Network has never been a great network to work with, huh?
     
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  8. Lovecraft

    Lovecraft Banned

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    If I recall by the second half of the series the dub had cleaned up its act a fair bit. I know, though, there's some real critical differences as late as the last episode.

    When Optimus tosses his Matrix aside to face Megatron, in the English dub its presented as a forfiet of factions and Optimus declares himself the 'leader of all Transformers!' rather pompously even tho the whole point in both dubs up until then was that Megs and OP are two sides of one coin. Optimus being knocked down a peg for his own bloodlust and hypocrisy is lost when he declares 'total command'

    In Japanese, however, when he throws the Matrix aside he says something to the effect of 'I face you not as a leader, not as a soldier, but as a single Transformer named Convoy.'

    This meaning that Convoy understands his lessons learned in Micron Legend. Convoy and Megatron will never stop fighting until one of them finally kills the other, no chance of revival or chance of redemption. He knows that he's gotta settle his score with Megatron to end Unicron's feeding on their hate and atone for the war he's helped wage across the cosmos, or else the war will only drag on longer.

    So that Matrix toss is a poignant full circle moment for Convoy in Micron Legend, when he sheds all his authority, his prestige, notions of righteous cause, and faces Megatron MAN2MAN in a blood-red-rage, down and dirty, total death brawl. MORTAL COMBAT!

    In Armada this is more or less lost with a more 'brand friendly' version of Optimus claiming to have personally united the Transformers. This just isn't consistent with the series' long running subject of Optimus' critical flaws and his role in the Transformers tragic cycle of war, death, and despair.
     
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  9. Deathcatg

    Deathcatg Well-Known Member

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    I remember the very early speculation era of when the show was first announced, and the American title had fans thinking it was somehow going to tie into the line from "Transformers the Movie"; "Cyclonus AND his Armada". Fun times.

    I also have to give shout outs to two aspects from the franchise. I love the Japanese theme songs and intro videos from this show, and I like that "Linkage" tie-in manga series that came packaged with the Japanese DVD releases. The one where you have a 20-something year old woman who has a bunch of Mini-Cons living with her. Those were cute.
    Linkage7_Twirl-Baby.jpg
     
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  10. Lovecraft

    Lovecraft Banned

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    Where can I read these?
     
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  11. Deathcatg

    Deathcatg Well-Known Member

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    This is one of two links provided under the "Linkage" manga's entry on it's Transformers Wiki page. The other one is either broken or the website doesn't agree with the internet filters at work.
    Comic/Manga/Art of Transformers
     
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  12. Deathcatg

    Deathcatg Well-Known Member

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  13. Lovecraft

    Lovecraft Banned

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    On the subject of the 'Armada' name, the "Armada" is literally the United Autobot-Decepticon Fleet that faces Unicron after Starscream's death.

    So 'Micron Legend' (or 'Legend of the Microns') is a good title given the central role of the Microns/Minicons in the series.

    But 'Armada' is honestly just as good, if not better, for 'flowing' phonetically better than any phrasing of the JP title, plus capturing a critical turning point in the series. The United Cybertronian Armada is such a HUGE moment that I feel it's deserving of the title spot.
     
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  14. Gzstg

    Gzstg Autobot Historian, Armada Dub Defender

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    if I remember correctly the announcer/narrator even said that the combined fleet could devastate all in its path or something similar. there was even a episode named after it again if I remember correctly.
     
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  15. Lovecraft

    Lovecraft Banned

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    There was an episode called union and an episode called alliance, not one called Armada if I recall
     
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  16. Gzstg

    Gzstg Autobot Historian, Armada Dub Defender

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    your right I saw the episode list on tfwiki no episode called armada I misremembered.
     
  17. Lovecraft

    Lovecraft Banned

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    So Armada was blitzingly popular with American kids despite the dubbing problems, did Micron Legend make a big splash in Japan too ?

    How's the average Japanaese fan feel about the show?
     
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  18. Lovecraft

    Lovecraft Banned

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    Watching Super Link now, two episodes in I find it to be more like Car Robots than Micron Legend in tone but it's definitely more coherent than Energon.

    There's some truly interesting concepts here. Kicker is way more readable and tolerable in Japanese as is Ironhide/Roadbuster. He's acting exactly like Side Swipe/Stepper did in Micron Legend.

    The background illustrations are gorgeous as is the case with most Japanese Transformers but the robots really are everything people decry them to be. Good designs standing still, honestly. I love the aesthetic of the Unicron Trilogy. I can see how the CGI eliminates the inconsistency that plagued ARM/ML but it comes at the cost of a lot of dynamism.

    Seeing Rad, Carlos, and Alexa "all grown up" is really something cool. In Japanese Alpha Q is pretty fucking hilarious to be honest. Haven't gotten to Megatron yet. He was one of the best parts of Micron Legend since for me he's just an anime'd up G1 Megatron with some antlers and streaks of depth and intrigue. I don't know if I can keep watching Super Link if they bungle him too hard.

    I think since Armada goes from an all time bad series to an all time great as Micron Legend in Japanese that I owe Super Link a good faith once through. I haven't seen it since it aired as Energon when I was 6. I know it slogs no matter the dub, or so they say.

    The theme song for Super Link sounds like North Korean karyoke handed to an ad-man from the late 70s for sound mixing. Groovy as hell and just dripping cheese from every orifice.
     
  19. supernova222

    supernova222 junkion

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    oh boy here's a thread I can enjoy :) 

    armada was my introduction to the franchise. I got into it around the start and I was mid way through middle school and my parents were separating at the time so it wound up being a void filler per say. my younger brother actually was into it with me for a while before he found other interests, while I fell further down the rabbit whole so to speak. I love it so much and it's held a special place for me since, despite its flaws which I acknowledge. its portrayals of megatron and starscream are permanently embedded in my memory, as well as all the series' original characters. armada demolishor was actually my first transformer toy and I still have him. if any tf series deserves a remake or remaster, it's armada
     
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  20. Lovecraft

    Lovecraft Banned

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    Do yourself a favor and watch it in Japanese with subs. @kary has a website with a torrent link.