percent of collectors awareness of non-official offerings

Discussion in 'Transformers 3rd Party Discussion' started by darkjedv, Aug 8, 2019.

  1. pilot00

    pilot00 Well-Known Member

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    I have been collecting KOs ever since I have been collecting transformers, and that is since the 90s.

    I took a hiatus during the Energon Era and came back in 2007 due to a gift of Mp03. After getting it in hand, I immediately tried to search the webs for an MP Galvatron and ended up with some fuck awesome renders, supposedly of something called 3p which I knew nothing about. Turned out it was fan made and I am deeply sad to this day....

    I didnt start collecting immediately, it took some years but I still remember one of the first 'real' 3p companies to cross my path durring my online searches into these dark days, was FTs Accustic wave (which is going to be released soonish).

    What I want to say I guess is, that its a bit hard not to stumble upon such things unless you dont spent some time searching learning about the product you are interested. Epsecially with the prevalent Chinese KOs in every aspect of life these days.

    So after this wall of text? My guess is pretty much only a few people arent aware.
     
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  2. gibdozer

    gibdozer Censored

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    If you ever used google or youtube as collecting aids it would be practically impossible to not learn about 3P. Only a very passive TF collector would only be aware of what's on the shelves of Walmarts. Maybe someone just entering into the hobby could remain ignorant for a few months, but even that seems like a stretch.
     
  3. Starganderfish

    Starganderfish Well-Known Member

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    The problem is we tend think of Transformers “collectors” as only the slightly obsessive geeks like ourselves on forums and perusing exclusive online collectables stores. And that’s just nonsense.

    The manufacturing volumes on Hasbro retail transformers are insane and the vast majority are sold through department stores like Target, KMart, or the equivalents in other parts of the world (Walmart? Costco? you all know where these figures retail in your area)
    For every MP they sell to a nerdy collector who frequents online forums they sell a thousand $15 shelf hangers to Little Johnny’s mum and dad for Christmas presents or for Little Janey’s school friends 8th birthday.
    Little Johnny’s mum doesn’t shop at BBTS or on TaoBao. She goes to the local department store or buys from Amazon.
    None of those kids and barely any of those parents have the foggiest idea what a 3rd Party figure is. Some may know about the cheap Chinese KO that’s the wrong colour and sells at the local discount store. But FansToys or MMC? Nah.
     
  4. JJJ

    JJJ Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, but I wouldn't call them collectors.

    A kid might want them all (I know I did), but has no way to do so, nor any realistic prospect of doing so. That's not a collector - that's a collector-in-the-making at best; wait a decade or so and see what happens when they have their own money.

    I would call someone a collector if they can and do set out to buy Transformers, lots of Transformers; collections rarely stop at just a few, after all. And I've rarely encountered someone with that sort of interest who doesn't at least look up what's out there, even if just to know what isn't turning up at their local retailer. And that's the part where you learn about non-HasTak stuff.
     
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  5. evilash3373

    evilash3373 Well-Known Member

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    14%
     
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  6. pilot00

    pilot00 Well-Known Member

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    I had this discussion yesterday on facebook....

    Yeah thats true...if you live in the US that is. And wherever those stores are....But the rest of the (western) world has to go through online channels for distribution. Which tends to make you search, and if you search you will stumble on 3p options. Johnnys mum wont go through this process to find a starscream. She will go to the nearest brickstore and get the first available starscream.
     
  7. TheRebirth

    TheRebirth Well-Known Member

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    Fans buy what happens to be on the shelf, and probably can't tell the difference between HasTak and 3p. Collectors actively seek things out. I have no idea how you could actively seek anything out and not stumble across a 3p.
     
