A database somewhere i can take a look at a character ?

Discussion in 'Transformers General Discussion' started by Lightningsonic, May 21, 2020.

  1. Lightningsonic

    Lightningsonic Well-Known Member

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    Like a gallery where i can check out the designs of the character, a specific version. I reading comic and sometime i want to check out a character design, their alt mode. And i need to roll all the page to check if they transform once. and not all the time get a clear angle.
    we have something like that, but for toy. What i can find is Tfwiki. But there are none Alt mode. they just tell the character life.
    I think it kinda weird if there is none. Transformer, a toy franchise, they have to pay for advertise but there is no where when you want to look for them ? shouldn't the comic put them in the cover. There are like at least 2 cover each issue. So there any site like that exist ?
     
  2. TheSoundwave

    TheSoundwave Well-Known Member

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    This is a major problem I've always had with TFWiki. I find it weird that a wiki about the "Transformers" doesn't prioritize what the characters "transform" into. In fact, they have no "quick info boxes" giving basic stats about the characters. Like, you get on the Star Wars wiki and they have a box that gives eye color, hair color, height, species, birth year, and plenty of other handy info. I'm baffled that TFWiki lacks something like that for altmodes and whatnot. To get anything out of TFWiki, you really have to read the paragraphs. And credit where credit is due, they put a lot of work into their articles. But I disagree with their formatting, and I would argue it doesn't entirely work as a wiki, because it's missing a lot of key stuff.

    Although TFWiki does list some alt-mode info in the toy sections. Which isn't always accurate, because the toys don't always line up with the fiction, and not every character has a toy. But there's a chance you'll find what you need there. Just look for whatever toy is based on the character you need info on. It's a bit confusing an un-intuitive, but it does work.

    Wikipedia has more straightforward wiki articles on the Transformers. Back in the day, I used to be really into reading those. They do have info boxes giving quick facts about the characters (including alt-modes). The downside is that they only have articles for the major characters. And they have far less now than they used to. They used to have articles for the Constructicons (collectively) and Devastator. Now both of those articles are gone. Cyclonus is gone too. I'm kind of bummed about that, because I have a lot of nostalgia for Wikiepdia's Transformers articles. But if you're lucky, maybe you'll be able to find what you're looking for there.

    Outside of those two resources (and a handful of half-finished smaller wikis), I'm not aware of any resources that have altmode info. Not saying they don't exist, I'm just not aware of any. If anyone knows of any, I'd also be curious to know.
     
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  3. KFGatri

    KFGatri Madman with a Blue Box

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    It seems to me that the problem with such "basic stats" is which incarnation of the character do you base them on? The major characters from each franchise have had multiple, in some case dozens of bodies in their history. Just look at the listing for G1 Optimus Prime. Even if you limit yourself to the bodies he's worn in fiction, that's still several different sets of stats. The quick info for Prime's "classic" form is different from that of his Powermaster form and his Action Master form, and his original body as Orion Pax … They don't have such "basic stats" because whatever stats listed would only apply to one incarnation, and which one was used would be constantly up for debate.

    Unless you wanted to break down the character listings and give each variation his/her own entry, but that would be needlessly unwieldy, IMO.
     
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  4. TheSoundwave

    TheSoundwave Well-Known Member

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    It would have to be more out-of-the-box than something like the Star Wars wiki, but it would be doable. The simplest way would be to use Wikipedia as a template. They have a stat box for each major incarnation. Obviously TFWiki would require more boxes since they cover all the obscure incarnations, but that shouldn't be a concern. They already have pictures for most of those incarnations anyway. Just add a stat box below those pictures. If all those boxes make the pages too clunky/unwieldy, they could always make the stat boxes invisible until you hover over a button or something. Or put all the stat boxes on a separate page, like they sometimes do with toys. I can think of quite a few ways to handle it.
     
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  5. KFGatri

    KFGatri Madman with a Blue Box

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    But then you're getting a lot of overlap with the toy section, since it already lists the altmode by make/model - or its closest approximation. It seems a bit unnecessary given that most toy descriptions only include a few paragraphs. And in the case of modern figures where the toy is a hybrid of a few different vehicles, it would be tough to fit that explanation in a box. I honestly think how TFWiki handles it is already the most practical solution.
     
