Howdy all, Ok...some of you know me (from other boards) and Im sure those of you who even vaguely remember me from some of my posts here in the past (and those that know me from elsewhere), know my extreme hatred for Michael Bays Transformers.... I watched the first movie when it was released and shredded it quite happily. Now I was not a Geewunner stuck wanting everyone to look the same, far from it. But I loathed the redesigns and made no bones about speaking my opinion on it. For that I was lumped into the Geewunner crowd. I welcomed redesigns just not the extent they were taken. I was hoping everyone would have been a shadow of their original forms like Prime was and was pretty vocal on how Prime got the G1 nod but no one else did... I had no problems with the retelling of their history, I mean come in, every cartoon/comic that comes out is a retelling. If we arent used to that by now we all need to just give it up. No, my biggest thing was you couldnt recognize anyone but Prime and Bumblebee.... In all fairness there were some things I did like with TF1. I did like Ironhide and Ratchets redesign. Prime was ok and that was as far as it went. So then TF 2 comes out...of course Im not going to watch it. I read reviews from fans and it sounded like a pile of crap on a piece of film. So its been a while, havent thought of the movie, the flame wars I went through elsewhere, the bannings, the arguments, the cut downs etc etc. I had put the Bay movies behind me and went on. Then the other night (as Im sure all of you know) TF 1 was on ABC... I decided to watch it. I sat down with a truly open mind, put G1 out of my mind and just decided to watch it. I really liked it O_O Yes you read that right... A neighbor has TF 2 on DVD. I borrowed it and watched it yesterday. I thought it was really good. O_O Yes you read that right as well. LOL Does this mean that I like Bayformers now? I dunno but they are good movies. The more I see Ironhide the more I like him, design and persona revemp and all. I actually do like Bumblebee and this Bee is no VW and could never be one. (In my defense I was one of the ones that never said Bee had to be a VW, ok. But I did think a Camaro was pushing it at first). Prime is of course ok. I liked Primes redesign from the get go but of course no one saw that cause everyone was too busy throwing me into the Geewunners group... Now I still think /that/ Starscream is skank on a stick and seems a rather mockery of his persona and Im glad the /real/ Starscream isnt in this particular TF telling. This Megatron is cool. I actually didnt have anything against Bays Megatron voice and persona wise in the beginning, just did not care for his design. But watching it last night on TF2 I can actually see a little bit of Megatron in the face. Maybe thats a stretch for some to understand but I can so thats ok. LOL As for the Twins? Heres what might be a shocker; I thought they were funny and had no problem with them at all. Course I cant tell them apart and the one with the two 'teeth' (one being gold) was a bit much but other than that I thought they were funny. They werent overdone IMO but had any more of them been in the movie and they would have been IMO. I didnt see them as 'racist' in the slightest. Wheelie was a riot and I like that Wheelie. Jetfire was 'interesting'. Sideswipe rocked (what little you saw of him) but I had seen his design some time ago and liked it anyway so thats a given. The plot wasn't as bad as I was led to believe it would be but there were some loose ends in it that should have been either finished or thrown on the cutting room floor. I have no opinion either way on the bike femmes. I suppose its one of those story arcs that was never developed. Devs balls was a bit much. Actually that entire Devastator concept needed a lot of work IMO but oh well. That Starscream looked cool with the tattoos on him and I had no problem with Mekala in either movie. I suppose Im the only person who thinks Magen Fox is ok. LOL So, ok... I watched 1 again and 2 for the first time (actually watched it twice) and I liked them. Its not G1 by any means but they were good movies afterall. I will say though that with all the cons almost the same color and general look it is really hard to keep track of whos who in a scene. I wish they would do something about that. Oh yea, Soundwave rocked. His head redo was a G1 nod... too bad megs and ss couldnt get that but oh well. I thought the new Ravage was neat. Shame he got gutted like he did. I was curious though why a scene didnt snap back to Soundwave after that to show his reaction. And the more I see Ironhide the more cool I think he is and Im not a real big IH fan so I suppose thats saying something. No, I dont have any of the toys, doubt I will get any. Though I might end up with an IH at some point, who knows.
