Guess I'm weird then, because when the line first came out I hated the lack of articulation even then.

I wanted my Bluestreak to have movable legs like in the artwork dammit!  

 

Yep, I'm an original G1er, and the extreme lack of articulation was always a bummer.

 

wow, forgive me for not using the proper term.
If you couldn't tell I am being sarcastic, its not a big enough deal to correct.

 

I hear ya bro. The reason faux parts annoy me is because it defeats the whole purpose of transformation in the first place. Plus it leads to a more exaggerated cartoony aesthetic I dont want like MP Bumblee version 2 and MP Sunstreaker. If you cant make it actually transform under the current technology, then it wasnt meant to be, just like 35 years ago. Cant remember any faux parts in G1. I cant say Im much of a gun guy. Im all for self defense but never saw the need to make it into a hobby. One good properly maintained gun will do its job in the rare moment of need. Dont need an scope, a arsenal, an association, or paper targets. Thats just me.

 

G1 was different. No one expected full articulation back then. Engineerig for these figures have evolved way past the G1 days that to say, you didn't live in G1 days, is irrelvant. There no excuse that a figure can only look left to right when it can be designed to have full range of motion especially today. And if we're comparing the Dirge to G1 Dirge, that toy was designed with faux parts as well, or did you forget that it's a partsformer. And in it's instructions and box art isn't meant to have a conehead. So the cone on his back is accurate to the G1 toy.
Getting upset over a little cheating to have a better proportioned nosecone, head with full range and accuracy to the G1 toy and cartoon at the same time. You're just a G-Whiner looking to complain. I bet you're upset with Sunstreaker having double sided feet in Earthrise.

 

Were you really thinking that at age 6-8 when you got your first G1 Bluestreak ? Or were you just happy that what you had even existed ? G1 toys were revolutionary for they're time. But as a kid, I didnt collect MOTU, GIJOE, or any stereotypical "action figures". I was the right age at the right time that I got to pick my own toys. And what I was thinking was why do I want these stupid little posable men when I can have a car that turns into a robot ? That was just way cooler to me. So I never grew up on articulation. I grew up on being amazed by this new gimmick known as "transformation". Granted, CHUG is G1 done right in my opinion. Im all for basic articulation. I dont go crazy with posing, I just line em up on a shelf. So when I see transformation sacraficed for something I never really cared about, of course I will have an issue. Some cheating is understandable. But when its too blatant, it destroys the whole purpose.

 

Yeah but the widespread use of vac-metalmakes up for it, IMO.

 

I'm not gonna make this about guns but you are unbelievably wrong. Deadly wrong, I'd even say as a self defense shooter. I'll just leave it at that, haha!

But back to Transformers...I mean...

I get this is your perspective but I just don't get it. If this held true we'd just have toys that look like G1. The reality is that you **CANNOT** expect complex transformation designs without large parts counts. Large parts counts, increased engineering means more cost, and then you might as well just be buying 3rd Party. Hasbro **HAS** to work under internal budgets, and all this means that if faux parts should be used here and there to get a look while keeping complexity and parts count low just so it can fit within internal budget, then so be it.

Get what you like, like what you like. I'm not trying to change your mind per say but you always talk with this air of authority whether you realize it or not. This isn't a call out, but you gotta realize the core issue is that Hasbro needs to work under a budget and retail cost projections. They are not 3rd party where their budgets aren't spread across a ton of different things and they don't have retail cost expectations to meet. What you want simply isn't realistic for toys that are expected to sell by the truckloads at places like Target and Walmart. These aren't specialty toys made for a very specific segment of a collector population...they're intended for kids but also to appeal to collectors who say "Oh hey it's that character I want." Generations toys are MUCH more complex than the Cyberverse stuff, but Hasbro certainly expects kids to play with the Generations stuff too, so here simpler is better also.

Hasbro certainly caters to adult collectors. I'm always skeptical of those who say Hasbro doesn't care about the collector. The dedication to little details that only serve to impress adult or long time fans, and character choices in stuff like Selects is evident that Hasbro absolutely has an eye for the adult collector and that we're a bigger force than some would like to think. But at the end of the day Hasbro is still making toys here, and that means inevitably, somewhere, kids are gonna play with them.

 

1. Universe Dirge's head turns to the left and right just fine. Also take the pylons into account. How far do you really need it to turn ? He cant see through his pylons which is standard for seekers.
2. How is the nosecone out of proportion ? It looks just fine to me. Dont give me that aviation junkie BS about its not how an F-15 nosecone looks. Once Hasbro decided to stylize the coneheads wings and remove the tailfins, its no longer an F-15. Its a fictional cool looking jet.
3. Cartoon accuracy doesnt even back up your nosecone argument.
4. Since you want to toss out the term "irrelavant", keep in mind "relevance" is opinion not fact. Transformation is very relevant to some collectors. I appreciate general articulation. I dont need human style articulation at the cost of transformation.

 

I was 10 when G1 first came out and had tons of action figures, so yes, I was indeed disappointed by the lack of articulation on Bluestreak. I accepted that would be the case from there on out, and didn't hope for future figures I received to be able to pose like their box art, but that first bit of disappointment did indeed happen, as did the disappointment of Bluestreak not being blue like the product pictures had him as being.

*hugs MP blue Bluestreak*

 

1. You're right he wont be able to look past the pylons, but up and down movement is important to some collectors. Something that the classics toy sacrificed for a simpler transformation.

