Yeah, I can feel that to some degree. Of course anything that is hand painted is going to be one of a kind.

 

in maz i trust. if maz says it's legit, that's enough for me to not dout him. He knows his shit and if he got it from the same person he's been getting other info from, then i have no reason to doubt otherwise.

on these boards it takes alot of work to gain respect and trust, and i highly doubt maz would just throw this in there and muck up his reputation on purpose.

 

the sloppy paint is explained in the article. If its just a mockup for a meeting, than why worry if the paint chips 15 years later.

i love reading your articles Maz! That color scheme is great, reminds me a little of drench from g2. I would have liked this better than the black g2 sideswipe. The red head always bugged me for some reason. But the blue with the yellow is gorgeous.

 

I am not saying Maz repainted it himself but someone else. Also in terms of respect you can say I know some people ;-) I have seen many prototypes and mock-ups from the G2 line and only as of recent have these sloppy verson ones surfaced. Anyone can be fooled, I know Maz knows his stuff but I myself think this and the D C jets that have showed up as of late are maybe not real.

 

The Ramjet had artwork to go along with it, which adds a lot of weight to its authenticity, also I have one more mock up which is just as "sloppy" as these, showed it to the Hartmans and they said they were actually aware of an assortment number existing for it, and that came in the same lot as these.

I understand that people may be skeptical, but one thing I don't think anyone realises is that when I bought these, they were not advertised as "Unreleased colour scheme mock up". They were just advertised as prototypes along with a stack of other hardcopy prototypes, which I might add were just as sloppily painted, and we have actually ID'ed those hardcopies and matched them up with actual catalog and boxart-used toys.

The reason for the sloppiness is because it's a really quick paint-job over an existing production toy, it's not painted resin or moulded plastic. The moulded plastic and careful painting would have been a much later stage and these toys never got to that stage, which is probably why nobody has ever seen nor heard of them until now I guess.

Oh and the blue sections on Sideswipe are painted, not at all moulded.

All the best
Maz

 

There was a time when you collected nice, shiny, MIB Diaclone toys Maz. Now all you seem to care about are G2 incomplete kitbashed toys with sloppy paintjobs. How the mighty have fallen...  

D.

 

You know how it is Smeerlap-D, that stuff got more and more expensive, now I give G2 toys to my little nephews to paint and pass them off as prototypes!

Oh, crap, I said that out loud didn't I...

All the best
Maz

 

Well the reason I think the DC jets that have surfaced as of late might not be real is them compared to the first one found (Ramjet) that was sold by M Hertz AKA Whiz bang many years back was a lot different in terms of the quality. The paint was not sloppy and the details look a lot more sharp. Also the logo's or anything else applied was also more sharp.

This also applies to the G2 Hero Megatron tank that also has a DC style to it. Both G2 style Mock ups from the same time both high quality.

I saw at Botcon the Black DC SS and it looked like it was spray bombed in flat black paint and the writing and details we applied by chalk. Also the green DC SS that was on Ebay a couple months back looked like it was also spray bombed green and had poor sharpie marker details added.

these differences are why I am not buying into them as the previous two mock ups (DC Ramjet, G2 Megs) I stated came from 2 different sources and both had the same high quality you would expect from a large company.

These mock ups as of late are from the same source. Also why would a company go through the trouble of having artwork done and spend like 30 sec on the painting of a toy to be presented at a meeting? I know they are for kids but I do not think they wanted them to look like a kid painted them.

I am not a newbie and I do not right articles but I have been hardcore collecting since the mid 90's. And I have been interested in prototypes for over 10 years easy. So if anyone wants to question anything I say (none of this is directed at Maz) that is fine. But I do not open my mouth without facts.

 

The ones that were more sharp could just have been much further along in the prototyping stages, in other words, maybe they were approved at more points than these ones were.

Also with the Ramjet, the artwork is different to the toy in that it has weapons and other features, but the toy itself may not be the most advanced example of Desert Ramjet in existence, it could just be the earliest stage, ther emight actually be a nicer version somewhere with the correct weapons too.

These mock-ups may not be the be-all-and-end-all of a particular idea, just the first stages. The later stages may be in th epossession of someone else, may not have survived, or been kept elsewhere. the more serious they got about a particular release, the more they may have guarded its whereabouts.

All the best
Maz

All the best
Maz

 

Also, I should re-iterate, the same source provided handpainted G1 hardcopies, and those hardcopies were identified in printed Transformers literature. I mean literally we looked at a catalog/Laserdisc booklet whatever , then looked at the toy and said "it's the exact same one!!!", and that happened more than once! Those hardcopies were handpainted in just as sloppy a fashion as these mock-ups. The pattern emerging here is that the earlier the concept, the less effort goes into producing a perfectly presentable specimen.