As it was said before, glad you gave the two movies a chance. Seemed you needed to give yourself some time and space to accept Bay's films for what they were...just fun movies. I did have problems with the movies themselves, as well as the designs, (not to mention the twinz) but I still let myself have fun while watching them. Bay's films are far from the greatest pieces of work ever done, but as long as I can have fun while watching them, that is all that matters to me.
Wow. This is a very interesting post, and I'm glad that you've given the movies a chance. Also, like me, I can tell you enjoyed RoTF for the things that it did right and not the things it did wrong. Hope you're on-board for the third movie!
Glad to read this. You are probably one of the people who I know that are G1 fans (as far as watching the cartoons and knowing who's who) AND admits they liked Bay's TF movies. Now you not seeing ROTF until now goes to show that you actually did boycott his iteration of TF, but proves that his films aren't bad. They are fun and require audience to go in with open mind and just have fun. Be happy we got a live action movie , because it could have been much worse. A lot of people just complain now because they take it for granted. That is my 2cents
Yes I did enjoy the movies for what was done right. To be honest after reading a lot of what fellow fans had to say good and bad about it from watching it, I was really apprehensive about watching it. When the movie started I was like 'ok its starting out really good, whats going to happen now?' and it just didnt seem to go down hill to me. I did not set out to nit pick it to death, I sat out to just give it a chance. Some stuff in it was really funny (when Sams mother ran into the hanging planter I fell out!!). As I said, I thought the Twinz were funny. I didnt know what to expect with them to be honest after everything I had read about them. And when I saw the bumper sticker of *conbrand* suck my Popsicle, I was undecided. Then when they started fighting on who would get the green GM I was cracking up. It was interesting cause the second time I watched it my roommate watched it with me. Hes a TF fan from the beginning and the one that got me into TFs many moons ago and after the 2nd or 3rd bit with the Twinz he suddenly says 'Ohyea, they were built on Earth.' I thought that was a really interesting way to look at it. *shrug* Im not sure how to say my next comment so I hope everyone can figure it out. Ok... yea I saw problems with the movie but for some reason, nothing really grabbed my face and screamed its a problem to me. There was nothign bad enough to make me sit and ponder about it. It just didnt matter. Slobbering TFs... ok whatever.. G1 didnt have that BUT THIS IS NOT G1. It didnt bother me in the slightest. These Transformers are not G1. They are different. Its another take on them. The dogs humping... well... that really wasnt needed but at the same time, Sams dad's comment about it being a 'dominance thing' is an actual fact with dogs. I totally dismissed it after that cause it was a dominance thing. Did it really need to be in the movie? No but its not like going to ruin the flim for a couple of seconds in two different scenes of Mojo showing whos head dog there you know. I mean... stuff like that happens in real life in pet households all the time. LOL Wheelie on Mekalas leg... well... again Sams comments about it was what smoothed it over IMO though it really wasnt a needed scene with that. I think the only thing for visual humor that was really just an eye roller was .. Devs balls...but its nothing to go on and on about. I was actually more disgusted by BB peeing on Simmons I think it was, in the first movie then Devs balls in the second. (you know I think they cut the scene of BB peeing on Simmons in T1 on ABC the other night. I dont recall seeing that exactly now that I think about it) A couple of fav scenes from TF1 that come to mind... yea the mom smashing into the planter, one of the Twinz going on about stealth and autobot work or whatever and walking into BB right afterward. Bumblbees reaction after he shot all the lil cons and then blew the top of the house off and Sam made him go back into the garage. LOL that was funny. His body language was so funny.. like 'WTF!? I was just doing what you wanted!'..Starscream getting beat with is own arm.. I think by OP and Megs now that I think about it. LOL And he just pops it back on and is testing to make sure its working while Megatron is talking. Oh, Sideswipe going around that corner like a speed skater.. that was so cool.. and his comment when hes done. Actually that whole bit with Sideswipe was really good.
Glad you gave both live-action movies a chance and liked them. Sure, there are some things that could have been done differently, but overall they're not bad movies once you get used to watching them.
