The remake you've been waiting for (or dreading) FF VII

Discussion in 'Video Games and Technology' started by seali_me, Jun 16, 2015.

  1. electronic456

    electronic456 Well-Known Member

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    I’m still waiting for the true showdown between Sephiroth and Cloud. :p 

    I mean if we can get two instances of motorcycle riding; why not dancing?
     
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  2. Meta777

    Meta777 Dr Pepper Fan

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    Sephiroth walloped Cloud in their 1v1, insta-killed Barret in a flash step and just stood there grinning when he had two of them trapped in a magic seal. Yeah, dude was definitely dicking with them. It's just as BW Megatron said, there's no fun in instantly killing your opponent the first chance you get, take the time to slap them around a bit first.
     
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  3. User_93049

    User_93049 Well-Known Member

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    Aerith is just panting with excitement
     
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  4. bignick1693

    bignick1693 Maximal

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    0A27DD98-2390-4075-94B2-AFA2EBBF55BE.jpeg
     
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  5. mx-01 archon

    mx-01 archon Well-Known Member

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    I finished the main story a couple of days ago. Well, that ending was certain a... thing. It's taken me bit to fully process what it means for the future entries into the saga. Ultimately, though, I think I sorta like it - with the caveat that whatever gets revealed for Part 2 could completely dash that if it winds up going in completely different directions. I'm sorta hedging my bets on the fact that so many of the original game's iconic moments happen outside of Midgar, that Square Enix would be fool to throw it all out. Especially how they emphasize in the "behind the scenes" videos how they made sure the dev team was filled with a mix of fans of the original, in order to help retain the original's spirit. Despite a few niggles, I actually have high hopes for what it represents for the continuing story, and I don't think it will be as much of a departure as some have been freaking out about, and honestly presents a lot of opportunities to improve upon the original story in many ways.



    It helps a bit that I had just replayed the original to prep for this game, so a lot of the parallels with the original game are fresher in my memory.

    I'm just going to say straight-up that the Kingdom Hearts-style overt representations of "fate/destiny" were rather gratuitous of -presumedly- Nomura, and felt out-of-place, on account of how the conflicts of the original game were wholly human. I don't hate what the idea represents, just that the original story never really dealt with the metaphysical in this way. From a narrative standpoint, though, it opens up a huge whack of possibilities. If the ultimate aim of this game series is to amp up and flesh out the characterizations of its cast, then this adds quite a lot of wiggle room to develop Sephiroth as a person, a character who was previously nearly a blank slate.

    Despite how much presence and influence Sephiroth exerts on the original story, he's actually hardly in it, and you learn very little about him as a person. You see the brief glimpse of him as the consummate professional in Cloud's telling the Nibelheim incident, until he goes mad once he finds out about how he was born/created, but before that plot thread goes much further, Cloud "kills" him. For the rest of the plot, it's questionable how much of his personality still exists, and how much he himself is just a puppet of Jenova as well. He's pure generic doomsday villain in the game's present.

    The notion that this version of Sephiroth is potentially the post-Advent Children Sephiroth whose personality timey-wimey'd itself to "Remake" his past opens up a huge area for future storytelling, now that it's him calling the shots as opposed to his "mother". Already, we've witnessed some of the effects of these changes as he's made himself more personally known to the rest of the party, and creating more personal stakes for the lot of them. That was honestly the weakest part of the original game. After Midgar, the game devolves into this nebulous "hunt for Sephiroth", purely on the back of Cloud's hunch that this specter from his past is dangerous. Tifa, Barrett, Aerith, and Red XIII just sort of follow him for ~reasons. You traipse halfway across the goddamned world just to satiate Cloud's curiosity about what the hell is going on. It's not until the Temple of the Ancients/Aerith's death does the narrative actually pick up steam, creating both stakes and personal motivation to hunt him down.

    Establishing Sephiroth earlier, and making him confront party members other than Cloud creates a more general sense of menace. I was sort of scared that tipping the hat this early of his involvement would ruin the story's mystique, but by adding this "future sight", it introduces a new sense of dread into his being, because for veterans of the original game, it means they can't fully anticipate his moves. He's done this song and dance before, and now he's far more manipulative.

