As far as I’m concerned, Beast Machines was The Last Jedi of Transformers.
And I don’t say that affectionately.

 

As far as I'm concerned, Beast Machines was The Last Jedi of Transformers.
And I say that very affectionately.

 

Me: Loves TLJ, hates Beast Machines

 

You can start with not doing the "I AM TRANSFORMED" hokey woo woo "eastern mysticism" horseshit. That wasn't a Hasbro mandate.

 

"Bob Skir says that other writers came up with the Vehicon Generals and "all the mystical stuff came from Marty [Isenberg] and I, based on Hasbro's request that we add a 'spiritual dimension' to the show". (The phrase "I am transformed" came from Hasbro.) The overall arc of the series also came from Skir and Isenberg "based on many conversations with Hasbro, Mainframe, Fox, and us".[8] Hasbro was quite keen on the spiritual tone out of a desire to try something new with the franchise, while Skir felt nature versus technology was an obvious theme but he felt that was a lazy cliché and the show should be about a balance between the two. (The technorganic characters helped him argue this.)[9] He merrily went all-out with the spiritual aspect, expecting Hasbro to change their mind but he found they liked it and asked for more![10] It was Hasbro itself who said "hey, what if someone turned into a plant?" as part of their drive to stretch the franchise to its limits.[11]"

Source: Beast Machines: Transformers (cartoon) - Transformers Wiki

Ordinal Source: Moonbase 2 interview with Bob Skir

 

All that means is that Hasbro wanted a spiritual element. That doesn’t mean that Hasbro specifically requested that “I am transformed” stuff.
They already introduced the Cybertron version of The Bible in BW; they could have continued along a path of spirituality from there.

But that wasn’t the sole problem with that show.

 

Karyuudo Fansubs　狩人ファンサブ: [Translation] Blue Big Convoy - Transformers Legends Manga - The EX Story
and 2 and Neo was chronologically place after Beast Machines in order to Course correct the beast era like rise of Skywalker which made things worst.

 

In my unwritten fanfic, immediately following the events of Beast Machines the Quintesons arrive.
It turns out the Oracle was a Quinteson construct that leads Cybertron to undergo a new rebirth (again) and it’s citizens to shed their mechanical aspects and no longer be able to turn into vehicles and weapons to defend themselves.
The Quints enslave the technorganics to harvest Cybertron of its renewed energy and retake Cybertron as their own.

As Cybertron’s guardians / defenders Obsidian and Stryka escape (since they were never destroyed) and seek out outcast Autobots and Decepticons and unite them to once again drive the Quints from their world, and in doing so find redemption.

This could then lead into Transtech for the Maximals and Predicons and still have Autobots and Decepticon robots in disguise.

 

Geez, now I'm kicking myself for not being able to attend.

 

I don't know which follow up sequel series is worse, Nu RID after Prime, or Beast Machines after Beast Wars. One is way too light and childish compared to its first series, while the other is way, way too dark and grim compared to its original series. In both cases the the originals and follow ups don't feel like they go together at all.

 

Last Jedi came out nearly 5 years ago, get over it already.

 

RiD was basically a sequel in name only. The creative team was carried over from Prime, but if it wasn't for the fandom's obsession with continuity, I don't think anyone would even view it as a sequel. New cast, new mission, new style, new opponents, most everything is new. RiD should be judged on its own merits instead of only in relation to Prime, and on that scale, it's perfectly fine. It's a brightly colored kids' show.

By contrast Beast Machines is very much a sequel series, but it's a post-apocalyptic one. In my opinion its narrative works best because of the contrast with the optimism and comraderie in Beast Wars. Just like in Transformers: The Movie, the sense of innocence lost is crucial to creating stakes. I think a lot of the hate it gets is because of that creative choice, which isn't a criticism of that choice but the fandom being upset it didn't get what it wanted.

One of the things I think people overlook is that these kind of soft reboots every three years are standard in modern kids' animation because the audience ages out of the demographic. It's not a coincidence that that's the approximate timeframe when these big narrative shifts happen, it's intentional by the property owners and creators. It's fine to say "I don't like that this thing is different," but there's no mystery in why it's different, and that alone shouldn't be cause for complaint.

 

IMO TLJ will have outsized cultural relevance for years because it was so divisive. It's rare for a heavily managed corporate property to have one of its major media products take such big swings, challenging fan expectations and the franchise's own narrative history. I think the BM comparison is pretty useful and instructive. Plus, Rise of Skywalker's outright rejection of TLJ's ideas through retcons, combined with the hardening of sides in the fandom culture wars, means that we'll never have a meaningful revolution. Whether you see TLJ as an open wound or as a breath of fresh air that was thrown in the garbage, we'll probably never see it's like again.

Beast Machines will always remain divisive for many of the same reasons, though new Beast Wars media to date is creating new continuities that take a very different narrative path. However, I'm encouraged by the amount of affection BM continues to receive from a certain segment of the fandom.

As I get farther away from the original releases, I've become more tolerant of people who hate these stories. Not everything is for everyone! But I have two main caveats: first, a subset of fans use their anger or disappointment to be outright abusive, which of course is unacceptable. Second, even separate from the abuse, fans are overly critical of creators who take creative risks, which is also harmful on a broader scale. If we only ever get what we already know we want, media becomes stale and boring. And finally, I take issue with people who call Beast Machines "bad." That's often code for just not liking it, but the creative choices weren't wrong, they were just different. The writing on the show--at least in terms of the storytelling, if not the dialogue--was very good. It was a bold unique take on the franchise. You can hate it, you can wish it never existed, but just because some are mad that they made Rhinox a villain doesn't make it bad. I will defend its quality relative to other kids' media, especially of its time, as long as needed.

 

Didn't the Collectors Club did something similar with Wreckers storyline, with Cryotek and the Quintessons as the main baddies?

 

No idea. I e never followed them.

 

Yes, I remember that it was revealed that Oracle was a program created by the Quintesson to fool the Transformers into turning the planet into tech-organic matter like themselves. Back in the late 90’s early 2000’s you could find similar theories by the fans. So it was surprising to see on the Conventions storylines in early 2000’s. The fandom is divided on those stories from Botcon because some loved it because it rewrote Beast Machines ending and other hated it because it neglected the whole show.

I think if worked right it could have been explained with the Quintesson and it would have been an awesome if worked correctly and well developed. Beast Machines had interesting concepts but I believe poorly executed.

I think the Transformer community need to let that bitterness towards Mr. Skir go. It has been a long time.

 

From the Alt.Toys.Transformers days. I still remember a thread called “I want to fight Bob Skir”…

 

Poor guy has been rolling to Tfcon in a bullet proof hamster ball for 22 years now to protect himself from the fanbase. Hell, I\'ve got my glock handy just in case he defends nightscream. Rubber bullets obviously bc I liked most of BM. Nightscream though... 

 

As someone who loves Beast Machines and loathes TLJ, it has been quite an emotional rollercoaster.

 

Don’t I occasionally see you complaining about Bay Prime’s face taking line?

That goes back even more years.