Netflix WfC Trilogy discussion thread

Discussion in 'Transformers Earthspark and Cartoon Discussion' started by Shackstoys, Feb 15, 2019.

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Will it be good?

  1. Yes!

    222 vote(s)
    35.1%
  2. No!

    115 vote(s)
    18.2%
  3. I'm from the future and all who said yes were right!

    105 vote(s)
    16.6%
  4. I'm from the future and all who said no were right!

    154 vote(s)
    24.3%
  5. I'm from the future and there was never a Titan class Skorponok figure!! Please hastak!!!

    37 vote(s)
    5.8%
  1. Magnum Dongus

    Magnum Dongus @DiddlyDipstick on Twitter

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    What I’m saying is the point of Masterpiece is to be cartoon accurate.
     
  2. Fenrys

    Fenrys Formerly Tigatron2002

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    And what I’m saying is that that wasn’t the point of masterpiece until recently
     
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  3. Prowl

    Prowl Well-Known Member

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    A touch of Vince DiCola with the trailer:

     
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  4. DarkRed401

    DarkRed401 Well-Known Member

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    speaking of vince i'm upset we didn't find out whether or not he's doing the soundtrack, usually trailer music isn't made by the ost composer so i'm still keeping my hopes up
     
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  5. Magnum Dongus

    Magnum Dongus @DiddlyDipstick on Twitter

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    What was the point of the masterpiece line if not to give cartoon accurate versions of old characters?
     
  6. Fenrys

    Fenrys Formerly Tigatron2002

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    the original mp-01 optimus prime was simply supposed to be the best version of optimus prime, not the most cartoon accurate. the absolute adherence to cartoon accuracy didnt happen till around sunstreakers release, maybe a little before that. even mp-10 deviates from the cartoon aesthetic
     
  7. Magnum Dongus

    Magnum Dongus @DiddlyDipstick on Twitter

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    Well yes, that’s why I said the slavish G1 accuracy is becoming a problem, not that it always has been. When I said they are meant to be accurate, I meant functionally accurate, including all the accessories and a correct transformation scheme.
     
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  8. Wheeljack84

    Wheeljack84 Well-Known Member

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    I enjoyed it. The mix was a little off though.
     
  9. Rumblestorm

    Rumblestorm Well-Known Member

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    Only if she pulls a TFA Lockdown.
     
  10. Wheeljack84

    Wheeljack84 Well-Known Member

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    I mean in terms of animation quality, it looks fairly on par with most CG animated series in the marketplace today.

    You can't look at this footage and tell me it's worse than the Prime Wars Trilogy or Cyberverse. It's less stylized than Cyberverse and uses a lot more shading and dynamic lighting. Now let's look at the difference in Transformers: RID (CN show):



    Look at the way those character models move. It's choppy and jerky. It looks awkward. Now let's look at the animation for Transformers: Prime



    Now, personally I was never a huge fan of this show's art style or designs. The aesthetic was more inspired by the Bay movies, and the character models and designs are way too stylized and angular for my tastes. I don't like that. But look at the way they move. It's fluid. It's not choppy or jerky. Yes they're robots, but they movement doesn't look jagged or weird. The actual animation itself looked more natural and less cheap.

    The actual animation for this production is being done by Polygram Pictures. They did the Netflix Godzilla anime. Now, I think their past productions did have that problem. Look at this footage:



    Now, I don't know what causes that issue or creates that look, but it's clearly there and exists. It's there in the Machinima Prime Wars trilogy animation as well:



    For comparison, here's Netflix WFC Siege:



    Now, is this the best CG animation for a TV series I've ever seen? No, but I believe it's a step up above what we've been seeing for Transformers ever since Prime Ended. The animation budget looks a bit higher to me and less rushed.
     
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  11. eltonlin98

    eltonlin98 F.T.C

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    I pitched an idea to a friend to devise a bingo game for the series. Take it as you will (in seriousness or jest), but I am personally looking forwards to whether or not my friend manages to collects a single bingo. I'll be sure to update this as the show progresses

    bingo.png

    Personally, I think it's still too early but I'm just not feeling excited about the series. Granted I felt more or less the same about Cyberverse and now really enjoy it
     
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  12. ScientistSkids

    ScientistSkids Well-Known Member

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    No, I really don't. So you can stop with the personal attacks.

    Again, to correct you again - since you have a tenuous grasp on "reading comprehension". I said it "looks cheap", not "it is cheap". Animation budgets are rarely cheap. However, maybe you also have a "tenuous grasp" on the history of Hasbro and animation - since they consistently try to cut corners or find someone willing to do the job quickly and for less.

    What people like "in general" is a dumb metric, and no one in any entertainment business gives two sh**s. I don't know what "the clear market is". Were you part of the focus group they did? I don't know a ton of Knights of Sidonia or Machinima Transformers fans either.

    If you want to be optimistic, fine, but you're the only one trying to claim this objectively looks good because "reasons". As of yet, I haven't heard you pose a single argument for why beyond "nuh-uh" and "it's a kid's cartoon". Batman The Animated Series was a kids cartoon so good it was played in primetime on network television. X-Men The Animated Series was a kids cartoon so good most X-Men fans hold them in regard above the films themselves - [most of] which were critically acclaimed. Tranformers Prime managed to snag a few Emmy nominations (and wins, I thought - although I don't mean to place this on par with the other two). There's also plenty of silliness and kid fair in those cartoons.

