Hasbro's New CEO - Chris Cocks

Discussion in 'Transformers News and Rumors' started by Tony_Bacala, Jan 5, 2022.

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  1. T-Hybrid

    T-Hybrid Gnodab Kidult (He/Him)

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    I'm not "the current generation."

    The issue is people across generations confusing love with romance and attraction.

    And yeah, that's my last word on the matter since the mods have weighed in.
     
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  2. Robomaster726

    Robomaster726 Well-Known Member

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    It's not so much that it shouldn't be in there, so much as it is that unless it's critical and enhances the story, what use is it to the overall plot. In this case, we're talking giant robots who are at war. Not sure what "love" has anything to do with it. Plus, well... robots that don't identify along gender norms in universe, but translated into our language utilize our pronouns that ARE based on gender for a reference point we can understand as the people watching/reading the story being told.

    Plus, characters who are organic, biological beings, regardless of planet of origin, are going to be more likely to express feelings in stories involving relationship angles, whether they're romantic or otherwise. Hell, even Vulcans admit they have feelings. They just suppress them. Again, it's the robot angle where I think it's unnecessary.

    Been a long time since I've seen any of them, but wasn't that part of the driving force of the story it was featured in? I mean, reflecting on a character's origin or backstory, however brief or short, if it's crucial to the story, it's crucial to the story. I just don't feel the need to shoehorn this stuff in when the overall story doesn't require it

    And with that I'm done.
     
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  3. Hoffman

    Hoffman Well-Known Member

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    How dare we teach children about loving relationships.
     
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  4. Venixion

    Venixion Its always the middle of the night in Moonside

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    Giggles immaturely at the last name.

    Never heard of this guy, hopefully he does a decent job.
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2022
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  5. MagnusPrimal

    MagnusPrimal Well-Known Member

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    Or really any company.
     
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  6. The Roman Empire1977

    The Roman Empire1977 Treason of the highest order

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    To those who say romance shouldn't be involved in media; since when did you truly believe that? Do you seethe watching the majority of films and cartoons? Or is it only when it is towards relationships that are not "normal" in your eyes?
     
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  7. TFXProtector

    TFXProtector TFW2005 Supporter

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    IDW tried, to some success. Met with a lot of pushback. Not so much here because the rules are in place and the staff are really quite good about stepping in on this particular issue, but check out Reddit and Facebook group posts and you'll see that there are a lot of people in our fandom who aren't into the mindset of diversity, inclusion, or anything pertaining to what isn't in their worldview. That doesn't mean all of them are evil or bigoted, some of them absolutely are, but there are some who are just simply misinformed or out of the loop. (But man, you want to see the nasty side of the fandom? Check out both places. Ugh.)

    Eh, yes and no. I get the point you're making though. Me, personally, I find no problem with them being male and female and having stories go from there. Whether straight or LGBTQ+, as long as it's written well and not just pandering or outright offensive, I welcome it. That said, the original cartoon clearly had them defined as male and female and you didn't have to guess.

    I can't speak for someone else, but as I said in my previous response above, there is a lot of that in the fandom. Some people just aren't able to process it properly. Whether indoctrination or upbringing or they simply just don't like it (please note I didn't say they were phobic or afraid, people can simply just not like something without being afraid of it) some of the people will just not accept it. While it's somewhat fair to assume "please don't put gay robots in my cartoon" it's not always that. You ever meet someone that you just didn't like? You couldn't put your finger on it, they weren't horrible and they didn't offend you but you just didn't click? That mentality for a person can also be applied to things/situations as well. For some, it's just that. It just doesn't click for them. As long as they're not so anti-whatever that they'd want to deny rights and privileges. Once that line is crossed, then they're completely wrong.

    But, to be fair, yeah... Some of it's exactly the "gay thing". Sadly.

    At first, I was going to take your comment at face value but then you said it makes them look like a dick and completely undermined your position. If you come at someone with respect and grace, you'll be more likely to be heard rather than encounter negativity on all sides. Since you've not done that, you'll get what you give and rightfully so.

    Just because Budiansky had a particular view doesn't mean Hasbro did. Marvel helped them create the characters and the names but in the end it was still Hasbro's property and so was the cartoon, ultimately, and if they want the characters to be a specific thing, even if we agree or don't agree with it, it's their right. If they want them to be binary and gendered, that's their right. If IDW changed the narrative and Hasbro was clearly okay with it, that's their right. Just because you don't like it, or Budiansky doesn't like it, well... *shrugs* Not your property.

    They're living beings with feelings. Part of growth as beings are emotional (and therefore romantic) attachments and connections. Whether it's platonic or romantic or whatever is up to the individual character. Sure, it's written by someone else, but as long as it's organic and realistic and not heavy-handed or preachy, what's the big deal? Data tried for years to be human, craved it, and didn't realize he did because he lacked the emotions. He slept with Tasha Yar, he tried to date one of his shipmates in a later season episode, he raised a cat and took care of it. He couldn't verbalize it, he couldn't show it, but there was love behind all of it and when the emotion chip was installed, he finally understood it. He felt it and realized he had been more human than a lot of us. I didn't really see anyone complaining about that. (I'm sure there were a vocal few. Because, why not? *sigh*)

    Why can't the Transformers do the same thing? They have actual emotions, they're ahead of the game when compared to Data.