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  6. TheSoundwave

    TheSoundwave Well-Known Member

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    I see what you're saying. Maybe it would just work better as a separate resource.
     
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  7. Lightningsonic

    Lightningsonic Well-Known Member

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    YES. EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM.
    That is what a wiki is for. Different form, different time, different fiction,... then show them all. i don't see how that is even a problem. Why you need to decide which one and only keep one ? just show them, just show them all. That is the point of a wiki type of site are for, people look infor they need. needlessly ? seriously !
    When i check out wiki of other franchise: gundam, super sentai, kamen rider. They have everything you need to find
     
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  8. Furnace

    Furnace Ant-droid at a picnic

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    If you want a database for the toys, I'd recommend giving tfu.info a look. With the comics, it's a little more difficult, as not all of the characters' alt modes were shown, even if they were at some point mentioned, nor were all characters necessarily designed with alt modes in mind.
     
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  9. Lightningsonic

    Lightningsonic Well-Known Member

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    That honestly not a good reason (despite it may actually what really happen right now). But i see all other franchise have them. Like kamen rider, sentai, Gunpla,.... And of course they also have cases when a form only exist in context, or theory (knowing it exist, or possible exist but never show or never use) therefore a design of it never exist in the first place. They have case like that. And what seem to be a problem ? none. You just show what actually exist and available.
    If that really what happen right now, that really what the tfwiki member think. Then they should change. Because alt mode is should be the basic of the information when you talking about this franchise
     
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  10. Furnace

    Furnace Ant-droid at a picnic

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    Oh, I agree. A more comprehensive database would be preferable. But since you initially mentioned comics, I thought you were referring primarily to comic book characters, not all of whom have abundantly available data on their alt modes.

    That said, on a broader franchise scale, the majority of TF characters featured in various media do have toys made of them, so while not entirely ideal, a toy archive should serve your purposes at least in most cases.
     
    Last edited: May 23, 2020
  11. Lightningsonic

    Lightningsonic Well-Known Member

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    I mention comic so of course it apply to comic as well. Why it need comprehensive ? Different Comic, different time, different design,... then just list them all. I mean they can tell the whole story about the character. List what the design come from, what comic, what context in happen... etc. Like Optimus have the pre-earth form.
    [​IMG]

    But from the same era have this Orion pax's new body for a short time,
    [​IMG]
    Just list them all "Orion Pax design from Orion pax spot light"
     
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  12. KFGatri

    KFGatri Madman with a Blue Box

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    So this info would be appended to every section, then? For the more prolific characters you've got forms used in both toy and fiction, toy-exclusive forms and media-exclusive forms. How do you propose to deal with that kind of mess? It's easy to say "just list it all" but you're not answering where or how to keep it from adding an unwieldy mess into what is already probably a tough job to maintain.

    Like I've said, I think they're already handling it the best way they realistically can - include the altmode info where available in the toy description. That also covers the incarnations in fiction that are based on said toys. And as for the fiction-only incarnations, why bother? From what I've seen the altmode is as made up as the incarnation, so it doesn't really need to be covered. A line needs to be drawn somewhere, and for a toy-centric fandom it only makes sense for that line to be drawn at the versions you can put on your shelf. The other wikis I frequent Marvel, DC, etc. don't list every single minor costume variation so why should every last instance an artist decided to do their own take on a Transformer be listed in TFWiki? Just focus on the tangible versions - the toys.

    This information is already included in the toy section for each character - it doesn't need to be added in to the fiction section as well. The Wiki does already "show them all" - in the toy section.
     
    Last edited: May 23, 2020
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  13. Lightningsonic

    Lightningsonic Well-Known Member

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    Why it need to be that confuse ? different page. "toy-exclusive forms and media-exclusive forms". I not sure why you even bring this up, it is irrelevant. Toy, they go to they own page, not the fiction page. If it not exist in fiction then don't bring it up.

    Because !
    That really what how the character look like. A very relevant thing. Then it is basic information.

