On Superman? You mean the guy punching spaceships and moving planets? :X

 

Optimus comes back from the dead all the time, yeah, but so do Superman and Son Gokuu.

Superman beats Optimus Prime, Son Gokuu beats both of em.

 

No. Superman would tear him apart.

 

Without kryptonite nothing beats superman. He has no upper limit so whatever optimus in any incarnation could throw at superman he can take in stride.

Though ut optimus could whoop goku's dumb ass because....well...everyone else does.

But superman would win out...especially against goku

 

You have to love casual Transformers fans constantly shitting on their own franchise. Transformers lose to Gundam. Power Rangers. Everything beats Transformers. Uh, no.

Optimus Prime by the end of the Unicron Trilogy matched the power of Master Galvatron. Thanks to retcons of Hasbro's it is canon that 'Tron not only survived years within an energon star but then the collapse of that star into a black hole which immediately devoured Alpha Q's pocket dimension and all its planets. And he used Unicron's essence to form his armor and channel "Sith Lord" lightning. Anyway, that easily puts Master Megatron at the start of Cybertron/Galaxy Force as able to survive solar system level destruction. By the end of the series Prime and Tron both received several power-ups and transformations and that means Optimus is obviously beyond that level of power as well.

Could Optimus beat a Goku or Superman? It depends. At the height of his power Unicron Trilogy Optimus might have a shot against Goku from points in Dragonball Z. Dragonball Super is not happening. Superman is a similar problem. His power fluctuates wildly by era and issue. Optimus would lose to the most powerful versions of Superman, including but not limited to the Pre-Crisis Superman. However Post-Crisis and New 52 and a few others, despite very high-level feats, are possible if we use their most consistent showings.

Power-wise it's a tossup depending on the way you scale Goku and Superman. The thing that really puts things in their favor, though, is speed. Optimus probably has a few faster than light speed feats from flying around in space in the Energon cartoon (I know the Autobots at one point move relativistic fighting Unicron), but in Cybertron his best speed feat was flying Galvatron all the way to a moon from the planet in seconds. Tron himself moved relativistic by flying to Jungle Planet. That's relativistic speed but Goku and Superman have consistently shown to move faster than light. On the other hand, it's (slightly) less unbalanced if Sonic Convoy is used. Wing Saber is easily faster than light and after combing Optimus blitzed and one-shot giant Starscream bad.

But don't downplay Optimus. The Michael Bay version or Transformers Animated wouldn't make it past Mr. Roshi. But remember who Optimus scales to. In Transformers Energon, Megatron casually blew up a planet with his arm cannon so fast most probably missed it by blinking. The scaling is there. It just depends on how much speed factors into the fight. There's also the matter of how useful the Matrix would be to Optimus. The Unicron Trilogy doesn't portray it consistently being used for the same purposes.

The Matrix in Armada allowed Optimus to stop the Earth's destruction from the Hydra Cannon. In Energon it was used once to create an energon weapon. And in Cybertron he used it to aid Vector Prime in containing Megatron within a collapsing dimension. He also used it to reactivate the god Primus in lieu of the fourth cyber planet key and he used it to contain the growth of the Grand Black Hole singularity that canonically was warping the multiverse. The Matrix was also part of Prime's final power up leading to killing Master Galvatron.

It depends on the parameters. But Unicron Trilogy Prime is one of the most powerful versions of big red so far.

 

i don't know what the hell a goku is, but a truck sized robot vs a 6'3 superman seems like it'd be over pretty quick.

 

Thank you bro. This is why I posted this. We are short selling Optimus da Gawd in the UT. He's damn strong. Not as fast but he get's up there.

 

Size isn't really an argument though when Optimus has defeated Devastator. It can be a factor but not here.

 

Transformers fans don't respect their franchise like Marvel and DC nerds do. It makes sense because of the nature of the franchise but it is very tiresome to see people dogpile Transformers on a Transformers forum anytime someone wants to seriously discuss anything.

LOL SCALE DUMB
BECAUSE SELLING TOYS
CARTOON IS COMMERCIAL
GUNDAM BIGGER SO THEY WIN

Should fans take Transformers too seriously? Nah. But the downplay of the power and feats shown over three decades is real.

 

You have to love casual Transformers fans constantly shitting on their own franchise. Transformers lose to Gundam. Power Rangers. Everything beats Transformers. Uh, no.

A couple of quick points...