All the best
Maz

 

The amount of clearly authentic stuff coming from the source Maz got his from is overwhelming. The guy had box flats, mock up packaging, the original G1 artwork paintings including both front box art and battle scenes, first shots, and resin protos. You can't fake that stuff, especially not in the quantities this guy had them.

There is no reason to doubt that this stuff is real...

 

Again I am not saying everything is not real,I am just not convinced some things are. You don't think its easy enough to fake something? I remember a certain Singapore seller dying godbombers black. Anyway I look at facts. if it was not Maz then would people question it? it should not matter who owns it playing a role if its real or not. The guy Maz got it from got the stuff from a ex hasbro employee correct? As what is to stop things being added to the original lot? I stated facts from things I know that do not add up. I am not trying to be a prick I am just giving my views on this and the jets.

 

Oh man, I would've been all over a G2 Spriteswipe. That thing's sweet.

 

That's probably what that designer friend of yours thought when his Hasbro boss told him to come up with more ideas for the TF line. And since the TF line got scrapped shortly after G2, we all know how that turned out  

D.

 

It's funny you should mention the Singapore seller who was painting Black Godbombers because I'm the one who busted him along with help from Jangar and his own buddy   And I've been telling people to steer clear of Minsitry Of Toys ever since because I don't think conmen like that have a place in the fandom or should be allowed to profit from us.

To answer your questions, actually yes, the middleman could easily have thrown some crap in there along with the legitimate stuff to make an extra buck or two. You're absolutely right, that could easily have happened. However, don't forget the middleman was very challenged for Transformers information and history so he didn't actually have too much idea about these pieces to begin with, he didn't even advertise them as unreleased or special colours because I'm not sure he was aware of those facts.

And just because it is me, no people shouldn't just believe it, that's why I usually go to such lengths in the articles to back up claims and not make claims I can't justify or prove. I think I assumed that most people who read this read the G2 Ramjet article where I spoke a lot more about authenticity. The reason people put stock in what I say is that unlike a lot of collectors I don't just do this for myself, I've been writing about TFs for a few years now so people are used to my stuff, much of what I have on TF-1 does not actually belong to me, the site is 100% not a reason for me to show off my toys, more to spread info.

Also just for the record, I don't think you're a prick at all and I am not taking this personally at all, I'm actually really enjoying the discussion so please don't feel like you're being squeezed out here  

All the best
Maz

 

Spriteswipe!! That's perfect haha!

All the best
Maz

 

Well Maz I thank you for the reply as I love reading the things you write, I love rare stuff as well as prototypes also and love these topics  .

Now im aware "E" did not have a lot of TF knowledge, But I just have a hard time being convinced these are 100% authenic as I know the G2 Ramjet very well and it has many things that don't add up when compared to the other DC jets. As please keep in mind it must also be a early mock up as there was no artwork (at least that I have seen) .

Also the 2 G2 mock ups I stated previous both were G2 figures mocked up were those other jets are G1 toys mocked up? This Sideswipe is a little different though as it is a G2 base correct? or mismatch? as the hole on the roof should have already been there if so.

As I would think they would have mocked up toys that the molds were availible at the time as opposed to something so many years before?.

 

Well, it's a good thing that you don't accept these as real straight off the bat, I suppose if we all got lulled into such a secure and believing state then people COULD pass any old crap off as a handpainted proto. Actually your skepticism does kind of make me realise how happy I was to accept these as 100% authentic without doubt simply because it all came from the same source.

Actually, my Desert camo DC Ramjet is painted over a purple G2 Ramjet, it has a G2 production base. It would have been much later than the G2 Ramjet production toy, the artwork isn't even entirely similar to G2 Ramjet art. So Spriteswipe and Desert Ram are the same in that respect.

I do have one more as well, a G2 Mirage mock-up but that is painted over a G1 production Mirage, of course because there was no newer equivalent to use at that time, Mirage was only done for G1. So fare all 3 of the mock-ups I have, they DID use the most recent version of the available production mould to paint over. Karl Hartman informed me that he wa also aware of an assortment number existing for G2 Mirage, so there must be concept artwork somewhere as well.

I think you have to keep in mind that these mock-ups are the absolute earliest stage of thse concepts. Why spend time and money on producing beautiful prototypes when you can just slap some paint on a production toy to see if it's even WORTH progressing further? That first DC jet, if it really was as sweet as you say, I am almost positive that at some stage there existed a sloppily and quickly painted early concept version.

Finally *deep breath* these toys actually look pretty good in the flesh, they are only sloppy when viewed really closely  
I also saw the other black DC Starscream at BotCon and passed on it because it really didn't look that nice. These are considerably nicer.

All the best
Maz

 

Wasn't one of the Starscream mock ups painted over a G2 Starscream? I seem to remember that.

Cool article Maz! Would you like to write one about officially licensed venezuelan Transformers?

-airfox

 

I am pretty sure they were both G1 SS's Maz?