I like buying KOs of 3rd party figures, just so someone trying to figure out the ethics involved can burst a blood vessel.

 

I bought MP Smokescreen KO. Read plenty of reviews saying it was great, almost as good as official. Official had long since sold out, and TT tend not to re-issue the second uses of a mold.

KO was shockingly awful quality. Floppy mess. Leg fell off. Feels cheap and dirty and low quality.

Demanded a refund (ebay). Got one and seller never required me to send it back.

So, i glued him up. Covered him in stickers and stood him at the back of my collection. I use him as the guinea pig whenever trying things for the first time (eg future coating).

Would not KO again.

 

"Haha that's just my business buddy, i don't care what you say"

 

"I'm illegal, i don't care".

Sorry, but that's true, better product or not, that's ilegal. And that's the point of my post, not to avoid KOs and talk about morals, but for the people who claim for the better when they do exactly what it's resulting the curse about the official line.

 

Wrong, it's not illegal for me to buy it. That's all that matters. If I break no laws, I couldn't care less.

Has one of these flamebait threads EVER made someone stop buying KO? Raise your hand.

 

I basically agree. I think it's wrong to buy a KO because you want the figure but are not willing to pay the official prices.

However, I have bought KO's and will buy KO's in specific circumstances.

1) replacement parts. If for example the clear pieces on the back of my MP Wheeljack break then I won't spend shitloads of money to buy the original anew. I will buy a KO to get those pars.

2) kitbashing. For example, I have no interest in MP Inferno. Bought him, looked at him, fiddled with the figure, looked at my MMC Backdraft, and sold MP Inferno. But I do want to try (someday) to use a MP Inferno as the basis for a kitbash. I'm not going to buy an expensive official for that, I'll get the cheaper KO so I don't cut up/paint an expensive official figure. And if the KO didn't exist...then I wouldn't have kept the offiical instead: I just wouldn't do this kitbash.

3) variants that don't exist. Tomorrow I'm going to get a package. It contains the oversized MP-11 Thundercracker. I already have the official, regular sized MP Thundercracker plus many other MP Seekers. And if TT had released MP-7 or MP-11 in this size then I wouldn't get the OS KO. But they didn't and I really want a few MP Seekers in this 1:48 scale to put with my Alt?BT collection.


Although I do think buying KO's is morally wrong, in my opinion in these three circumstance I find it justifiable. I'm not taking anything from the official because I either already bought it, I never would've bought it or it simply doesn't exist.

 

Eh. One thing to think about is that folks who buy Masterpiece KO do so because they can't afford the real thing. Meaning, those aren't purchases that were going to be made anyway. Could they save up? Probably. But that also means something else made by TT or Hasbro wouldn't be purchased then either from the diverted funds.

In the case of WeingJang, Hasbro or Takara produce A, these collectors want B, WJ gives them B. HasTak can either produce A and B...or allow B to exist for the niche sales demo that goes out of their way to purchase them. I'd argue that the MMP line is a direct response to WJ...and sales seem to be going very well on those. It's just taking this long for HasTak to come around to catering to the B crowd instead of trying to rely strictly on A appealing to both 6 year-olds and 40 year-olds at the same time (which will certainly continue, all the same...it's just the MMP is a great step in the right direction to combat the WJ crowd).

 

So this isn’t a thread about a knock off third party product named Cicle Jerk?

 

This can only end badly. But here goes.

KOs exist because people can. They've existed since the Chinese invented fireworks, since the Eygptians built their second Pyramid and since somebody other than the Royal Engineers and Benz built the third model of motor car. It's been since commercial Capitalism really got going in the later 18th Century that anyone gave a shit. Because it meant money.

Nobody cares that two different farmers grow the same potatoes. Unless you're Monsanto of course.

Now, applied to "our" hobby what's really being discussed here? That KOs exist and are a bad thing - too bad and best of luck telling almost the entirety of Asia that - or that the several thousand of us making up this Board shouldn't be supporting them?

Because if it's that, pissing in the wind doesn't even come close to describing the futility of it.

Takara Tomy's financial health is a bit more involved than a few thousand people knowing how to wait for somebody, somewhere to steal their IP on a couple of niche product Lines. After All isn't that the guiding premise of so many "experts" on here about how 3P's and KO Makers aren't even a bug on the TT Windshield? That they don't matter or make a dent?

Or do they now. Which is it TFW?

And before anyone wastes my time or yours calling me out on morality, I don't personally buy KOs of pretty much anything - I'm lucky enough and privileged enough not to need to. But like fuck will I get all "moral" about an issue where some have little to no choice. Like about a quarter of the Planet's population when it comes to medicines. Sometimes this Board could do with getting out a bit more.

KO = Bad. For some. Holistic issue? Lots of shades of grey. We get it.

 

Is a thread title about masturbation appropriate on a site about toys?

 

It's not about masterbation, it's about KO cicle jerk. I'm guessing it's some kind of bargain spice from Jamaica.

 

Any thoughts on what you might think of someone copying your parts and selling them for 30% of your price? Would it be worth your time to keep making parts if this happened?

I sure don't think anyone should be telling anyone else how to spend their money but I do think it's ok to talk about the responsibility of our actions. You're 100% free to feel about that however you want and spend your money however you want.

 

I buy both. I will buy the official to support TT's R&D, but will follow up with the purchase of a better quality KO to replace it. Done this in the case of my MP-11s, MP-27 and MP-36.

 

I would be flattered if someone bothered, honestly. And yes, I would keep making new parts because I enjoy it, it's not a giant moneymaker or anything. It's a hobby.

 

We've known since 1985 that KOs are a real threat to the existence of the brand, hence the advent of the rub symbol.

I think the potato and medicine examples are false equivalencies. Do I need to list the reasons why?

You're absolutely free to have opinions about what people should and shouldn't care about but if you want to talk about futility.... sheesh.

 

Lol. Ok.
You're a generous soul.
 

 

Yes I am, just as you are perfectly free to selectively apply your understanding to everything I wrote. And ignore the part were I asked to be spared the moral outrage. Because it's pointless.

They are nothing like false equivalencies, because they arent being used as "what abouts" in any way that relates to what the OP is bunched about and seeking cheers, they are there as a wider example of WHY human nature means you get some people ignoring patents and IP. it's not always for "bad" reasons, but once it exists it will happen for anything that has value.

But do carry on shrugging.

 

I heard somewhere that the same factories that manufacture name brand cereals also manufacture some of the generic branded cereal out there. . .I think it was Bill Nye, the Science Guy who told me that about 25 years ago!

A Google search seems to reinforce this:

10 Cheap Generic Brands That Are Exactly Like the Brand Name | HuffPost

Of course, that's not every generic brand, but. . .

 

Not all cereal because King Vitamin does definitely not taste like Cap'n Crunch.

 

My thoughts on kos.

The good.

for those of us who can't afford mp prices it makes a diffrence they can get that wanted mp that they otherwise would not have got.

It allows for upscaling of characters that need it e.g dinobots.

They often come out way after the first release giving those who missed the boat a chance without after market costs which hastak doesn't see any money from.

The Bad.

They are stealing, it is a counterfet product and it does hurt hastak profits potentially hurting the line.

They can use materials and paints that are not legal for safety reasons.

Most knock offs of mainline use plastic that can easily break and cut e.g aoe dinobots