That. And that's written by a Man that knows 3P.

Objectively there are still New Worlds that 3Ps "could" go to, but I'm guessing even some well established Players are hesitant right now about doing so. And I keep reading "Make IDW versions COS I want 'em!" Well MMC are trying, but looking at the backlash to Pet/Nickle and the fact that there are only so many punters prepared to pay £60-90 for characters that Hastak are "sort of" doing/might do for £20 and even Companies like them have to think long and hard about just how much "pull" a Tyrest or even Pharma is really going to have.

Add in tortuous in-development times and you've had maybe as much as half the potential market for their Bigger DJD members jump ship and sell Vos and Kaon in the wait. Do they really want The Risk of taking a bath on any more "obscure" characters right now?

I'm not even going to address the fact that for many Collectors, gaps HAVE been filled, Rosters have been filled to a large degree, and many clearly don't want to be arsed with forever updating what they've already got. Even TT aren't immune to that sentiment.

The other objective point is looking on the front-pages of the three Online Retailers I use from choice. They have dramatically less in the way of 3P Preorders going on than at any time I can remember since 2011/12. Almost all the preorder space is taken by Marvel/Star Wars/Official Product which MUST be doing the kind of business for them that justifies that switch. Think about it.

So 3Ps may not be "dead," and China may indeed be their main focus as a market, but here in the West things have very much changed, and there's no point pretending otherwise.

 

I don't agree but ok.

 

There were some good points brought up, AND as much as this is the exception to the rule, Hasbro just beat 3rd Party at it's own game with Pulse Unicron. We wanted it, we begged for it, we were going to pay G.O.D. for their Unicrons but they died, and now Hasbro is releasing the best Transformer they've ever created at a 3rd party price no less. I'm starting to have my doubts that it gets made but if it doesn't most of those backers would jump on the G.OD. designs and someone in the 3rd party market should be watching and waiting to execute an easy money grab if and only if Hasbro fails to meet their quota

 

Fair enough... but the fact still remains, we haven't seen plans for these other options. If they do, great. I will be glad to say I am wrong then  

 

I think this has been a big deal for IDW collections in general, not just the DJD. Who wants to make an IDW collection if you can’t get the main cast?

Of the core cast of MTMTE who have we gotten? Just swerve, tailgate, drift, rodimus, and Megatron? Maybe the Whirl counts as well even though it’s the wrong look? There’s barely even a hint of a Chromedome, Rewind, Skids, Ratchet, Trailbreaker, Nautica, or Rung being made.

And yet, these companies keep making side characters like thunderclash, roller, starsaber, and deathsaurus. And while I’ve been buying them, I’ve been losing interest.

I actually want a Nickel, but for once I didn’t bother getting Ni as Ive decided that I want to be sure I’ll have a complete DJD before getting the side character.

At least the wreckers have been reasonably well attended to.

I’m an idiot who’s bad with his money, but even I’m losing interest because of the character choices. How can someone who’s a little more picky stay interested?

 

I don't know if that has such an impact.
I agree with Mororthing that the wait to get a complete subgroup is frustrating.
There may be those like you who want the main characters first, but to me it's always been more like the main characters (most of them) have toys that aren't too different from their IDW versions.
I've always mainly wanted toys of characters like Rung, Whirl, Tarn, Nickel, Thunderclash, Velocity...
Rodimus and Cyclonus an Ultra Magnus and Rewind etc are cool and all, but it's not like their IDW designs are that exotically different from their G1 designs.
I can make do with an MP or an official chug version of them.
That doesn't means I don't want IDW versions of them, I'm very interested in an IDW Ratchet, but I can wait while I have chug toys of their G1 versions.

 

Maybe so, but I doubt I’m the only one who feels this way.

The main cast is like an incomplete subgroup in a way. For me, ya I can put a Titans Return Chromedome or figures like that on my shelf, but it’s so different from the comic design and at such a different scale/ quality that it doesn’t match the more voyager sized releases from MMC. Hasbro Skids, for example, is absolutely minuscule.
It’s like putting the upcoming battlemaster Rung next to SXS or MMC Rodimus, just looks wrong.

 

I'm not saying you are and I totally agree with you. But selling of your collection and giving up alltogether because it takes so long to get them all seems rash. Though I guess if it takes that long I can see people moving on from the entire hobby eventually.

 

When did Legends scale not exist? The scale has been around for 13-14 years at least, and Hasbro created it as a cheaper alternative to the larger figures. It's not as though 3P companies invented the concept, although they have greatly improved upon it.

You're same argument could be used to lambast the 3P market for embracing the MP scale instead of sticking solely to CHUG. How dare 3rd Party companies produce a product for consumers interested in such things!!!!

"...artificially binding customers to them..." What insane BS is this? Are you seriously trying to claim folks are too dumb to know that they didn't actually want to buy Legends scale figures, but were hornswoggled into it by those conniving foreigners? Everyone knows the best way to keep a market healthy is to prevent folks from innovating or trying out new ideas.  

The idea that the 3P companies being in competition with one another is a bad thing is so absurd and banal.

 

I'm not talking about legends or MP scale.
I'm talking about MFT and New Age scale which exist for no other reason but to create an in-company scale that prevents customers from mixing and matching and artificially creates a "reason" for this companies to produces toys for characters that already got great toys in the legends scale.