    And it not just every single minor costume variation. It not a minor change. There is design for the character. If the author decide to make them have a scrap, wear a cape, etc... then it is minor

    Now let talk about real deal here. I am reading IDW comic, let talk about Optimus. He have a Earth form, post-war form, Pre-earth Cybertron form, etc... So How you list them all ? Honestly, i not sure what even the tricky part here ?
    So here how it been done in other franchise if you never see any wiki like that
    [​IMG]


    i don't even need to tell how many form this one have under other tag.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: May 23, 2020
  14. KFGatri

    KFGatri Madman with a Blue Box

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    Still seems rather cumbersome to me, especially when all the info about the basic form is already available in the toy section.

    But if you insist that listing each minor variation is necessary ... You are aware that anyone can edit the wiki, right? You could offer to add this info yourself.

    But really, what's the point of listing each comic variation of Prime? How many times do we really need "red truck" listed as his altmode? It's redundant IMO.
     
  15. SPLIT LIP

    SPLIT LIP Be strong enough to be gentle

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    This wouldn't be an issue if TFWiki would just put more images on the page. Quickboxes are nice, and helpful, but nobody would be asking for them if anyone bothered to upload a picture of the alt mode as well as the 'bot mode for any given iteration next to said iteration's summary.

    Or even just give each character a gallery section with tabs for each version like other Wikis do.

    No, they cannot. TFWiki reviews and monitors new edits. You have to "prove yourself" as a contributor before they'll let you edit willy-nilly.

    Because it's the entire point of a Wiki? Toy-centric or not, if a fiction-only version exists, it should be documented. That's literally the whole point of a wiki, to document and compile all information of a subject.
     
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  16. Lightningsonic

    Lightningsonic Well-Known Member

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    Just to be clear. I just show you one character have a biggest (if not the biggest) in number of form of the franchise just to prove other wiki can do that just fine.
    And no, it been like that for ages, proved it just work. people find the information they need. Never anyone seem confuse anything.


    Pretty sure shitload of character, design have no toy. Even with the help of all the 3rd party
    the above comment already said that i can't. Also, just to be clear. i am newcomer, and i find the need to access the information. I don;t even know all my self yet, and that is where you nee a page like wiki

    Again, That is the point of a place like wiki. to provide information
    Seriously, you may not find the need, no one want to read EVERY single info in wiki. Just as no one need to every single knowledge in the normal wiki. But for the last time, it is not redundant. It is the basic need.
     
  17. Max Rawhide

    Max Rawhide Rollin' Rollin' Rollin' ... uh, never mind

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    Well, for the old Marvel comics you can use the Marvel Universe profile books, the content of which can be found on line here. However, this is limited to the old Budiansky profiles and does not include all G1 characters (only up until the Powermasters and first Pretenders), and only Marvel (and by extension, the G1 toy look). It includes the robotmode, altmode, function, and character describtion and abilities.

    Dreamwave when they held the license for Transformers comics did something similar. On this website there are digital copies of those. But again, it is limited to the G1 that existed at that moment, but does include a lot of the G1 characters. (I think they also did this for Armada.)

    But to my knowledge IDW never did this, so we don't have it for the IDW universe. (However, they did publish one for Beast Wars.)

    Which means the TF wiki is the only source that contains something from all universes. And that is incomplete.
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2020
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  18. KFGatri

    KFGatri Madman with a Blue Box

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    They are providing information. It just isn't the precise info you want. THere's nothing stopping you from doing the research and providing this info for yourself and others. Maybe start your own wiki rather than complaining about how the TFWiki admins run their site? There are at least a few others here who would appreciate an alternative. I don't agree with how they handle everything either, to be honest.
     
  19. Lightningsonic

    Lightningsonic Well-Known Member

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    Let be honest here,you just being salty now. Your "make your own wiki then" is just...
    i aware the fact the site is free and so was the work. No one can demand they do it. And it is not right or wrong.

    But doesn't change what i said, doesn't change the fact they indeed lack some of the MOST RELEVANT information. And i said they SHOULD change. Hey, take in mind it is more of a suggestion.
     
  20. KFGatri

    KFGatri Madman with a Blue Box

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    Who's being salty? It was a genuine suggestion. If you're not happy with how TFWiki does things - and you're not alone in that - you could start your own wiki with an emphasis on what aspects of the mythos interest you.