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  8. Electro Rush

    Electro Rush Just a guy waiting for the perfect Whirl

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    I'd say its fairly high, since the keyword here is "collector". Almost all of my collector buddies are aware that third party companies exist, though few have ever actually bought them. I first found out about them by watching Optibotimus reviews back in 2013 and seeing him review stuff like the TFC Aerialbots and the Unique Toys Predacons. A friend of mine has a 6 year old kid and he is always watching Emgo reviews every time I see him, so he is certainly aware that third party figures exist since Emgo reviews them fairly often. I'm also on the reprolabels facebook group and everyone there appears to generally accept their existence... never seen anyone argue over the morality behind them or anything dumb like that.
     
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  9. stinkyshawn

    stinkyshawn Well-Known Member

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    once u go 3p....there no turning back
     
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  10. darkjedv

    darkjedv Member

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    I guess the more refined version of this question is even though you see a FansToys, MagicSquare, etc I tend to think most would passively group them in with the KO group of garbage unless you watched a review or looked it up specifically. I know when I was a kid in the 80s I would see that RadioShack Shockwave, or all the Korean KOs at Spencers in the mall and think of it as garbage. My parents would buy me those sometimes and my friends would make fun of me because it wasn't the "real" version.

    As I grew older and collected from stores, or would shop online, when I saw a "transforming toy" and not an official Transformer I would just shrug it off as more garbage. It wasn't until about 4 years ago that a couple of my friends explained to me the difference between KO and 3rd party and how the quality was completely different. Then I joined some FB groups and have been hooked on them till this day. I guess in this age of information, someone who didn't grow up with that impression would be more aware they exist, but may not investigate further due to it being an ip infringement or getting burned from a garbage KO.
     
  11. Red2

    Red2 " ... and so the story goes ... "

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    lol
     
  12. franpincho

    franpincho NOT a FT Only collector

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    This is an excellent question.


    Of course, for us, we simply can't comprehend how there can be TF Fans out there that have no idea of what 3P is (or KO's for that matter)

    But believe me, there are. A lot I'd say.

    I remember that time when a buddy of mine saw a picture of MP-29 somewhere online (he does not follow toy pages, geek sites, none of that, he simply stumbled upon THAT ONE picture of it). He is the type of guy that is simply "too busy" to find out about any of it, but he loved Shockwave growing up. That, I can remember.

    He told me he needed to buy it, no matter what and to please guide him in the right direction, he NEEDED IT.

    Now, before you all start saying how shitty that mold is, stop it. This is not that type of debate.


    After that, he developed a slight interest in the MP line, and he's been sporadically buying them ever since. I once asked if he was aware that there are other offerings, be it unofficial or officially licensed ones that may not transform. He simply said no. He liked the little amount of MP's he had and that was it.

    That can not possibly be an isolated case.
     
    Last edited: Aug 9, 2019
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  13. StrangePlanet

    StrangePlanet G1

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    They are all over Big Bad Toy Store and other retailers - that's how I found out about them. If you are any kind of hard collector type they are pretty hard to miss or ignore.
    But you are a casual fan, or just the kind of guy who wanders through WalMart and buys some cool stuff, or if you know all about Hasbro and Takara offerings through their official channels and you don't go far from official websites and retailers that are mainstream and not specialty, they I'm sure it's easy to have no idea about them. And I bet that's a large chunk of people. The newer movie fans for instance.
    50/50. That's my best guess.
     
  14. Scourgatron

    Scourgatron 4D Smart-ass

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    Why should we care?
     
  15. ProtectronPrime

    ProtectronPrime Subjectively Objective

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    To gain a sense of perspective, I'd say. That's something this fandom lacks quite a bit. For example, things like toy cost and poseability are heated topics here when there are easily toys out there that eclipse the cost of similar non Transformers toys and do way less and are only slightly more posable. For example, a decent Figma is like $80 and all it does is look good and pose, with at least half of the decent poses needing a stand. A similar carbot can pull that off, plus balance better in poses without a stand AND turns into a car. Nevertheless, we'll collectively scream like a stuck pig when the missile launchers are silver instead of chrome.