    This brings us to the other side of the coin, though, in Aerith. The game drops blatant hints that she's affected by the same timey-wimey bullshit as Sephiroth, and able to catch glimpses of her fate (essentially replacing/supplementing the few odd moments in the original game where she spaces out to commune with The Planet). Following Sephiroth's manipulations into making the party defeat the Arbiters of Fate, I think what's going to happen is that Aerith will try to fill their shoes and keep the workings of fate intact, which will put her in conflict with Sephiroth more directly, setting up her death in the future. The truth is, though, that this is the exact same dynamic that was present between the two in the original game. Sephiroth's plan hinged on the fact that he had Cetra blood in him, allowing him to manipulate Lifestream. Aerith realized, though, that this meant she should be capable of the same, and goaded Sephiroth into killing her at Gaea's spiritual core, hijacking his plan. I think this is something that many fans miss, especially if they only played the game when they were young and didn't catch all the implications. A lot of people still seem to be under the impression that Aerith was trying to summon Holy, the opposite of Meteor, and Sephiroth killed her to stop her from that. But that's just the red herring. Remember that Aerith purports to not being able to use the Holy materia, which is never brought up again until after her death. Meanwhile, when she slips away from the party in secret to go to the City of the Ancients, knowing her friends would try to stop her, and visits Cloud in a dream/vision and tells him explicitly to not try and stop her. Those are the actions of a woman with a plan, and not just a hunch. She goes to the City knowing full well she's going to die. This comes back during the game's finale, where the party immediately recognizes the Lifestream uprising as Aerith's doing, rather than just scratching their heads. They finally understand.

    So, where that leaves us is that we have one party (Sephiroth) trying to rewrite the past in his favour, and another (Aerith) who will likely try to steer things back on course. In a meta sense, this is saying "from here-on out, things are not going to be exactly the same as the original, but they will be familiar". The generalities of the plot progression will likely hew quite closely to the original, but they've got an "excuse" now to re-edit and reshuffle elements to create a fresher, and more even narrative experience (as I said earlier, storytelling in the original game drops off a cliff for the greater part of what will most likely comprise the second game).

    Which then leaves us with the wildcard of this new "alternate" Zack timeline. I think this is where the storywriters might be trying to get a little more gutsy. As I sort of mentioned above, I feel like Aerith is probably the glue that will hold Part 2 together. But when she dies, Sephiroth no longer has direct opposition in Destiny, and off can come the rails. I can see them adding a lot more new story scenarios for Part 3, or more greatly remixing the old, because this is the most "episodic" part of the original game's structure, with the Huge Materia hunt comprising the majority of that content. But ultimately, I think Zack might turn out to be the wildcard here. Sephiroth's move involve contemplating Cloud and co's actions, but Zack is a complete unknown to him since he was already dead in the original timeline.

    So, while I can't claim to know where Square Enix is actually planning to go with all of this, at the moment, I'm still fairly confident that the ending of Part 1 doesn't represent a complete departure from the original as some fear. I still believe quite strongly that all of the major story beats of the original will be preserved.

    The implications of the ending feel a bit like a bold meta-statement in how this game won't replace the original, but please look forward, discuss, and anticipate what we have in store for you in the future.

    Anywho, it's off to hard mode and trying to Platinum this thing.
     
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2020
  6. mx-01 archon

    mx-01 archon Well-Known Member

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    Something I just realized about the ending:



    The Arbiters of Fate that Sephiroth manipulates you into killing are visualized as crystalline entities, and their colours correspond to the Huge Materia that you're set to collect in the original game.

    In the original game, though, you're only given the vague justification that they "contain lost wisdom, and it would be a shame to waste them" as the reason for retrieving them. But there's really nothing lost if you fail at retrieving them.

    Here, though, I wonder if they'll wind up being the "reincarnations" of the Arbiters, and be required to help lock down causality again.



    A less major detail is Cloud's lame-duck "Let's mosey" rallying cry in the original game when they go to confront Sephiroth for the final time. In this game, though, you may note that it's initially something that Aerith prods Cloud with to get moving during the Church escape scene. So in all likelihood, Cloud will reprise the line, but with more meaning now, because it'll be in homage to Aerith. His way of saying "let's do it for her"/
     
  7. Gears

    Gears buh-buh-body ya Veteran

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    Finished most of the game on normal difficulty but that last sequence with the final bosses is just bullshit. Beat it on easy mode at that part just so I could se the ending. Don’t really have any desire to replay this game again...may go back to the original game again though. Loved that one much more than this one.
     
  8. electronic456

    electronic456 Well-Known Member

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    I've been so hype about the soundtrack these past days. Here are some of my favourites.


