So are Transformers nonliving robots to you? They’re built after all and don’t appear naturally. And yet, what if a robot or robots follows all the life of criteria? Will they still be robots or something else? I don’t remember reading that life have to be grown. I should go back and check on that.

I’m imagining somewhere in another world, a robot is saying all of the same things that Saber is saying. But saying something like “we never seen life being grown. Always built or forged.”

 

In Transformers: Devastation, Megatron kind of takes a stance toward organics not truly being living; he calls organic life "byproduct at best" during the final battle and considers machine life to be true life. Just an interesting perspective that kind of mirrors an idea like this.

 

The problem being that has more intelligence is gained, more knowledge acquired, it would become more and more difficult to differentiate between “just” intelligence and sentience

There’s something wrong with your nervous system it is sending delayed signals

It’s similar to the sensation known as phantom pains

Knowledge

 

Most of the time yes... except in one weird continuity where Transformers were actually the first life in the universe and Quintus Prime created everything else in the universe... some how... but that's so beyond the suspension of disbelief it completely took me out of the story.

You kinda said that backwards but yes the ability to grow is part of the criteria for life.

 

So they aren’t even artificial life to you? Weird I consider them to be living mechanical beings. Artificial lifeforms that is.

Although Transformers don’t grow. I do find it plausible for them to grow. They are made out of nanobots.

 

Sure they do
Hotrod grew a few feet when he became Rodimus lol

Megatron grew every time he transformed into robot midst

 

Not always, they're not. In fact, how many continuities have them as made of nanobots?

They aren't artificial life to me at all. In fact, the term is a misnomer. They are artificial beings, with artificial intelligence, but that's it. They don't meet the 7 criteria, so it's a non-discussion at this point.

 

Of course they're artificial life but that's kind of my point. Artificial life isn't actually life. It's technology built and programed to mimic life. No matter how advanced it gets it's still always going to be just artificial. There's never a point where the artificial can actually become real. If it ain't real it isn't alive.

 

“

Question to everyone

How exactly do we describe where transformer stand on the “life scale” within the original marvel g1 continuity?

Marvel had 2 explanations for TF life
1) Atechnogenesis: evolution by way of naturally-occurring interaction of gears, levers, and pulleies
2) created by a god

 

Well, under the mentioned scientific definition of the organic life it doesn't matter how an organism came to be. It only matters how it functions. Marvel TFs would be only classified based on their species body functions or lack of them.

 

And would you mind giving your personal opinion based on that criteria?

Because from where I stand it seems they (tf MG1) would meet just about all of what is necessary to be called life

 

If you want opinion, then sure:

If they don't fulfill criterias listed in this definition then they still don't qualify as life forms under this definition.

Otherwise it'd be a paradox where an animal clone created in laboratory or a new plant species created with gene mixing don't qualify as alive because they're created. Both real world examples. :X

IIRC Marvel TFs didn't grow or reproduce save for the G2 thing with budding and that was discontinued by Primus very fast.

 

Marvels TFs did grow....in a matter of speaking, you know the whole mass Increasing and decreasing thing....And they can also grow old

And Primus allowed the budding thing for a lot longer than you are assuming and besides that some re-learned the process........Which means only the memory of how to do so was lost not the ability

And besides it’s not like humans That lose the ability to reproduce are no considered life

By the way thank you for your opinion, Also did you intend to link something above because I don’t see it

 

Humans as entire species DO grow and reproduce.

The definition is for the entire species, not for the individual creatures.

You asked how it works with the definition. Well, according to the understanding of the real world XXI-st century science they simply do not live. The definition might or might not change in the future.

 

And the entire species of Transformers were capable of reproduction untill they were “neutered” by Primus........if the same thing happened to our species by way of illness or Radiation poisoning we would still be considered life, at least untill we died off

as to “growing”, I feel growing old meets the definition....,At least barely

I did and thanks for the reply, I just feel under the same criteria and based on when I posted above marvels G1 fa fit into those 2 particular categories

 

Growing means "developing from baby to an adult". Decaying with time is not an object of this criterium. Inanimated objects also decay with time.

Also, that's mostly due to Furman inept writing because he probably didn't realize what he's doing, but G2 meant that Marvel ended has TWO parallel "species" of TFs. Because TFs who stayed on Cybertron and had their bodies rebuilt, then some of them were rebuild on Earth in different scratch-built bodies, are absolutely mechanical and those bodies never had any budding capabilities.

But that's mostly Furman being overrated and doing similar writing mistakes again and again.

 

Giant space faring robots that live for millions of years and never stop warring. There is no need for me to look beyond that concept for the entertainment value because they are fiction.

 

I’d love to see one day Transformers being an actual reality, being alive like they are at least in TF franchise <Maybe we could get there one day, if humans discover how to transfer our consciousness, or create it in robots we have or can build,.. if that's at all possible and if understanding or life is true> Because.. it'd be awesome to have Transformers here or any other beings that can understand us equally as we do each other, communicate with us on the same level, above the level of animals do, for example. So far, we, as humankind, are the only ones like this…

 

Well they do meet some of the 7 criteria. I think only growth and reproduction are unfulfilled by them. They don’t grow or reproduce most of the all. Growth and reproduction is fulfilled by some of them because there have been kiddieformers like Wheelie, Lithone children the RBA kids and so on maybe proof of asexual and sexual reproduction. They could’ve been built, but build form their parents inside parts over stuff lying lying around. Most just prefer instead adults. The kids either grow by nanobots or metal plates unfolding or body producing heat to make the metal expand. In the IDW continuity, protoforms grew. Stardrive claim by her 5th cycle she was already bigger then her classmates.

 

And we have seen the “Equivalent” in Marvels tfw of developing from younger stages to older ones

Fuhrman’s fault maybe but it still part of the continuity

As to the rest it’s an assumption on your part

If those with rebuilt or newly built bodies by others Transformers followed their own “blue prints” is possible (even likely) they incorporated the ability to bud into those new bodies without even knowing they were doing so

I cannot completely disagree with you on that
But I still enjoyed a lot of his stuff