• I don't know that you could classify anyone that takes the time to post on a franchise specific board a casual fan.
• Not sure what the argument for Gundam or PR is here. Mechs with energy weapons fighting sentient beings...with energy weapons. Regardless of size / power, I'd assume that a pilot couldn't react as quickly as a Cybertronian can think?
• Except Dragonzord, cause Dragonzord.

And on to other things that really don't matter...

Not really a fan of Dragonball past the original planned ending. It all got way to convoluted after Frieza.

But even in the run up to the 'end' you had pre-SSJ characters destroying moons without much effort. It's not a leap to think that nobody had destroyed a planet simply because it didn't make sense to do so.

Frieza basically threw a tantrum and destroyed the planet knowing that he was SOL either way. So...

If you're using that as the measuring stick, Optimus is probably outclassed by the end of the Cell saga. Definitely by the time SSJ3 and a fully powered Gohan exist in universe.

Not to mention the ridiculousness that is Vegitto.

On the DC side if things...

One quote from a recent book sums it up best, but I'll paraphrase because I don't wanna look it up.  

"On a sunny day I can basically do anything."

Sneezed and wiped out a solar system.

Every blow exchanged with Superboy Prime altered reality.

He flew from the Vega system to earth in a matter of minutes. Suggesting travel at a rate thousands of times faster than light.

New 52 Superman benched the equivalent of the entirety of the Earth's weight. Non-stop for five days straight, while deprived of solar radiation. He didn't reach his limit, the machine applying the equivalent resistance did.

And at the end, he'd shed a single drop of sweat. I don't even wanna try to approximate what kind of ORM that would equate to.

There's also the whole containing and supressing a budding singularity in his hands.

I think it's hard to argue that Prime isn't totally out classed here.

 

To be honest I doubt Optimus would want to fight them. He's more of a diplomat so he'd probably be friends with Superman, as both would have a lot in common. Goku on the other hand would probably want to fight him, but his size would probably be a bit of a deterrent, because Goku would not be able to have a hand to hand fight with him due to size. Berus on the other hand...

 

The references to things like Gundam are as a reference to Transformers fans constantly downplaying how powerful Transformers are compared to weaker franchises. This is a Transformers site yet is full of downplay by fans who know little about the overall showings of Transformers characters and almost automatically give other franchises like Gundam the benefit of the doubt in a war simply because of their larger size, which is fallacious.

And you'll notice I said it depends on which versions of Goku and Superman are being used. I do literally explain the scaling for Unicron Trilogy Optimus' power. He's above Super Perfect Cell as demonstrated in his relation to Megatron/Galvatron and their constant power-ups and combinations. Power output and striking force are not as tilted against Optimus' favor as speed is. Goku and Superman have substantial amounts of faster-than-light speed feats and scaling going for them and Optimus doesn't, usually topping out as relativistic speeds without Wing Saber combined.

Planet killing isn't the upper cap of the Transformers by any means, and certainly not for leader characters.

 

Yeah, I'm gonna say Optimus combining with others doesn't really constitute Optimus VS X though.

I wouldn't really consider the Matrix in either scenario either.

It's kind of like pitting Mike Tyson in his prime against Boxcar Willie. But Willie has, say, an Uzi.

In a straight fight Tyson kills Willie. But with a hail of bullets coming at him, Tyson doesn't even touch him.

The scenario is no longer Tyson VS Willie so much as it's Tyson VS Bullets.

I mean, it's kind of a non-point from my perspective as I don't see OP taking either opponent anyway. But that's not so much because I don't buy into the OP hype, but because I just don't...see it.

Granted, this is coming from a guy that, admittedly, isn't a big Dragonball fan and hated the very idea Superman as a kid.

But I also wasn't a big fan of the UT trilogy either. Largely for all the same reasons I soured on DB and hated Superman. So...I dunno.

Superman has done basically everything that OP and Galvatron have in terms of feats of strength / power / physical endurance. Optimus even with Sonic aboard, hasn't done anything to indicate a speed advantage that trumps Superman either.

His speed is actually quantifiable if you really want to do the math based on the Vega to Earth trip.

And Superman, for what it's worth, is the same character year to year regardless of who's writing. So while you can argue one iteration versus the other, you'll still always be left with...Superman.

At the end of the day they all the single greatest power in fiction. The power of, "I'm the protagonist," so...eh. -\('_')/-