    Having a discussion and knowing the demographics of our fanbase, or at least discussing it, is great as a whole. I think we'd all benefit from a general understanding that we ("collectors") are simply not the biggest part of the fandom - just the loudest and frequently the most annoying and unreasonable. I've seen a few posts here that discuss the issue of "buyer", "fan" and "collector". Putting that out there may help re-calibrate how some of us think and approach this hobby and put our expectations of official offerings vs. 3p ones into perspective.
     
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  16. darkjedv

    darkjedv Member

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    Based on the percent of collectors who are aware of 3rd party, do you think the possible offering of a 3rd party Unicron would deter the number of backers to the point where it wouldn't meet the 8000 needed?
     
  17. ProtectronPrime

    ProtectronPrime Subjectively Objective

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    Not really.

    1) 3P collectors are a rabid, picky bunch. There's not really any kind of 3P Unicron offering. There's the Zeta "teaser", but honestly I'd be shocked if the percentage of 3P collectors was big enough, much less the collectors as a whole, to affect HasLab's preorders. There's jack shit all for details on Zeta, and Zeta doesn't enjoy the same rep as FT, MMC or any of the big 3P "houses" to cruise in on reputation or expectation alone. I'm going to go out on a limb here and suggest that nobody saw the Zeta Unicron head and said "SOLD" based on that alone... and that's really all we have regarding him right now. Other than a grayscale image, there are no other details regarding that figure.

    2) Many, not all, 3P collectors are used to larger, expensive figures being a certain price. When you're tossing out that kind of money for FT's Terminus, MakeToys Utopia, or ToyWorld's Constructor, you generally have enough disposable income to end up getting whatever you like. Case in point - a lot of TW purchasers bought two of the damn things to display in individual and combined mode simultaneously. I suspect any person with 3P figures in their collection, especially the larger ones, has decided to buy or not buy HasLab Unicron on the merits of the toy itself and would buy or not buy notwithstanding any 3P offering.

    If your thread is about this specific thing... eh. Fella, we honestly have enough people running around yelling about the sky falling and much fussing about how 3P is going to ruin things forever for HasLab and deny people their Holy Grail and/or will bring down the thunder of an angry god on the fandom by exposing 3P to lawsuits. HasLab Unicron will stand or fall on its own merits. The handful of people that honestly are sitting around thinking of not buying Unicron because of some vaporware 3P offering is likely insubstantial and those individuals probably weren't going to buy him anyway if "MAYBE POSSIBLY SOMEDAY ZETA WILL MAKE A UNICRON OF UNDETERMINED DIMENSIONS" is enough to dissuade them from the purchase now.
     
  18. franpincho

    franpincho NOT a FT Only collector

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    No way in hell.


    Watch MP-44 sell out even though there's other options at 1/3 of the price.
     
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  19. Scourgatron

    Scourgatron 4D Smart-ass

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    I'm not really part of the fandom, I guess. I dont like to argue about the toys, I dont care about the comics, the cartoons are bad, I dont like anything past G1.

    I collect for the feels. I finally have proper versions of shit I wanted when I was a child. Hasbro doesnt give me that.

    And I still dont see how this should matter to me.

    Comparing a Figma to a MP really isnt fair?
     
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  20. ProtectronPrime

    ProtectronPrime Subjectively Objective

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    It may not matter to you, but it might matter to others. Comparing a Figma to an MP isn't supposed to be "fair" or "not fair" or anything in between. Again, the idea is perspective, which is a neutral concept. Someone may decide that everything is garbage regardless of what information is placed in front of them. Someone else might feel differently. The point of asking open ended questions like this is for everyone to air out their opinions and compare notes, philosophies, stories, etc.

    Of course you can state that all of this is a pointless exercise to you. That's your right - but questions like these do serve a fun purpose and I enjoy the responses. So at the very least, it entertains ME and my position is just as valid as yours, isn't it?