    What bothers me is people take umbrage with the existence of these relationships in children's entertainment but some don't even balk at the inclusion of the incredibly inappropriate content of the Bayverse films. (we won't even go near AOE with a 10-foot pole for this one, ugh) Wheelie humping legs? Sam's Happy Time? Just to name two incredibly inappropriate things unnecessary to the film/story content. Those movies were supposedly based on children's entertainment. And there were moments in the films where kids could watch safely, such as Optimus and the humans interacting and Bumblebee's oafish sweetness but the rest of it was violent, relentless, and sexified, and no one bats an eye at that. Yet, we make the Transformers more human in a lot of ways and that's a no-go because they might love one another.

    That's an f'd up argument, man.

    Love for their fellow being? People go to war to protect those they love. Not just platonically, but romantically as well. Whether on the front lines of a battlefield or the front lines of the pandemic, it's not just the money, it's not just a job, they do it to save the lives of those around them and those back at home. "All's fair in love and war". I mean, why do they have to be robotic warriors without the capability to love? If they can't love, they also cannot hate, therefore they wouldn't be going to war. It would be two factions of robots fighting "just because" and I don't know about you but that would be boring AF. That makes no sense and makes for a boring storyline, and here? A pointless debate.

    *HISS* BOO! Stop droppin' those facts, you know our fandom doesn't like them!

    The not "normal" is a big part of it, based on what I've seen elsewhere. I'm sure we'd see more of it here if the admins/mods didn't step in like they do when this discussion boils over in prior cases. A lot of people are just keeping their mouths shut so they don't get in trouble/banned, but if you ripped that rule out you'd see a side to this fandom that would make you feel very different about it. *shudders*

    I'm not sure why science-fiction fandom has such a... "one-way" lean to it but my gosh, for all of the advancements and openness in other ways, it's so closed off and closeminded in this way. People you'd never expect to see it from (and some you do lol) just coming out of the woodwork all of a sudden with "EWW! NO!" it's disheartening. "Well, I don't want that in there, so if you can't do it my way then I don't want you doing it at all."

    Do I think some arguments (in either direction) could influence children and indoctrinate them in some way or another? Absolutely. Do I think they should automatically be included? No. I think a deft hand needs to write it in if it must be included and that it should be relevant to the story at hand and make sense, not just forced in because it can be. That said, that only works for an episode or two and becomes really boring if you don't flesh out the characters and give them more to their being. That includes relationships of all kinds. Don't force agendas, just tell kids that people have friends, people have significant others, and sometimes they love like we do and sometimes they love in different ways. Kids are smarter than we give them credit for and they have much bigger hearts than we do.
     
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  8. fallenspartan

    fallenspartan Banned

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    Here is my layman’s take on this whole debate. I personally have nothing against inclusion for a person of any creed, race, gender, religion, in any kind of media. If a creator wants to diversify and include other different type of characters, more power to them. So long as the product is in good quality, it doesn’t matter to me what sort of “woke agenda” they have. There is nothing wrong with having diversity and inclusion. I don’t see anything divise about it. Life is too short to get angry about such things.
     
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  9. Bass X0

    Bass X0 Captain Commando

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    The era of Gold has concluded.

    Now begins the era of… well…
     
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  10. T-Hybrid

    T-Hybrid Gnodab Kidult (He/Him)

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    If we've learned anything in the past few years it's that there's a lot of regular people who don't give two shits about the average worker. Just look at what airline staff is currently going through.
     
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  11. franpincho

    franpincho NOT a FT Only collector

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    Coffee spilled.
     
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  12. T-Hybrid

    T-Hybrid Gnodab Kidult (He/Him)

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    [​IMG]
     
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  13. fallenspartan

    fallenspartan Banned

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    Hard knocks
     
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  14. Bass X0

    Bass X0 Captain Commando

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    Actually I’ve always maintained that Chromedome / Rewind and Cyclonus / Tailgate in MTMTE are two of the best relationships in the whole of Transformers, and the four are labelled with masculine pronouns. Roberts worked hard to make those two relationships endearing.

    It’s those stories that have a relationship just for the sake of having a relationship without bothering to put any effort into developing the relationship. Those are make for terrible stories. And yet some people think just seeing two characters kiss without any development or emotion involved makes for an endearing relationship. That’s a shallow way of thinking to me.

    I like well written relationships full of development and emotion. I don’t like shallow poorly written relationships.

    I also don’t think Transformers is a franchise where sexuality should be a thing. It’s one thing for two Transformers to be in a relationship. It’s something else entirely for them to have sexual intercourse as if they were humans. That’s something we should stay away from. And yet some people want to children’s characters to be shown to have sex. That’s the problematic nature of some fandoms.
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2022
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  15. Shin Densetsu

    Shin Densetsu I WILL DESTROY YOU Content Contributor Veteran

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    Anything IDW has done with their Transformers comics has nothing to do with the new CEO. Since that ended up overtaking the topic at hand, this thread is closed.
     
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