Ohhh pulled that old argument. I guess anything will do.

For those who don't know, G1 refers to a large body of work, that includes the original series of course but also BeastWars, Marvel comics, Dreamwave comics and IDW comics; Also games like WFC it's sequel, Devastation, and figure lines like Classics and Generations.

Since the original fans put the money down consistantly they have been rewarded with continual products and development of G1 stories. This all the while change was happening with every new tv series. But even so, every TV series is like an alternate reality of the events of in G1 the most fleshed out and the core of Transformers.

Nobody needs to watch the old 80s cartoon. But the old 80s Movie...I could reccomend the first half, until Starscream dies and then from there it falls apart. But it's REALLY OLD.

You've already had change. It's time to see essential Transformers on screen. Not some dude's interpretation. (Who did things for the sake of realism but put massive pot bellies, hair, beards, mustaches, gold teeth, and other extremely human traits on his uber complicated wrong color and just plain ugly aliens that he called Transformers.)

 

As old as that silly 'if you don't want Transformers that's true to its original form, then go watch something else' argument you put forth.

So you're okay with change, but not too much change that goes beyond your comfort zone?

Lol, essential Transformers.

You change your clothes everyday. Sometimes you have a different haircut. Every so often you repaint your car or remodel your house. Yet after 30 years, advanced robots that can configure themselves into different things remain the same. Are you too blinded by sentimentality to see a problem with that?

A quick Google on the definition of the word transform offers this: "Make a marked change in the form, nature, or appearance of".

So why bother calling it Transformers when they do not ever change their looks, appearances, alternate modes, colors and whatever? Non-transforming Transformers is an oxymoron. It's a waste, because the Transformers' most distinctive ability is not being exploited to its fullest potential.

Consider this scenario - Optimus Prime locates Starscream on an airbase. Starscream flies away. Optimus Prime notices a fighter jet nearby. He thinks of scanning it and becoming a jet so he can pursue Starscream. But he chooses to stay on the ground and let his adversary escape, because fans would be too upset if he ditched the red/blue semi-truck mode.

That's disappointing, because it curtails some possibilities. After SOME progressive, creative and realistic designs in the first two/three movies (TF1/RoTF/DoTM), we're now reverting to the same old and having glorified cartoons. (Note that I use 'some', because I'm certainly excluding the Twins)

I utterly hate the human caricaturish Transformers like the Wreckers, Hound and Drift too. Which I've spoken against very much. It goes against realism and believability. And the same is about to happen with the blocky robots we're about to see.

The colour issue is another pot of idiocy. People cry about Starscream's alien design and bird feet, yet gleefully want him to be a red/white/blue F-22 Raptor, ignorant to the fact that Raptors don't typically use such paint schemes in the real world.

 

At least we agree on something.

 

Just to say, Transformers isn't (and never was) named Transformers because the story, established character looks and traits and continuity can be transformed - it's actually because the toys and characters can transform into something else. Honest.

 

Am fully aware of that. But the movieverse has now established that they have the ability to adopt different modes and reconfigure their looks. That for me, is a great launch point that opens up a whole new world of possibilities - which weren't available, considered or explored in the previous cartoons, comics and whatnot.

It also works from a logic standpoint. No doubt the brand name was chosen for the simple fact a toy car can turn into something resembling a robot via a few flicks of parts. But put that aside and consider it logically - when you can turn into almost anything, it's unlikely you would remain the same thing for perpetuity.

In a live-action, real world movie setting, you'd want some realism and believability involved. And for that, you'd imagine that shapeshifters would capitalise on this ability depending on situation. That is the Transformers' defining characteristic, a unique trait that most other science fiction franchises do not have.

 

I guess that is where I'm stuck in the past - I've just never been a fan of the Movies switching alt modes on the fly magically. It's just more realistic and believable to me that they are physically built to convert into a specific form and that's it: They are stuck with it unless some major operation takes place. There is science to it.
I remember the first Transformer to do this instant scanning (Nightscream in Beast Machines) and a big deal was made of it. I just would have thought the films would have gone for the more realistic approach of original G1.
It's always struck me as strange how they wouldn't do the shrinking Megatron & Soundwave but went for things equally silly (or more so) such as the shrinking Allspark Cube and magically changing car modes on the fly.

 

While we're on it, i just finished watching transformers prime 2 days ago and remember what starscream said to knockout because of this topic. He asked to knockout "of all vehicles, you chose land-based vehicle?". This got me curious, does it imply that they can take any vehicle mode to their liking? Knockout's reason was because the muscle car looks fabulous for him, not because he already had land-based vehicle alt. Mode in cybertron so he had to adapt with similar vehicle.I know this is tf prime's continuity, but while we're on the topic why not?