But hey, feel free to rant on against what I write without actually understanding what I wrote. Everyone knows the way to keep a market healthy is for every company to produce the same thing and compete each other into oblivion while the customer doesn't get what they want  

 

I disagree that they are separate scales. There's three scales. Legends, CHUG, MP. Variation between companies is nothing new, we've seen it in other scaled toy lines as well. The conceptual 1/18 scale has lows of 3.75", and highs 4.5". These sizes have been employed both intra- and inter-company on various lines. Hasbro's Star Wars and Marvel Universe lines exemplify this.

The only artificiality here are the limits one sets on the enjoyment of and desire for any given product. That's why the competition between companies is great for both the industry and the consumer. If multiple companies produce Mirage I'm not locked down to the single offering of one person's interpretation. Instead I can buy none or as many variations as I please. There's no external forces preventing me or anyone else from mixing and matching my purchases.

 

I think a lot of the issue is that the characters that have been made in IDW form have cross appeal. Deathsaurus and Star Saber are so underrepresented that making them IDW style also serves as more or less of an update to designs people aren't touching. As for the rest? They're part of the MMC Retool/recolor brigade with low overhead (not upset about it, but it's a thing).

I'm sure MMC would love to make the characters we want, but I don't think they want to risk hemorrhaging cash on the off chance they make a "main cast member" and the amount sold isn't enough to cover costs, or alternatively jack up the price to stupid levels to cover costs and risk offending everyone.

 

I realize that I'm the only one who wants them, but...

Will some 3P company PLEEEEEZE make MP Runabout, Runamuck, and the Omnibots?!?

I realize there'd be risk involved due to the fact that they're not the most well known bots but I'd think there would be enough support within the fandom that they'd be fairly popular...then again "popular" is one thing "making a profit" on figure x is another...

 

So in your opinion New Age toys fit seamlessly into a collection with MFT G1 and Magic Square G1?

 

I would actually argue that those would be more cost effective and better bets than most. The Battlechargers are basically twins that only need slight retooling to the car shell to be different. Downshift and Camshaft also have simillar enough transformations (just rotate the torso up on Camshaft) that they could use the same skelleton and just reshell the car. The Omnibots in particular were available as mail aways for almoat all of G1. I dont know any of my frinds back then that didnt have at least one of them, most of us had 2 or all 3.

Im surprised more companies havent looked in those directions to hit low risk / maximum number of recolors for their strategy...other than with seekers.

A single basic skelleton for a jet that has the nose fold to make the chest and the wings on the backpack could be the 4 Predators, 3 of the Skyscorchers, 6 Cyberjets (more if you do the Universe colors), the flipchanger jets with all their MW, BW2 and RiD versions and Fearswoop....thats and insane amount of use out of something that only needs to be engineered once. Upsize one and you get all the G2 Darkwind / Dreadwing coloways as well.

The engineering on those legends size Sideswipe / Red Alert could quickly be every G2 / RiD spychanger.

 

The things I want are not being produced --> 3P is dead

The things I want are being produced --> 3P is alive and well.

What's new? It's about me, me, me. There's no "me" in 3P.

 

MFT, New Age, Magic Square, Iron Factory, DX9, Hot Soldiers, 3P city bots, and Titans Return citybots. I think that covers every company I currently own. I used to have Hasbro legends scaled figures too, but I think they're all gone now. I don't stop with just G1. I'm not opposed to having more than one representation of a character either. For example I have Iron Factory's seekers in bot mode and DX9's in jet mode. In a month that might be reversed. Most of my legends scaled stuff is displayed in a battle scene with Titans Return Devastator. There's robots and alt modes and scenery. Megatron and Galvatron fighting side by side. Etc...Etc... The point being 1) I'm not limiting my enjoyment by adhering to other people's interpretation of the Transformers phenomena, and 2) the way one displays their collection can change the boundaries of what does and doesn't look good. Battle scenes are chaotic, role call lines are ordered, you can play to each style's strengths.

The 3rd Party companies are trying to put out a product they're proud of, and hoping a bunch of folks will buy into their vision. There's no nefarious Machiavellian schemes to trick the consumers employed. You define your collection as you want it to be. If that means you buy from one company, or all companies, or anywhere in between that's purely your decision. And I don't mean to limit this just to a legends scale discussion. That goes for CHUG, MP, 1/18, 1/12, he-man, GI Joe, whatever you derive joy from collecting.

 

I don't mean to pretend that you can't mix everything in your collection if you don't care about comparative size. But, there is no machiavellian scheme? I'm sorry but I can't take that seriously from a grown person. Every company's interest is directly opposite to the interest of its customers and employees. Every company uses trickery to get as much profit as they can by spending as little money as they can. You know this and I know this, and that's exactly what's been going on and what's limiting the choices of what people can put into their collection. Claiming what you wrote above is very rose-colored and highly suspect.

Nobody uses so much "me" in their post as you just did. And there is more me in 3p these days than ever before.

 

Well this is the 3rd party forum no?  

 

The arguing in this thread has really drowned my "pooped out a Nero Rex" joke. And that's a damned shame, folks, a damned shame.