I gave both films a chance but I say that I'll ever be able to embrace them as Transformers. But then isn't that the way with Transformers. I really enjoyed Animated but some fans really couldn't get into the show. I really didn't like Beast Machines but some fans thought it great. With all the variety there will be things you like and things you don't like.
I guess the whole thing begs the question, should Transformers be the province of shut ins and geeks, even more obscure than Trekkies, or should it be a worldwide big screen sensation that even the casual fan can discuss. In the end it seems to be both, and the die is cast on it - we got what we got with Michael Bay's movies. It's set in stone and like it or not, oh yeah, it is Transformers - just one of a dozen or so incarnations. As time has gone on, I as a G1er have accepted that what I view as the pinnacle of Transformers fiction is not what the next fan, or the next may agree with. The Dreamwave and IDW comics took what was a deceptively clever intellectual property with a cheap cartoon and expanded its vast potential fully. That is my opinion of what represents the real essense of the brand. But all Transformers incarnations borrow from one another, so in a sense, we're all in it together. As for the movies, I'm very glad you enjoyed them. For what it's worth, I did too. Some moments vastly more than others, but I did enjoy them. And that's always good, no matter what a cynic might say.
Megatron does look alot the original when you look up close, he's just in spiky movie style so his bucket helmet looks like a blade bucket and his old man face looks like a sharper old man. Heck even Starscream has alot of elements from the original except extra deformed, it's like the dudes drew the designs but from a written description of the robots.
you gotta find the forest fight one of the most kick-ass scenes in sci-fi/action cinema (and Devastator's formation).... great post!
See everyone? Proof that you should always See a film yourself before you generate an opinion. I'm glad he opened up a little to give bayformers a chance. And yea Ironhide is kickass. He need some melee weapons though lol. I knew I'd hate avatar before I saw the film. Even though I hated it after I saw it too. Bad analogy lol Btw I don't really agree with you about screamer but you are entitled to opinions. I like how hes like a mix of velociraptors, eagles and alien technology in one. And hes got a fucking buzzsaw! =P
Thanks for the replies. Oh Im still a die hard G1 cartoon fan and always will be, that will never change. Bays TFs are ok I think as long as you dont try and compare them to G1. Just my opinion there. And yes, that fight in the forest was awesome! Dev coming together was interesting. Still not sure about the final gestalt he made though. But its still ok. And I did like the velociraptor and avian elements in Starscream a lot. I think it really fits him. I just feel it could have been done in a better package. All Starscreams have had a certain look about them and this one just didnt have it. But as you said everyone has their opinions and its all good.
My main reaction is the same one that a lot of people have already stated, which is that I'm glad you watched them. I knew a guy that for years said he "hated" Star Wars but had never seen any of them, and when he finally saw one of the movies he liked it a lot, and ended up enjoying all of them. Varied opinions are welcomed by me so long as they're informed!
Im in the same boat as you, its almost scary! I too just recently watched both movies again for the first time in a long time and I liked them sooo much more! And i think its like you said, now that the smoke has cleared and the water settled from all the hype, flame wars, ect. I was able to watch the again in a new light, and i loved both! Now, I always liked them to some degree, it is Transformers after all, but now I can say with confidence, I love BOTH movies!
