Hahahahhahah. My day's been made once again!

 

I have to agree with this. I don't see me buying something I actually want and am excited for making me not a real TF fan. I mean, I don't collect whole lines I go for specific characters. If Hasbro/TT don't make the bots or cons I specifically want and someone else does? Hell yeah I am going to buy them.

To me, any 3rd party or KO I have bought is with money Hasbro wouldn't have seen anyway.

I have the KO Shattered Glass Rodimus. I did not attend botcon to get this and he shot up there in price. And to be honest I concentrated more on getting the Sideswipe from that set then anything else. If I bought it on Ebay, hasbro would not have seen the 500 ebay sellers are asking for him.

I have I Gears Delicate Warrior. Hasbro would not see the money because they don't have a G1 Arcee.

I bought the CHMS classics Skywarp, Thundercracker and Sunstorm because I wanted to display seekers from my ceiling but that runs the risk of them falling. So I went KO to not not hurt the real deals.

And finally I have both I Gears Lighting and Destroyer. Why? I bought the Hasbro Skywarp. Waited for the damn TC. Never got it. I'm OCD, I want the same box. And wasn't paying the prices for a TT TC. So I bought both of them.

I can say if Hasbro or TT came out with an Arcee or the rest of the femme bots I would buy them if they look good. But I'm not going to not buy an awesome toy I want just because it's not by Hasbro. That's just silly. I'm a Transformers fan. Not a Hasbro fan.

 

Exactly what i was trying to say (less elegantly) a few pages back. I think Hasbro has handled this just right for the most part. Hopefully the delicate balance b/ w Hasbro/Takara isn't upset, as Hasbro seems to enjoy a symbiotic relationship with most of the 3rd parties (particularly those making add-on sets which increase demand for official figures).

 

I get your example but if the retailers are 'hurt', won't it ultimately affect Hasbro's bottom line - direct or indirectly? If retailers can't sell excess stock, won't it ultimately mean they order less than Hasbro?

The reason I raised this because eons ago when I knew a Bandai guy, I queried him why wasn't certain retailers carrying a certain line. His response was 'sales no good, shop (retailer) cancelled order, my boss say affect our sales, so remove toys and display better selling ones, yes'?

The above reply hence gave me the impression that if any retailers which has poor sales, and cancel Hasbro's line will eventually hit the latter's sales?

 

That only works in the cases where the third-party merchandise is an actual alternative to what's at retail. I mean, iGear's Impactor may well hurt Hasbro's sales of FoC Impactor, since (if it makes it out) iGear's product is clearly superior (though inevitably more expensive.) In the case of their MP Coneheads or TFC's Hercules, there's no real legitimate alternative on the shelves. Perfect Effect making Motobot in no way harms Hasbro, since the latter seems pretty resolute about not making a G1-esque Arcee pretty much ever.

And who is FansProject hurting by making an add-on kit for Bruticus Maximus? If it came out at the right time, that set would have helped Hasbro move units of an otherwise undesirable product..

 

yeap..im a transformers fan first and foremost..i could careless where the hell they came from, if they fit the aesthetic of the line im currently into i dont care if big brother has/tak or some dude/dudette garage kits it...if it looks good imma gonna buy it..ya heard..

im sorry im listening to MGK and yelawolf..

also...well said Lambo..

 

I agree with the FansProject example but that's what happened in Asia. If I remember correctly some 3rd party companies release upgrades for Bandai's Gundam model kits. Without the actual, official kits the upgrade kits are worthless.

With regards to the sales thingy, I appreciate the replies and it's a good learning process for me. Years ago when I was in the corporate sector, my bosses would whine about retailers cancellous orders because of poor sales of a particular product, thus impacting the company's sales. Maybe business practices are different here in Asia?

 

I do not know if third parties actually do these, but I would be more open to accept their products if the companies are properly registered, their toys are made under rules and regulations of the country of origin, their products are properly copyrighted, patented, and trademarked, and they ship to stores worldwide abiding by the different toy rules and regulations of different countries like a legal company do. Then only I can accept them as just another company making transforming robot figures.

But in no way are their products going to be an official representation of the character it is supposed to represent. You can repurpose them to whoever you want in your own little universe, but it does not change the fact that the figure is still whatever it is called on the package. This is coming from someone who does not consider Diaclone figures as The Transformers figures because... well they are not licensed as The Transformers figures.

Otherwise, they are just private customs. At first glance, customs may look fine but as ridiculous as it is, customs are actually illegal in some countries.

Man Arrested for Selling Pirated One Piece Figures of Nami - Interest - Anime News Network

Here is a case from Japan, at first glance the title appears to be stating that the man got arrested for selling pirated One Piece figures, but if you read the article, you will realise that the main reason he got arrested is because he customised One Piece figures and sold them without the permission of Toei; the figures being piracted are merely icing on the cake. I am not sure if he would get arrested if he did not use the One Piece trademark to advertise his customs, but since One Piece is a BIG thing in Japan, I believe he would be arrested anyway. You can read the forum for more in-depth discussions on this issue.