     
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  9. User_93049

    User_93049 Well-Known Member

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    this song has replaced my workout playlist and when I play it as I do my presses I feel POWERFUL
     
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  10. mx-01 archon

    mx-01 archon Well-Known Member

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    Really? I found the final boss gauntlet to be rather easy, compared to some of the things before it. I made it through in one try, and I accidentally handicapped myself while doing it. My Materia assignments were janked up from the previous battles. IIRC, I had Barret and Tifa throughout the fights with just the little dudes, with Aerith taking Barret's place when he went with Red to take on the big boss. Throughout that all, Tifa had no Materia equipped at all. When Barret left, he took my Cure+Magnify combo with him, leaving me with Pray only on Aerith. I just kept the pressure on a wildly smashed face, and had no challenge. By contrast, it was Rufus and Motorball prior that took a couple of attempts each.

    It's possible I was a bit "over-levelled" for that final boss gauntlet, though. I grinded my ass off at the end of Chapter 14 so I could beat Bahamut (instead of waiting until endgame like some people recommend), so most of my Materia was maxed and I had plenty of SP to fill out any meaningful weapon nodes.

    I don't feel that this entirely surpasses the original, but what they came up with holds up to modern scrutiny far better than a mere up-res of the original game ever could. I understand it can be hard to completely get over the nostalgia hump, but I personally don't hold the original game in that high regard. I still hold it in high esteem for introducing me to the JRPG genre, and the characters are still memorable, but it has some major narrative weaknesses that are hard to get over if I'm actually scrutinizing, and gameplay-wise, it's very scattershot, with some very grab-bag design elements. This game feels far more driven, focused, and personable; but at the same time, because they had the framework of the original game to work with, there are a few bits of it here and there that feel "manufactured".

    I can't say I agree as a whole, though. My experience was only really tempered by the fact that this isn't the whole package. But so much of this game had me grinning ear-to-ear in ways that the original game could only dream of (but in fairness, was entirely due to how much of this game leans on hyping up the nostalgia over the original and dialing it to 11) that I'm sure I'll wind up revisiting it again in the future (probably as a lead-up to Part 2, in the same way I replayed the original in anticipation for this). I suppose it's somewhat understandable though, especially for those that just can't wrap their head around the re-imagined battle system. Personally, I'm so over classic turn-based combat that I'll try anything, and I felt that what they've come up with here is the most perfect way of reinventing the old standby for a modern era.
     
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2020
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  11. Meta777

    Meta777 Dr Pepper Fan

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    [​IMG]
     
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  12. Tigran

    Tigran Well-Known Member

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    Nah.. Tifa is better girl. Jessie is best girl.
     
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  13. User_93049

    User_93049 Well-Known Member

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  14. User_93049

    User_93049 Well-Known Member

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    two hours of Easy Allies (the guys from Gametrailers after that company shut down) and Maximilian Dood (a youtuber credited by Square as one of the videos they watch to motivate themselves to make the remake good) discussing all the time travel bullshit and how it makes sense after analysis.
    also, dunky

    keep in mind that Dunkviews are satirical reviews and not to be taken 100% serious despite all the good points
     
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2020
  15. eyeballkid

    eyeballkid Old

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    Does this game ever end? I swear the end of the game is just boss fight after boss fight. Ugh...
     
  16. Gordon_4

    Gordon_4 The Big Engine

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    Man I wish this sucker was on PC, it looks amazing and sounds as if it plays amazingly as well.
     
  17. mx-01 archon

    mx-01 archon Well-Known Member

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    That seems like an exaggeration. Most of the bosses are at the ends of lengthy dungeon sequences, as appropriate. The only real boss gauntlet chains are through the train graveyard (which is new), and then right at the end (which was incredibly boss-heavy in the original as well). Plus an optional arena fight in the endgame content.


    You're gonna have to wait a year for the timed-exclusivity to run out, I'm afraid.
     
  18. eyeballkid

    eyeballkid Old

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    I just beat it on normal. Tough as nails. I’m not going to analyze the ending, because it’s up in the air, literally. The end credits have rain drops that ripple, causing more. That’s the whole point of the story.
     
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  19. User_93049

    User_93049 Well-Known Member

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  20. mx-01 archon

    mx-01 archon Well-Known Member

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    So much of the visual framing in this game is just brilliant. Those subtle nods/callbacks especially contribute very heavily to the game's nostalgic tone.

    I wasn't expecting that scene to go in that direction, but that single tear Cloud sheds? I swear I could feel that.