I'm highly disappointed in you, ItsStarscream... Personally I thought ROTF was a load of dump, but I did quite like Wheelie and Jetfire, and even the Twins weren't as bad as I was expecting. Visuals of the Transformers were technically good even if I'm still not entirely fond of the designs. But the story, and telling of it, was dreadful. But this thread does show that even the most hardened BayFormer objectors can find something to like out of it all. It proves that despite the growing regularity of that phrase I really don't like 'haters gotta hate' that has been cropping up all over TFW like an unwelcome arse rash, apparently they don't gotta, even stalwart 'hater's like ItsStarscream. So good on you for disproving that phrase, madam
A friend of mine was just as much of a hater as I was if not more (and to those that know me from other TF boards THATS saying something LOL) and she somehow ended up renting TF 2 from netflix... and she couldnt stop watching it. LOL She was like 'Its like a train wreck, you wanna look away but you just cant!' LOL I dont know how many times she watched it but it was a lot. She really loves the movie. She then rented TF1 and got it in yesterday but the DVD is messed up and half the audio track wouldnt play on it. She did like it though and is about to exchange it for an undamaged copy to watch it. With me as I said before, the only things I liked about TF 1 was IH and Ratchets redesign as well as Primes. That was the extent of it. When I watched it then, I only did it as a favor to a friend and I was so steamed still from the battles I had been in regarding a certain Seekers redesign (as well as other things) and so disappointed in the final concept of taking TFs live action, it seemed all I was interested in was shredding it to pieces. The fans that liked it from the get go and shredded me because I didnt actually added to me hating it I think. But stepping out of it all for a bit was the best thing for me in that regard and I was finally able to see the movies, yes, in a new light. Ironically what got me interested in watching TF2 was being at my neighbors one day (the ones who let me borrow the DVD) and the movie was on. I wasnt paying much attention to it (was trying to ignore it actually) but in a lull in the conversation I happened to look over to catch the beginning of the fight in the forest. I was like O_O whuuu? And just sat there and stared. LOL Then a few other times I caught bits and pieces of it here and there and then (they play it a lot cause their kids love the movie), after seeing TF1 the other day again, had to watch TF2. Heheh hey Im still not sure what to think of it either. Wheelie was funny! The scene where he steps in the rat trap then into the glue trap and his resulting comment of house of horrors just cracked me up. His absolute lust for Mekala was so funny too. Jetfire was cool I thought. Still undecided on him farting out his parachute though >_> LOL Though I gotta admit Jetfire brings up some questions regarding the plot. He was so old and falling apart it seemed, yet he was an SR71... It seemed he was as old as The Fallen and yet the Fallen wasnt coming apart from age. It took a shard of the allspark to bring him back online yet they didnt think to do that with Prime. Yea there are some things to question with the plot but overall it was ok. Sure I could sit here and think about it and really start picking out plot holes but you know what? It was a good movie, the plot was clever in some ways, the pacing was pretty fair (save for one part that was a bit jarring until you tell yourself of time differences on various parts of the planet) and to be honest, I just dont wanna sit and pick it apart. Im glad I was finally able to sort of accept Bayformers. I dont want to rock the boat with myself if that makes any sort of sense. I also think the one thing that made me finally turn my opinion in a sense was when TF1 came on the other night and was starting, I says to myself, 'self, this is one persons idea of what Transformers would be if they were REAL. Wipe out everything youve always known them to be.' And I knew looking at it like that, sadly they arent going to look and be how they were originally envisioned. What you want and what is, sometimes are two different things. Now thats not saying I agree with this concept. Not totally. I still say it could have been done a lot better. I think there could have been a middle ground visually between /real/ and the visuals in the cartoon. Im not so sure such a retelling of the canon/history/creation of them was really needed but this is a different TF universe and we all know there are a lot of different takes on the TFs backstory. A lot of my hatred stemmed from the fact that we were all told in the beginning it would be G1 redone live action. And I sat here and watched people in hollywood who knew nothing about it, recreate it into something totally not G1. Then the resulting war that erupted in the fandom, of which I was thrown into the 'geewunner' group just added to it. I am a bit puzzled though why the Twinz have gotten such a bad wrap in the fandom though. Anyone care to explain that to me?
Is anything Transformers really set in stone? Transformers have re-invented itself more times in 26 years than any other franchise I can think of. To appeal to the next generation of kids they keep coming up with new points to jump on and you really don't have to know anything about the past series to enjoy the new stuff. You could decide that you wanted to skip on the live action movies and all the related toys and it's not really going to hurt you as a fan because the movies aren't connected to anything else Transformers. Animated Starscream is still Animated Starscream without the movies, G1 Prime is still Prime without the movies, Dinobot's death is still an epic part of Beast Wars without the live action films. I mean lets face it, it's Transformers so one day they will stop making the movies and Hasbro will stop making movie related toys. Then it will be one more chapter in the book of Transformers. But unlike other books a fan can just pick the chapters they want rather accepting everything.