2. He's not a fictional jet, he's a modified F-15. Sure no F-15's were modified that way but the wings are real wings from real jets and the bulk of the plane is an F-15. And frankly, the short stumpy looking nosecone looks derpy and has a face on the underside. That's just my opinion.

3. Toy accuracy was what I'm talking about. His toy was meant to have the nosecone on his back like the other seekers, look at his box art and instructions. The toon accuracy comes with a conehead. This entire point is my whole problem with the conehead seekers in general is that they were never intended to have different transformations which leads to situations like with this toy where one group is happy with it and the other absolutely hates the way it transforms.

4. Yes, my use of 'irrelevant' was not needed as relevancy is subjective. You are 100% correct there. I guess I'll have to say we have to agree to disagree about the transformation v articulation because neither of us are changing our opinions on the matter.

 

I also want to echo this. I wasn't a G1 only kid...I was also a GI Joe kid. I was still collecting GI Joe for longer before I got back into Transformers in 2009. I was practically EXPLODING when I discovered I had missed out on Classics in 2006 because they were the "G1 with articulation" toys I always wanted as a kid.

 

All im saying is the universe seeker mold was genius. Thats why they made few changes and pretty much upsized it. In my opinion the universe conehead mold was even more genius. All it needed was an upsize with lighty remolded parts. It didnt need to cheat. This has nothing to do with parts counts or modern engineering. This has everything to do with "if it aint broken, dont fit it". As far as guns, I will only say this: I live in a city with a high crime rate. When your life is in danger on the streets, you dont get to pick and choose your weapon or shooting distance at a split seconds notice. When you have time to to pick the perfect weapon and ensure a perfect kill shot, its no longer self defense. Its tactical offense.

 

As a kid, I left Star Wars for GI Joe and a main part was for articulation. My Star Wars figures always annoyed me with their limited articulation - I figured it was what it was, until Joe came out. TFs was a disappointment in that department again, but they were so cool I just lived with it. Doesn't mean it didn't bother me.

That reasoning is WHY I so tentatively stuck my foot back in the water for TFs - what a mistake that was!! WAY too much money spent now - but thankfully I got in when I did, when that first year's could still be found.

 

You have no idea how lucky i felt to grow up watching old G1 episodes while Universe was in stores lol, never got silverstreak but the prowl mold was amazing for it's time!

 

Dude are you serious ?
You gonna throw the partsformer argument ? The only G1 seeker parts you needed to remove to transform was the rocket launchers which is tradition in every seeker mold except MP. Yes im aware that the "coneheads" were invented unintentionally by animators mistransforming the figures to give them personality. That doesnt negate the fact that the universe mold made it work. The whole argument about the better proportioned cockpit falls apart when youre talking about a modified F-15 with stylized wings. And yes Im aware those wings did exist on another Jet that was not an F-15. And throw the g-wunner term out there all you want. Ive been collecting CHUG since 2008 and Bayverse since 2007. When it comes to some traditions, ill be a g-wunner. But when it comes to other lines, im not such a g-wunner. And yes I thought the sunstreaker feet were incredibly lazy. All they had to do was make the hood halves rotate ipside down 360 degrees. I would have rather had no car headlights on the feet in robot mode than a fake car hood. Thats just me. I hate unessacarry cheating on Bayformers just as much. So this isnt about what era I came from. Its about Hasbro being lazy to accomplish super cartoon accuracy and uneeded articulation. I dont need my figure to be able to do sit--ups, look up, or pose like a balarina.

 

I'm guessing you're forgetting about the fists/hands.

 

The seeker mold requires you to remove the hands the G1 figure. To sucsessfully move the arms into place its prefered to remove the wings then reattach them. Which is the whole reason they are removable. Or did you forget that? Sometimes cheating is very nessicary to get an accurate and funtional figure without making the transformation too complex and prone to breakage. Which was a problem with the ROTF toyline, looking at leader Prime specifically, that transformations was overly complex when it didn't need to be. The short cockpit just looks dumb, I don't know of it arrow dynamics but it looks stupid how short it was on the classics figure.
I frankly don't care about ab crunches are ankle tilts but a full range of motion in the figure's head is something I cannot look past, which is why I think the classics coneheads fail especially if they were released as is today. I don't need it to look like a rennesance painting when I pose it, but being able to look up or tilt it's head is just little things in articulation that there's no excuse not to have.
Again that's just my opinion.

 

Hard to convince me that articulation is a bad thing when these guys look so good posing.

 

Its funny you mention that. Because although I was strictly Transformers I had a friend that was into GIJOEs. in the 80s. I asked him what was the big deal about this "swivel arm battle grip" ? (Because it was written all over the packages like if it was some kind of miracle from god) I never understood the big deal. And too this day, ive never really cared about wrist articulation. As long as the elbow has swivel im good.

You got me on the fists. Although one might argue if gun hands are acceptable partforming, why not fists themselves ? G1 Sunstreaker had them. But I never removed the wings or tailfins to transform my seekers. I just rotated them and did everything in an order that nothing got into the way.

I cant take nothing away from the engineering of this mold. Thats why its basically an upsize with a few additional mods. Other than the head being able to look up and ankle tilts, what does it do that the old one didnt ? The real debate for me was the coneheads and the use of faux parts. These 3 really arent my issue.