 

In some continuities they can scan anything they want, in others it has to be a vehicle of similar dimensions, and in some it has to be the same size and function as their cybertronian alt mode.

 

G1 lore, IDW, Dreamwave, etc requires a medbay basically. IDW goes further requiring parts of other Transformers to change the form of locomotion. No scanning on the run. Which makes sense otherwise the logical conclusion is a world of T1000's.

I remember seeing BB scan another car in the movie and being outraged, because why not do that all the time?

 

Because he had to blend in as Sam's car and would most definitely blow Bee's cover if Sam had a new car every day. Plus, why would a Transformer have the desire to change into another form? It's only logical change forms if it no longer serves a purpose. We see that with Laserbeak when he adapts to newer alt modes to better blend into his ever-changing environment.

 

Have you not seen Terminator2?

 

I absolutely despise Bayverse Bumblebee & chicken bug monkey Starscream. Those are my 2 biggest problems with Bay's movies. I was hoping they would drop those designs & do a proper reboot. But unfortunately we still have the robo-baby sucking his pacifier. Battle mask looks cool, but his regular face is ridiculous.

And who the hell wants "cute" Transformers? How did we come to this? This isn't Care Bears for little girls. This is fucking TRANSFORMERS! Based on a BOYS toy line. A WAR between giant violent robots that kick the shit out of each other & blow everything up. Cute has no place here. If you want cute then go collect My Little Pony or Strawberry Shortcake you creampuff.

 

Gee. Its almost as if decades old characters have definitive designs that people recognize and expect to see. Where's muh mohawked-eye-liner wearing, womanizing, leather jacket clad , edgelord Super Man at? Him being a boyscout in red and blue is so uncool and outdated amirite?  

As for bitching about humanizing their faces and how Bay magically transcended that, I call upon Bayverse Hound. He looks like a porky, bearded dwarf from The Hobbit.

 

Wooow.  

 

This scanning ability is like Pandora's Box, once opened, it's hard to go back to before it. Well, for me at least.

The notion of a fixed mode poses a few problems - namely if they had a certain vehicle to turn into, that vehicle may not always be appropriate on a different world/setting. Even as I was watching G1 back as a child, it bothered me that Transformers who were 'made' on Cybertron had Earth-based vehicles, for instance Bumblebee being a Volkswagen Beetle.

Even allowing for the remote possibility that they researched Earth vehicles before building Transformers in their form on Cybertron, what happens say 200 years down the line when Volkswagen Beetles are no longer common on Earth? Bumblebee would lose his ability to blend in with that comtemporary setting.

Here's the part where I feel people are often too constrained in their view of 'Transformers'. Unlike characters such as Superman or the Hulk who are essentially 'humans' that have fixed looks, the Transformers (as established in the movieverse) have this unique ability to scan different vehicles and alter their forms.

For a robotic alien race capable of changing into different things, this makes sense and logic (to me at least). They're made up of morphable parts that can reconfigure to achieve different outcomes. Like Bumblebee turning his arm into a cannon, or Megatron having different looks throughout the first 3 movies.

Now, I hated designs like Hound, Drift, or even the Decepticon gang in The Last Knight.

But examples like Blackout, Brawl, Bonecrusher, Soundwave, and the diverse Constructicons were in my view, realistic, plausible and believable updates on their G1 characters which I felt transcended the franchise from cartoons and comics, to a live action setting. (Note that this applies to the character designs only, and I'm not talking about the overall movie quality)

 

I mentioned there needs to be a convention/rule when it comes to Cybertronians otherwise film-makers can just do whatever they want with them.

I don’t know if I’d be too keen with Optimus being a jet. I guess I could live with it ultimately since I’ve lived with Megatron being a flier in the movies, although Megatron works best as a tank.

It also says a lot that ground-based alt forms could be leaders of all. That means that leader is such a badass that he doesn’t need to be able to fly. They can still fly, but with rocket packs. Not with the feet-mounted rocket packs that Optimus has at the end of AoE. Again, if they’re able to do that, why don’t they all just fly.

Which was one of the sillier aspects of G1, by the way, that at the beginning all of them were capable of flight.

But if they’re able to do that, then why don’t all Cybertronians just transform to jets and be done with it.

another reason why setting up conventions and rules become important.

 

Not when in curtails creativity in the name of familiarity.

 

Totally agreed, it is insane that it is only now we are seeing the balance being redressed and proper respect is being shown to the original iconic G1 show/comics/figures. I for one have never understood why, of all properties brought to the screen, such a famous well-loved brand like Transformers had to be some bizarre experiment. Any complaints were just waved away with 'well Transformers is all about change!' in a cheap attempt to be clever/snarky.

Funny how things have changed now.  

 

True creativity involves making something fresh with the existing rules and tools. Not making whatever you feel like and then calling it Transformers.