 

??????????...if big brother company wont produce and a 3rd party comp will then the company that has the product out is officially the one out making it officially in a sence that it has no competitor.... maybe not endorsed and licenced but if ur the only one in the game then i say ur it..if parent company makes one then said 3rd party comp takes a back seat..unless parent company product is lacking..to me its about being the best...who ever has the best product out there wins my dollars and my vote..anyone not looking to be the best or for the best IMO has other issues....its ur collection u can officially call what figs official or not..it ur own world

 

It could possibly, but because of the nature of the BULK of Hasbro's business, it's unlikely to have a big impact. Since most of Hasbro's clients are corporate, the numbers are so huge that slight variations (like the ones that could possibly be attributed to 3rd Party) get lost in the wash.

Think about it this way... to use the Impactor example, think about HOW FEW hardcore adult collector TF fans shop at a given Walmart. Then reduce that number by the very few of them who would buy an iGear Impactor (really, not many fans actually buy 3rd party when it comes down to it). Then, of those who bought a $100+ Impactor, how many of those wouldn't buy an retail-priced official Impactor anyway, just because they're completists, or because they want to have the combiner or because they had some money burning a hole in their pocket that day?

And really, even that number is reduced further because we can't assume that every adult collector was even interested in buying the official Impactor repaint to begin with. You can't lose sales that were never yours to begin with, right?

So really, you're talking about such a negligible drop in sales when measured over the entire Walmart franchise... dozens? Hundreds of lost sales at most... out of MILLIONS. So yeah... no significant impact.

Furthermore, you have to realize that there are so many factors that contribute to a surge or decline in sales. Can you really imagine ANYTHING that would hurt the brand value of Transformers more in retailers' eyes than what has been for the most part a 6-month dry spell, with old movie stock and a surplus of Bumblebees that nobody wants clogging the shelves? That has probably hurt retailers more than all the 3rd Party TF products combined, a thousand times over.

HOWEVER... this only really pertains to the lion's share of Hasbro's business. The exception would be online retailers like BBTS, TFsource, Robot Kingdom etc... sellers who deal in relatively much smaller quantities and who sell exclusively to the online fan market. While the overall impact on e-sellers would still be negligible in my opinion, this is the place where the effect of 3rd Party would probably most be felt on Hasbro product sales. Of course, most online sellers are also selling 3rd Party items, so that complicates things.  

zmog

 

Hasbro has every right to take steps to protect their IP and any money being made from their IP. It REALLY is that simple.

 

so do the ip of all the vehicles they use as alt modes but you dont here those guys screaming or the fans making a big deal about it either..

 

This is true.
HASBRO rips off others.

If HASBRO goes after 3rd Party, then all the Automobile manufacturers that HASBRO does the same thing too should go after them!

 

So does Nissan, but there not going after hasbro for IP theft for using there car's likeness on the prowl molds. What if hasbro had been sued by nissan and there product had been pulled from shelfs, fans would have been screaming bloody murder. Really what's the difference? This whole topic is BS.

Edit: I see a few people above me feel the same way  

 

It's their prerogative. It doesn't matter what we think.

 

And yet, at least as far as 3rd Party goes, they haven't. That is, they haven't taken LEGAL steps. They've instead relied on pressure tactics like leveraging small vendors or conventions.

And if IP is determined legally, and Hasbro isn't going after the 3rd Parties because IP laws are different in China (or wherever), then how can it be such an easy right/wrong question? Simply put, it can't be.

That's not the point. Nobody's suggesting that Nissan chase down Hasbro. I think that comparison is much more pertinent in response to those trying to sit on Hasbro's high-horse as regards the 3rd Party/IP issue. One can't stand there and defend a huge corporate entity like Hasbro on the moral high ground, when they as a company do exactly the same thing.

In other words, whether Hasbro litigates or not is a separate issue. Someone should not lecture on the evils of buying 3rd Party products and "IP theft" because it's "wrong", while continuing to patronize (and defend) a company who engages in exactly the same kinds of practices.

That's why I said that what's good for the goose is good for the gander, so to speak. Personally I like Transformers to look like real world vehicles, so I'm fine with this practice of "different enough" car and jet modes. I'm content to leave the specific legalities and technicalities of IP law aside. But then, I also like robots that look like awesome homages to G1 Transformers, so I'm fine with what 3rd Party companies are doing as well.

In this sense, my ethics are at least internally consistent. Not everyone can claim as much.

zmog

 

I'm not sure if I am consistant or not... and I'm not gonna worry about it either.

HASBRO does the same thing to Nissan that 3rd Party does with it. People can White Knight HASBRO all they want; but if ever HASBRO finds a way to after 3rd Party in court I WILL shout it from the highest peaks that NISSAN go after HASBRO on the same grounds.
And who makes the jets that the seekers are based on? Lockheed? I doubt that they would.

 

Hasbros just asshurt someones making better toys than them. Just at a crazy price

 

So who is HASBRO protecting its IP from?
Someone might make something similar to them, but their IP is still intact.

 

Hasbro needs to consider doing similar to what 3rd Parties have been doing... I'm sure it's feasible for them to make limited run molds of things that might be niche... or even not niche, just limited run. Look at the prices Prime FE Bulkhead/Prime goes for.

If Has/Tak were to make Gestalts akin to TFC Herc... and price them similarly... I'm sure collectors will get it.