    This idea that anyone who criticizes a new show is just some "man child" holding new shows to "ridiculous standards" is honestly just trolling. I've thought Beast Wars, Prime, Beast Machines, Transformers Generation 1, RiD, Animated and Cyberverse have all been good, entertaining shows, with many flaws - and obviously all of them are very different. Almost none of them were made "for me" - and I've written many scripts for various transformers ideas - many on this site, so I don't expect my tastes to be replicated. This does not look good. It's also trying to be more mature so naturally it's going to get held to a different - and possibly higher standard. They even stated when this show began production they wanted it to be the "essential" G1 cartoon - a standard bearing in the way Batman The Animated Series is for Batman. So far it looks like Titan's Return with a ton of mopey, boring, self-indulgence. The "art" (since you seem to want me to call it that) looks lifeless - which is a problem for a show that wants you to believe "robot" can "think and feel" like normal humans - something the lively voice cast of Beast Wars, RiD, Animated and G1 all did well. These guys sound like they are collecting a check. Ditto for the animators. If you want a better "film analysis" - one of the reasons shows like Transformers Energon and Transformers Cybertron does seem as good as some others are the animation is very lifeless. Even Beast Wars which embarrassed computer graphics used a lot of Looney Tunes like expressions to give life to those characters. This is clearly not doing that and it makes it hard for a viewer to have empathy for something that is so unexpressive - so you can claim "I have a tenuous grasp on blah-blah-blah" - my bad for only working in live-action, not animation, and clarifying I didn't have expertise in that arena - but yes that's a thing in making good content - the ability to connect on a personal level. Maybe this does it for you - but it doesn't for me, and considering this is a visual medium, that might be important.

    Frankly, the need to paint the fandom with the broad brush of being malcontent man-children makes me wonder why you're even here? I don't think these shows need to be Noah Bombauch level entertainment. Cyberverse is a perfectly servable, and very loving rendition of many old characters. This isn't. It looks and feels cynical. It's trying to be edgy to call itself "mature" when it's really just angst. That sometimes works in stuff aimed at teenagers - but again, most of the most popular animated series blended humor, warmth in seamlessly with tough topics - and I'd argue most adult-themed entertainment does as well. The designs are so on-the-nose to toy designs it not only is a toy commercial - but looks exactly like a toy commercial.

    So, again, like everyone else here - I'll watch it. I watched Cyberverse for pity's sake. I've supported them since the beginning - but the idea that this teaser should inspire some optimism that this is anything but what we've already come to know and expect from the very showrunner they hired to do this very show is kind of a silly point.
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2020
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  13. Rodimal Rodimus

    Rodimal Rodimus Agent of Unit:E

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    Funny enough, Polygon Pictures did the animation for most of those you listed:
    Prime
    RID2015
    Godzilla anime trilogy
    and the War For Cybertron: Siege

    I gotta print that bingo.
     
  14. ScientistSkids

    ScientistSkids Well-Known Member

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    Prime was a well-written, well-acted (especially), well-paced, show.

    To me the only flaws is it's self-seriousness. I particularly hate that Optimus Prime is written overly serious these days, for a guy who once practiced his "drooling" with Spike, I feel like he needs to be written more like Christopher Reeve Clark Kent, not Gandalf the Giant Red Semi-truck. It's unfortunate relationship with the Aligned Continuity. Also, Bumblebee should speak - enough with making him giant R2D2.

    But I disagree that's the greatest they've produced. I still think Beast Wars is better. (I honestly think Beast Machines deserves the number 2 spot, but everyone considers that to be blasphemy - it's a good show, I don't care how out of left field it is).
     
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  15. Prowl

    Prowl Well-Known Member

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    Thanks, man! Didn't spend a lot of time on it. Just wanted to see how it matched. Their music was subtle. But any dbs up on Vince and you can't hear what they are saying.
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2020
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  16. Prowl

    Prowl Well-Known Member

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    While I disagree that BW is better than Prime (and I loooooooved BW), I do totally agree about BM. It's not blasphemy. Even back then folks didn't understand what made a good show. BM still holds up today even if BW has aged a little rough. BM had solid writing. People were just pissed because it wasn't what they wanted. What a surprise. Lol
     
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  17. Fenrys

    Fenrys Formerly Tigatron2002

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    prime was not well written or well paced, everything else i agree with though
     
  18. Prowl

    Prowl Well-Known Member

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    Compared to other transformers shows it was. For one, the dialogue wasn't dumbed down or written to be read at a 10-year old pace. Secondly, some of the conversation actually felt like dialogue and not just a line.

    Certainly not saying it's the only TF show with good writing, but it is one of the best. Don't mistake good writing with a good story. You don't have to like the narrative but the writing was still solid.

    Say something like "Energon had better writing" and all credibility is lost.

    Say something like "BW and even Animated better writing" and I'll give you that. But Prime was not inferior to those. Not to me anyway. But they were on the same level. Again, compared to the "clearly aimed at a less-than-ten-year-old audience" of other transformers shows in memory.

    Except Prime didn't lose its tone. It maintained it. Again, whether you like the story or not. BW was great until a line was written that broke the tone and made it seem like the whole thing was a gag. Characters acting unlike themselves for comic relief instead of anecdotal comedy. BM was better at maintaining tone.
     
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  19. Fenrys

    Fenrys Formerly Tigatron2002

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    i count story as part of the writing, the dialog was good, you are correct in that, but bulkhead being irreparably damaged and then being 100% only a few episodes later is bad writing. introducing wheeljack and not having him join the cast till season 3 so you can maintain the status quo is bad writing. starting multiseason plots just to dump them when they get too difficult is bad writing. and the pacing was bad due to endless fetch quests
     
  20. jamarmiller

    jamarmiller S.K.A.R. LEADER

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